Semi custom vs factory

[ATH]

Why not use a R700 action? Yes affordable customs are now available but at about double the price of a donor action.

I've got half a dozen "semi custom" rifles built off R700 donor actions and McGowen prefits. I'm wholeheartely happy with them. Do you really think perhaps a .1 MOA accuracy increase is going to make a difference in a hunting rifle?

My most accurate rifle, judged by average group size, is my F-Class 284Win Kelbly Panda action, Bartlein barrel. Virtually tying it is my 338 Edge, custom action with McGowen barrel. Virtually tied with that is a Savage 20 Practical with McGowen barrel. I have a number of other Savage (243AI) and R700 (6.5-06Ai, 6x45) based rifles really, really close in group size to the point it makes zero difference in a hunting rifle. I have ZERO regrets using R700 donors. I have a few extra rifle options because each one was a bit cheaper.

 

[Rotten]

It all depends on how much bains you have compared to how much money you have.
You can buy a 500 thousand dollar CNC lathe that doesn't mean you know how to program it.

 

[southpa]

It's hard for me to read on a long range hunting forum that some guys still recommend factory rifles and factory ammo.
Yes build your custom/semi custom rifle. Have it built off a donor action, have it built off a custom action...it really makes no difference. I have multiple 700 builds and do not and have never regretted a single one of them. They all shoot as good as any custom action. It's not the action it's how it's all put together. Find you a reputable smith and do it. As many have mentioned, you probly won't regret it.
I think all the hogwash about hunting for years before you decide what route to go is nonsense. Carbon fill stock, carbon wrapped barrel and whatever action and chambering you fancy. It will likely end up around 9ish pounds and will be balanced and lovely to shoot. Don't make it too hard on your brain.

 

[Mtn Dawg]

Lots of great thoughts and recomendations here. As with most things the devil is in the details. How much time do you realistically have for this? Even going semi custom leads to so many different trails it will start to consume your life. The problem with most factory rifles is that the stock doesn't have proper ergonomics for precision positional shooting. And it's plastic, hollow and loud if you tap it. This has a huge effect on your accuracy potential if you are shooting beyond 100 yards in typical mountainous field situations. Getting solid in your rest and position is the most important aspect in a hunting rifle. You can't do that well with most factory stocks. And the fat vertical grips in many custom stocks really suck to carry. So you have to shoot a few before you find what works for you. What animals are you hunting and which bullet do you want to shoot? The bullet is the next most important thing. Until you figure out your rifle and caliber don't add in the extra learning curve with hand loading. Therefor factory ammo equals less messing around, more time to become a better shooter and less expense. If shooting a mono, velocity is critical. More is better. Smaller calibers shoot factory monos faster than large. Smaller calibers are so much easier to shoot as well. Think seriously about shooting without a brake or a suppressor at first. Brakes are hard on your (and others ) hearing even with great hearing pro. Is hunting with hearing pro really feasible? Depends on your situation. So another nod to reasonable smaller calibers that are easier to shoot. My vote is tikka T3x stainless in .270 win or 6.5prc or (30.06 if not shooting monos). $750-$800 retail. Reliable 1 moa accuracy out of the box Really good factory ammo available for all of these for reasonable prices. Stock up on what you like for hunting and practice with cheaper target ammo that you get on sale. Replace the stock with a Peak 44 black tooth or bastion stock. $800 and drop in fit. Best performance, easy to get, reasonable price, drop in ready stock for tikka. Unknown munitions direct mount rings for your scope $130. Scope of choice. You do not need high magnification for hunting. It will cause more trouble than it helps. You are in same territory as Seekins now but your platform is more customizable as you learn and grow in shooting. Bonus for Tikka: bolt locks down on safe. If you ever shoulder carry or strap your rifle to a pack you will understand. All you have to do with a Remington pattern action is drop the bolt handle unknowingly and your round out of the chamber and you will get this. Second bonus: tikka has smoothest and shortest (70 degrees vs 90….. yes it makes a difference in handling ) among affordable actions. Third bonus: you can rebarrel with a stainless pre fit barrel of you caliber choice for $500 plus gunsmith fees or purchase of barrel vice, action wrench and headspace gauge when you have figured out your preference on things. Or up charge to custom barrel throated for the bullets you want when you are ready to hand load. Thanks for reading my novel!!! Good luck !

