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sfp/ffp for hunting



and mine

there
another Vortex Viper PST FFP 1/10mil 4-16x review - Sniper's Hide Forums

and here
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f18/vortex-viper-pst-ffp-1-10mil-4-16x-review-58400/


FFP has its place. It all depends on what your needs/wishes are. I like mine and have not had an issue finding the reticle. It is comforting to know when I have a moving coyote I dont need to do mental gymnastics to come up with the proper lead and its relation to the power I have dialed to at the moment.
 
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this is why my gut tells me to stick with a ffp
Trust your gut. ;) If you plan on using the reticle for anything, there's just really no good reason not to get FFP.

If you do a search here there are quite a few threads where most points for/against have been discussed at length. I suggest giving them a read over to help you decide. Without re-hashing everything again, I'll quickly address something you said to start the thread: Anytime you need to use the reticle you'll probably just crank it up to max power so it won't matter.

That is a very good point and is true to some degree. If you're talking about 3-9 or 2.5-10X scopes it's true in pretty much any situation which is why I feel FFP is not as important for those power ranges. I prefer it, but it isn't as big a deal.

But when you're talking about 16, 20, 24X, etc, scopes it becomes less true. There are many situations I run into hunting where that is simply too much power. I just ordered a March 3-24X42. Even if it has the best glass in the world, I don't expect 24X to be very useful in low light conditions. That's just not a reasonable expectation. So when the big fella steps out on the distant hillside in the last couple minutes of shooting light, I'll crank up the power as high as I can to get the best view, but it probably won't be 24X. But with FFP it doesn't have to be—you don't even need to look at the magnification ring to see where you stop because it doesn't matter. Crank it up until it looks good and shoot. Your wind holds will still work just fine.

I shot my buck this year at 540 yds on 20X. He jumped up out of his bed and only went a few yards, but it took a while to get back on him. The FOV on 20X is small and really doesn't give you very good situational awareness. In this case it didn't matter because he was in the middle of a big empty hillside so he had nowhere to go, but had there been cover on the hill he could have disappeared into and where a quick follow-up shot may have been important had I screwed up the first, I wouldn't have shot on 20X. I would have dialed down a ways simply because it would have been the smart thing to do and 20X certainly wasn't needed for the shot. But if doing that meant screwing up my wind hold so I couldn't do it the same way I've been practicing all year long I would have been quite displeased. Which is why I was using a FFP.

As far as them getting too small and being hard to see on low power in low light, it obviously depends on which one you're talking about. Some do, many don't. There are dozens of FFP reticles out there that are more visible at low power than some of the most popular SFP reticles here are. If you're wondering specifically about the PST 4-16 FFP, I used it quite a bit this season hunting in thick brush on 4X until dark. I can tell you from actual experience it's fantastic. The reticle is sized such that it is "OK" for such use without illumination—OK but I've seen better. Turn on the illumination and it goes from OK to excellent. You've got a glowing red cross in the middle of your view—impossible to miss. It's small enough and controllable enough it doesn't wash out the rest of the view (which is a problem with many illuminated scopes, especially some of the more popular SFP here) but bright enough to be seen easily in any low light condition.

Hopefully that helps your decision.
 
Ffp is the way to go if you intend to use the reticule for ranging or aiming off.
I have a couple of S&B with darell Hollands ART reticule installed and MOA turrets.
It's a fool proof system for long range shooting. You don't have to remember power settings in the heat of the moment or be limited due to low light conditions.
FTP scopes are not the best for up close low mag use as the reticule is harder to see but this is LRH we are talking here!!!
 
The Vortex PSTs FFP with the illuminated reticle at the lowest power are very easy to see. Once you set the illumination you only need one click to turn it on and off. I only have had to use the illumination at dusk other than that I don't think you need it once you get used to seeing it when it at the lowest power.

Mine is the Vortex Viper 6-24x50 mm PST FFP which has the illumination and custom turret with the EBR-1 reticle which I think is a much better than a mil-dot. I personally think it is a much better scope than the Leupold FFP for half the price and a better warranty than Leupold also.

Just my .02,

joseph
 
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Here are some pics I took a while back of the PST 4-16 FFP Mil/Mil to give you guys an idea what to expect from the reticle at 4X in low light:


DSC00419.JPG



DSC00426.JPG
 
those pictures look good. im interested to see how reports of the pst's go when they come back out. other than that, i think my next option is to spend twice as much and get an IOR 3-18x42. i cant afford an NXS F1 and from what ive read, i think the IOR is a much better buy than the comparable leupold ER/T.

but if i plan to get a LRF, i guess ffp isnt really an advantage? say i see a deer way off. i dial scope to the appropriate power that i like for that shot. range him with LRF, dial dope in scope and shoot. i did not use the reticle to range or hold on that shot.

i guess i need to decide if i want to spend another $600 on a LRF, then what kind of hunting i will be doing. i really dont do really long range stuff, but would like to start. seems like in long range situations, you would have the time to laser the deer, then dial dope. that actually seems like it would be faster than reading the reticle, reading your ranging card, then dialing dope.
 
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but if i plan to get a LRF, i guess ffp isnt really an advantage? say i see a deer way off. i dial scope to the appropriate power that i like for that shot. range him with LRF, dial dope in scope and shoot. i did not use the reticle to range or hold on that shot.

i guess i need to decide if i want to spend another $600 on a LRF, then what kind of hunting i will be doing. i really dont do really long range stuff, but would like to start. seems like in long range situations, you would have the time to laser the deer, then dial dope. that actually seems like it would be faster than reading the reticle, reading your ranging card, then dialing dope.

Actually if I understand what you are saying I think your reasoning is flawed. With a SFP scope in order for you to range correctly with the hash marks or dots on the reticle you need to be at the particular power for it to range correctly. If you use clicks to adjust for distance you will take precious time while your target may move and change the distance. With a FFP scope that has the reticle+turret and click values all the same you can do all your calculations with any of the 3 systems at any power you choose.

Oh before I forget. If it is snowing or you are in inclement weather your laser rangefinder my not work correctly. Actually with a FFP scope that has a reticule with hash marks or dots that are accurate it is very accurate to range accurately out to 500 + yards.

What I added to my Vortex Viper 6-24x50mm PST FFP MOA scope was to add their Custom Turret programmed in yards to my load. This coordinates the reticule+ clicks+ custom turret all in MOA (yards+1/4 inches). Now all I have to do is use the laser rangefinder for yardage, turn my elevation to the number of yards, hold for wind and shoot. If very little or no wind just range turn turret to yardage and shoot.

Read here this my make my point more clear:

Testing new Vortex custom turret. - Georgia Outdoor News Forum gun)

joseph

PS: Hope I have helped.
 
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