Primer Pocket Restoration

[Pdvdh]

You identify issues and details that highlight the folly of a blanket yes or no response, without condition. Yet what you've provided is a flat out "no, it's not possible" response.

Who said anything about restoring a primer pocket to its original glory condition? You really think that's what the OP was thinking or expecting?

I've gone back and read the initial post. He looking for options other than your recommended practice and preference of sending used casings to the local solid waste disposal facility. I understand your preference. Your posts also communicate you have little, to no, experience tightening primer pockets, and limited understanding about what's possible and what's not.

Here's a test: What happens if one swages down the ID of the primer pocket diameter excessively, and then uses a carbide primer pocket uniforming tool to cut away the excess brass to return the ID to ideal inner dimensions?
And the answer is..., you have no idea, because you've never done it. You have opinion and preference and a belief that you know the value, benefit, and result. When the reality is you can't know, because you've never contemplated doing it, let alone actually done it. Why are you pretending to be all-knowing? Is that your common practice?

And to think my bolt faces are still free of gas torch cutting. Aren't you the member that cites lack of funds for lack of follow-thru on rifle build projects? Now I understand at least a portion of the cause/problem.

Amazing what can be learned and accomplished thru some straightforward, first-hand experience. I suppose that's why it's called "first-hand experience" in the first place.

Open minds can learn. Closed minds... Maybe...maybe not.

 

[Pdvdh]

phorwath

Use the ball bearing method on a few cases and then use a crimp reamer or a swage and then see if the primer is still loose.

I have and its not a theory or wishful thinking, so grow up and stop your insults.

If you read my prior post, you'll understand I've done that, and more, with completely satisfactory and successful results.

You understand you've crushed my ego with superior intelligence, and lack of experience, on this topic. Thanks for finally sharing to having at least limited hand's-on experience. Now I can begin to understand your poor results and flawed conclusions. You may simply lack the skilz to get it right. Yeah. Upon reconsideration, I'm all better now. Because of the numerous salvaged primer pockets and casings in my reloading room. Something tangible, compared to your imagination. If I accepted a small percentage of what you post as based on legitimate experience, I'd be similarly handicapped.

This is when you provide further examples of superior knowledge. No hurry. Take all the time necessary... Ready, set, go!

 

[Rich Coyle]

bigedp51,
You seem to be the one insulting with your lack of experience and using theory in stead of a real life solution. Obviously phorwath is "restoring" his primer pockets enough to use them a couple more times. When I couldn't get RUM brass I used nail polish to keep primers in place.

If I had "chunked" them, as you do, because they were too loose, I would not have been able to go out of state with my ammo and take a pronghorn and three deer that year. It was not because I couldn't afford them, it was because I couldn't find any. Just like when I could no longer get 9.3X64 Brenneke brass for my 6.5 Coyle. I turned the belts off Normal 7 Rem Mag brass and used them. Loaders do what loaders have to do to carry on.

 

[bigedp51]

Obviously phorwath is "restoring" his primer pockets enough to use them a couple more times.

A hammer, a bolt and a ball bearing "restoring" a loose over sized primer pocket.

Its amazing what a person can do when their hairy knuckles are dragging on the ground.

Place your finger on your reloading bench, then place a ball bearing on this finger.

Now hit the ball bearing with a hammer and see if your finger gets smaller.

Then go to the Doctors and let him put a band aid on your finger and "restore" it.

All you are doing is crimping the mouth of the primer pocket and then squeezing a primer past the crimp.

And the primer pocket is still larger than the primer, and you call it restored. Yeah right.

 

[Pdvdh]

A hammer, a bolt and a ball bearing "restoring" a loose over sized primer pocket.

Its amazing what a person can do when their hairy knuckles are dragging on the ground.

Place your finger on your reloading bench, then place a ball bearing on this finger.

Now hit the ball bearing with a hammer and see if your finger gets smaller.

Then go to the Doctors and let him put a band aid on your finger and "restore" it.

All you are doing is crimping the mouth of the primer pocket and then squeezing a primer past the crimp.

And the primer pocket is still larger than the primer, and you call it restored. Yeah right.

How did I know? No surprises from you. The exact path you travelled in the past where you were insistent that everyone measure case web expansion with a 0.0001" capable tool. Yet unable to explain why anyone monitoring case web expansion needs the detection level. No matter. EVERYONE needs it because you have that opinion. Poor soul... Even draw from the same pool of cartoon characters. That confirms it! You must be a smart fella.

I didn't even read your post word by word. Didn't have to. You're the record that skips repeatedly, and monotonously.