 

[highfinblue]

I have a custom built by Ryan Pierce that will outshoot every other rifle I have, that being said I can hit what I'm shooting at beyond 500 yards with several factory rifles and my handloads; it's doable, glass is critical. You can't hit what you can't see, and high magnification helps me tremendously at distance, even hunting. Not everywhere I hunt is at distance, but I also hunt places the closest target will be 450, and it stretches past 1300 from there. A couple of the guys shoot custom Bruce Baer 338-378 Weatherbys, and 1300 is in their effective range, it's outside of mine with a 28 Nosler. You just have to figure out what you want to do, because the outer limits are impressive in long range hunting.

 

[Mtn Dawg]

My setup: 3 years ago decided to get more serious about my shooting. I'm primarily a hunter. I live in a Colorado mountain town I wanted a 280AI. I wanted to shoot Hammer mono bullets. Denton Nielsen put together a T3x with a 22" number three stainless 5R barrel, saami chamber, bedded bell and Carlson stock, cerakoted, mountain tactical bottom metal and magazine for $2100. No brake, no suppressor. I've since upgraded to an Alterra Arms stock. Night and day different in shooting performance between the two stocks for me but the B&c ain't bad if you have to settle ( anything but that garbage tikka stock that kicks the daylights out of you). Tract toric 2-10x44 scope bdc reticle with tall turret installed if I want to dial, sportsmatch direct mount rings. I now hand load the 143 Hammer Hunter bullets. I started shooting out to 400 yards this summer. 1-3/4 3 shot group at 400 yards. First shot as centered on the bullseye as you can get. Based on that drop I'm around 3100 fps velocity. @500 yards it's still going 2300-2400 and, if energy matters to you, 1800 foot lbs. last year I shot a Muley buck at about 40-50 yards up hill and slightly quartering too. At the shot, He stiffened, paused and just fell right over. Stone cold dead never even a twitch. I've killed with high shoulder, cns type shots before but even though they drop on the spot they are usually still alive to some degree. That shot blew his heart and aorta and front of the lungs and exited with1-1/2" hole. The petals must have hit his spinal cord. It was like an off switch. My rig weighs 8lbs 5oz. Does everything I need. I've since bought more tikka actions and messed around with switching barrels/calibers

 

[highfinblue]

My setup: 3 years ago decided to get more serious about my shooting. I'm primarily a hunter. I live in a Colorado mountain town I wanted a 280AI. I wanted to shoot Hammer mono bullets. Denton Nielsen put together a T3x with a 22" number three stainless 5R barrel, saami chamber, bedded bell and Carlson stock, cerakoted, mountain tactical bottom metal and magazine for $2100. No brake, no suppressor. I've since upgraded to an Alterra Arms stock. Night and day different in shooting performance between the two stocks for me but the B&c ain't bad if you have to settle ( anything but that garbage tikka stock that kicks the daylights out of you). Tract toric 2-10x44 scope bdc reticle with tall turret installed if I want to dial, sportsmatch direct mount rings. I now hand load the 143 Hammer Hunter bullets. I started shooting out to 400 yards this summer. 1-3/4 3 shot group at 400 yards. First shot as centered on the bullseye as you can get. Based on that drop I'm around 3100 fps velocity. @500 yards it's still going 2300-2400 and, if energy matters to you, 1800 foot lbs. last year I shot a Muley buck at about 40-50 yards up hill and slightly quartering too. At the shot, He stiffened, paused and just fell right over. Stone cold dead never even a twitch. I've killed with high shoulder, cns type shots before but even though they drop on the spot they are usually still alive to some degree. That shot blew his heart and aorta and front of the lungs and exited with1-1/2" hole. The petals must have hit his spinal cord. It was like an off switch. My rig weighs 8lbs 5oz. Does everything I need. I've since bought more tikka actions and messed around with switching barrels/calibers

I currently don't own any Tikkas, but I've had a couple in the past and they are fine rifles for the money. I'm left handed so buying factory and in the cartridge I want is a challenge, but a friend has located a great gs a few hours west of us, so I may be selling and swapping out some stuff to have him make me a few builds off that action. Appreciate all the good info.

 

[Mtn Dawg]

I have a custom built by Ryan Pierce that will outshoot every other rifle I have, that being said I can hit what I'm shooting at beyond 500 yards with several factory rifles and my handloads; it's doable, glass is critical. You can't hit what you can't see, and high magnification helps me tremendously at distance, even hunting. Not everywhere I hunt is at distance, but I also hunt places the closest target will be 450, and it stretches past 1300 from there. A couple of the guys shoot custom Bruce Baer 338-378 Weatherbys, and 1300 is in their effective range, it's outside of mine with a 28 Nosler. You just have to figure out what you want to do, because the outer limits are impressive in long range hunting.