I predicted you lacked skilz. Now you confirm it.

Wouldn't want you to hurt your lil'pinky finger with the big, bad hammer. Oh my God! Did I say hammer? Isn't that a dangerous tool, in your hands?

 

[bigedp51]

Now read the links below and see all the other non-believers who say the best place for loose primer pockets is in the trash can. What names are you going to call them or are all of these reloaders a skipping record also.

Lets see two of the links below are from accurateshooter.com, one is from benchrest central and one from the hard nose snipers hide.

Swage press to tighten primer pockets
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/swage-press-to-tighten-primer-pockets.3788085/

Tighten up loose primer pockets
http://benchrest.com/showthread.php?81034-Tighten-up-loose-primer-pockets

Tired of loose pockets? I WAS but not no more!
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/tired-of-loose-pockets-i-was-but-not-no-more.3862744/

Simple fix for loose primer pockets...
http://forum.snipershide.com/threads/simple-fix-for-loose-primer-pockets.233637/

And before I forget you need to write Hodgdon's and tell them they don't know what they are talking about......................because you are such a expert.

Simple Trick for Monitoring Pressure of Your Rifle Reloads
http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/rel...-trick-monitoring-pressure-your-rifle-reloads

 

[Pdvdh]

Did I call you a name that hurt your feelings? I don't normally. Maybe it was the comment about the skipping record. Best thing about a skipping record is no one listens to them.

First your source of experts was the looney tune cartoons. Now your expertise is Google. You ever think for yourself?

Case web swelling at 0.0005" is the beginning of significant pressure caused expansion on the first firing on the case. 0.0001" is insignificant. Yet you insist everyone needs a 0.0001" accurate measuring instrument to monitor case web swell for evidence of excessive cartridge case pressure. You have no explanation, and the reason is now ever so clear. Hodgdon never explained why, and you never thought to question the basis for their statement. Hodgdon does your thinking. So invite your Hodgdon expert to the Forum. Let Hodgdon explain on your behalf, what you're unable to explain yourself. That would be a real treat. I look forward to it.

When Hodgdon fails, get back on Google and find a post from a Hide expert. Let the Hide expert explain on your behalf. Last I knew, any Hide member that posted a group size consisting of less than ten shots on target was automatically banned from the Forum. A lot of wisdom there. They walk on water at the Hide, in their own minds. When your Hide expert fails, try the experts at CNN. The mother of all fake news. And when they fail, begin thinking for yourself.

 

[Rich Coyle]

Now read the links below and see all the other non-believers who say the best place for loose primer pockets is in the trash can. What names are you going to call them or are all of these reloaders a skipping record also.

Lets see two of the links below are from accurateshooter.com, one is from benchrest central and one from the hard nose snipers hide.

Swage press to tighten primer pockets
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/swage-press-to-tighten-primer-pockets.3788085/

Tighten up loose primer pockets
http://benchrest.com/showthread.php?81034-Tighten-up-loose-primer-pockets

Tired of loose pockets? I WAS but not no more!
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/tired-of-loose-pockets-i-was-but-not-no-more.3862744/

Simple fix for loose primer pockets...
http://forum.snipershide.com/threads/simple-fix-for-loose-primer-pockets.233637/

And before I forget you need to write Hodgdon's and tell them they don't know what they are talking about......................because you are such a expert.

Simple Trick for Monitoring Pressure of Your Rifle Reloads
http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/rel...-trick-monitoring-pressure-your-rifle-reloads

In logic what you are doing is appealing to the group (or something like that) to show you are correct without giving any new info. You want us to use the same term you are: Restoring the primer pocket instead; of getting a couple more firings.

 

[Black Tail Hunter]

Is anyone aware of a tool that can be used to restore primer pockets after they have become too loose?

Was the question asked by OP.
It is a shame that this thread which was nothing more than a request for information regarding a tool, not the validity of a process has turned into a ****ing match because people have interjected their opinion of the process which was never part of the question.
Had the OP asked " hey, is it a good idea to tighten up primer pockets?" the story would be different. He has obviously in his mind determined (as many others have) that the process is worth pursuing which is solely a personal choice, and simply wanted to know which tool people are using to do it.
There are plenty of crap forums on the web where a guy can read the type of BS going on here, it would be nice if people wouldn't lose focus, or assume the OP isn't intelligent enough to have already contemplated the safety or validity of what he has already decided to pursue and just stick to the subject matter.

 

[Rich Coyle]

How does one have a double like on this thread?

 

[Edd]

I have an idea. I don't know if it will work because I haven't tried it. It would be fun to try even if it doesn't work.

Buy a 300 H&H sizing die. Cut the threaded end off of the die. Now that you have both ends open, very carefully measure the ID and find the place where the ID is about .470", or whatever size you desire, and either drill out or cut off the die at that spot. Now you can screw that die stub in your press, find a good 7/16" pin of the correct length, and push your cases thru the stub.

 

[Pdvdh]

The questions asked by the OP:
Is anyone aware of a tool that can be used to restore primer pockets after they have become too loose?

It is a shame that this thread which was nothing more than a request for information regarding a tool, not the validity of a process has turned into a ****ing match because people have interjected their opinion of the process which was never part of the question.

Exactly. Opinions serve their purpose. Opinions are the very foundation of this Forum, and members are relatively free to express theirs. However it's healthy to recognize opinions that have been disguised as facts. And to recognize when they were never solicited in the first place, but rather imposed. As mentioned previously, everyone's opinions are correct, regardless of the experience - or lack thereof - that they're based on. Which speaks very clearly to their soundness and value, or lack thereof.
*****************************
Skilz, experience, primer pocket restoration, providing extended cartridge case life:

*****************************
Lack of skilz and experience:
It's my obligation to give bigedp51 full credit for this one, where credit is due.

*****************************
More skilz, more experience, more primer pocket restoration for continued case life:

*****************************
And for the crescendo: This one could really hurt...

My 0.001" digital caliper provides discrete readings to 0.0005". My 0.001" dial caliper can define case web dimensional change to less than 0.0005, with a skilled operator. The expert, Hodgdon, holds and prints the opinion one "must" employ a tool accurate to 0.0001". Of course bigedp51 agrees with Hodgdon, because they think on his behalf. Does anyone know anyone that's concerned with 0.0001" pressure caused case web expansion? Such that we need to measure accurately to less than 0.0001"? How is less than 0.0001" better, when the case head and case web manufactured tolerances exceed 0.0001" before the first firing?

So I invite you again bigedp51, have your expert explain the inexplicable.

While you're at it, ask your additional experts to explain the impossibilities of primer pocket restoration. And to be extra clear, I am not soliciting their preference and opinion on the practice. Which in this day and age is more than often based on nothing more than your mere Google searches. Whatchamacallit posted this over there at one time or another. I research it using the Google search function. If Google led me to it, it must be true. Because...

 

[Pdvdh]

I have an idea. I don't know if it will work because I haven't tried it. It would be fun to try even if it doesn't work.

Buy a 300 H&H sizing die. Cut the threaded end off of the die. Now that you have both ends open, very carefully measure the ID and find the place where the ID is about .470", or whatever size you desire, and either drill out or cut off the die at that spot. Now you can screw that die stub in your press, find a good 7/16" pin of the correct length, and push your cases thru the stub.

That's a good thought. A tool for using of this process is manufactured and sold by Lee (Reloading Die and Tool company) to remove case web bulges from semi-auto pistol cartridges (non-rimmed, non-belted pistol cases), which commonly form forward of the extractor grooves. I've used the Lee tool on 40S&W cases, and 10mm Auto cases. It works so-so. It could work better if the entrance to the mouth of their die had a lesser angle of approach. Their die tends to collect brass at the leading edge of the bulge and shear it down toward the extractor groove.

Now for the guessing. The coulds, mays, mights, and maybes...
My guess, based on that experience, is that it would require a stronger, thick-walled resizing die to withstand the expansion forces imposed on the die body. It might also require a press more on the order of a bullet manufacturing press to ensure longevity, like Corbin manufactures and sells. And it may be prone to shearing brass where high compression forces exist below the case web. A shallow entrance angle at the mouth of the die might prevent that shearing. But even then, it could require some machining cleanup of the extractor groove and case rim. But here's the biggest impediment I foresee... The extractor groove at the case head surrounds the primer pocket. This means the swage die would have nothing more than that air gap to press against, right where the maximum compression force is required to reduce the primer pocket diameter. How to overcome that, I know not...

 

[bigedp51]

Brilliant skilz at over flaring the mouth of the primer pocket below and leaving more of the rounded edge of the primer unsupported.

Now show us your weakened mushroom shaped fired primers.

I picked up a .223 case at the range with a flared primer pocket like yours and it looked like the .223 case had a large rifle primer in it. You "may" be restoring primer pockets but you are leaving the top of the primer unsupported. And this can cause the primer to let go at this point and etch the bolt face. Brilliant skilz at deforming primer pockets.