@highfinblue all very true. Eventually even a novice will get there, which I think the OP is, based on his questions. Most novices won't be well served by immediately spending $4000 plus and going down a rabbit hole he doesn't have any idea about on something until they get some experience and figure out what is what and such. I'm talking reticle, dialing verses holding, spotting your shot, how far you are comfortable or capable of shooting at game etc. Over magnification can hurt a guy like that until he learns to shoot. Money isn't everything of course but no point in wasting it on things that you wont like or that don't actually work for your personal situation/approach. All IMO of course since I'm still going through it myself

 

[highfinblue]

@highfinblue all very true. Eventually even a novice will get there, which I think the OP is, based on his questions. Most novices won't be well served by immediately spending $4000 plus and going down a rabbit hole he doesn't have any idea about on something until they get some experience and figure out what is what and such. I'm talking reticle, dialing verses holding, spotting your shot, how far you are comfortable or capable of shooting at game etc. Over magnification can hurt a guy like that until he learns to shoot. Money isn't everything of course but no point in wasting it on things that you wont like or that don't actually work for your personal situation/approach. All IMO of course since I'm still going through it myself

It's been a 25-30 year process for me

 

[OG10]

If you have a Remington 700 action there's nothing wrong with using that I have several and they all shoot extremely well .Now custom semi custom we all know it's not necessary to have a custom or semi custom rifle to kill an elk ,but if that's what you want life's too short as they say .The whole idea for me when building a custom is to get exactly what I want ,like the type of stock ,weight ,caliber barrel length you name it you pick it . however there are some semi customs out there that you can do yourself such as a Tikka buy the base rifle T3 CTR varmint etc. add to stock you like add the scope you like rings and bases you like and make it semi custom on our own extremely doable and easy or you can go with a pre-built semi custom by take your pic and get what they think you want or you can build a custom nowadays using custom action pre-fits in stock of your choice it really depends what you're looking for when I have a custom built there's a specific purpose for that rifle, like having more than one screwdriver in your toolbox same concept, good luck which ever way you choose enjoy the ride.PS my user photo was shot with a factory Remington 700 with three different five shot groups the far left 168 hollowpoint boattail match ,the middle 168 Amax and the far right 168 ELDM .3 different factory loads one factory rifle five shot groups at 100 yards .

 

[med358-boise]

Just food for thought:

1. Military snipers essentially use "high end" "factory" rifles combined with "high quality" factory ammuniton for a combined accuracy specification of ~ 1 MOA. Effective hunting range of a 308 win is ~600 to ~900 yards depending on the bullets minimum impact velocity.

2. Assuming you possess a rifle and a supporting optic which consistently shoots sub MOA (let's call it a .66 rifle), the biggest issue is going to be your ability to judge the wind. Here are the calculations for a 700 yards shot on a deer with a 10" kill zone. Miss judging the average speed of a full value wind as 6 mph vs 8 mph on a will result between 6 to 8 inches of error based on cartridge and bullet selection. Most crosshairs are approximately .25 MOA, so if your hold is 1 crosshair width off we just "ate-up" 1.75 inches add to that 1/2 of the expected shot dispersion which is 2.31 inches add to that the minimum estimated wind of 6 inches and what was a near perfect hold and the shot is now 5 inches outside the vitals.

Not a big fan of cliches but as the saying goes - "It's not the plane, it's the pilot" and "It's not the rifle, it's the rifleman".

We all often fall into the rabbit hole of equipment evaluation, myself included - I am guilty as charged.

 

[Wilderness Blacktail]

I

The real justification for a custom is you simply want one because factory rifles are so dang accurate these days.

I would buy a Tikka T3 Superlite in 7mm-08, have it rechambered to 284 win, change out the bolt stop and by the standard length magazine and you have a sweet rifle.

I put a long throat 284 win Preferred Barrel 22" SS , 8twist T3 contour on a T3X. Swapped the bolt stop and the mag to factory LA Sweet rifle! I put a Stockys carbon fiber stock on it and curved bolt handle and carbon round knob.

SWEET rifle. Highly reccomend something like it for a mtn rifle.

 

[med358-boise]

Doesn't it suck when you shoot a great group on some funky portion of a target when you are just working thru your zeroing process for a new scope

 

[med358-boise]

I

I put a long throat 284 win Preferred Barrel 22" SS , 8twist T3 contour on a T3X. Swapped the bolt stop and the mag to factory LA Sweet rifle! I put a Stockys carbon fiber stock on it and curved bolt handle and carbon round knob.

SWEET rifle. Highly reccomend something like it for a mtn rifle.

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