New Mexico bans the use of scopes

[ENCORE]

Exactly. You saved me some typing. Take away that nightforce scope and replace it with a dovetail and post and let's see that 800 yard shot!

Back in June, the 11th and 12th to be precise, modern inline rifles were invited to Camp Atterbury to shoot along with side hammers using black powder. The modern inline rifles were allowed to use UP TO 120grs VOLUME of BH209 or, BP and/or any other substitute. They were also allowed to use scopes.

The ranges shot were 800yds, 900yds and 1,000yds. I can tell you for fact, those boys using side hammers with open sights, can put it on target at each range. Never underestimate what some can do with open sights. Granted, 95% have no business shooting beyond 100yds.

 

[Clem Bronkoski]

No. the challenge was to find a muzzle loader from 150 years ago that would hang with a newer GW one. the Whitworth is that gun. And I by no means consider anything GW builds as run of the mill.

I know a gentleman that can hit a target at 600 yards almost every time and has already hit targets at 1200 yards with a percussion rifle. This rifle has a standard Thompson Center Renegade stock, a Rice barrel with, I believe, a 1:20 twist and Lee Shaver vernier rear and globe front sights. He shoots large home cast conical bullets

 

[Troutslayer2]

That's a gun and bullet issue, not a scope issue, I can mount a Nightforce to a caplock and while it would help me more accurately place shots it isn't going to extend my range by a whole ton compared to smokeless powders and high BC bullets. Removing the scope somewhat limits those Gunwerks rifles from say 800 to 3 or 400 yards

How many people are there who can shoot an elk at 400 yards with open sights? Can't be that many.

 

[Rick Richard]

How many people are there who can shoot an elk at 400 yards with open sights? Can't be that many.

I would not even think it.

 

[biednick]

How many people are there who can shoot an elk at 400 yards with open sights? Can't be that many.

Are there many non- smokeless muzzleloaders that are effective 400 yard elk guns?

 

[CMP70306]

How many people are there who can shoot an elk at 400 yards with open sights? Can't be that many.

How many can shoot them at 800 with a scoped muzzleloader? Guys shoot to 1000 yards with irons all the time so the same guy that can do it at 800 with a scope will find a way to do it at 400 with irons if thousands to tens of thousands of dollars are on the line.

 

[Wedgy]

Are there many non- smokeless muzzleloaders that are effective 400 yard elk guns?

My CVA Paramount Pro sends the 330 Powerbelt ELR at 2,680 fps with Blackhorn 209 and I wouldn't hesitate to shoot an elk at 400 yards with it using a scope. I took a huge mule deer at 290 yards and I was struggling to see him thru the front hood sight. If I had a front post with no ring around it I think I could do it.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Funny all the "I know a guy" comments. Let's talk about the vast majority of hunters, not the .1% guys. Yeah, there was a guy in 1492 that shot 5000 yards…how about we talk about the typical guy with a typical muzzle loader. Take away a scope and you're cut MER in half, maybe more. Pretty simple.


I guess most of you guys didn't see what Utah is doing. I can't wait to hear all the crying about that!!!!

 

[asd9055]

I don't have a muzleloader though I hope to have one some day and hunt with it. In some states it is classified as a "primitive weapon hunt" along with bows. They get to hunt before the regular season. Now I can't think of a "primitive weapon" with a scope. Some times, us hunters, are given an inch and take a yard. If you want to hunt before the rifle season opens, I can't see why we couldn't have these restrictions. I know many will disagree, just my opinion.

 

[PBramble]

Funny all the "I know a guy" comments. Let's talk about the vast majority of hunters, not the .1% guys. Yeah, there was a guy in 1492 that shot 5000 yards…how about we talk about the typical guy with a typical muzzle loader. Take away a scope and you're cut MER in half, maybe more. Pretty simple.


I guess most of you guys didn't see what Utah is doing. I can't wait to hear all the crying about that!!!!

Hell, the typical muzzleloader hunter can barely hit an 8 inch target at a 100 yards 10 times in a row with a scope. I can't imagine how many wounded animals will be left to run off without one. If you think they won't shoot cause it's too far, you underestimate the stupidity of most people. But seriously, I don't care what NM or Utah are doing, never going to hunt there anyway. Most of the western states are messing with their money with all the tag regulations and resident restrictions.

 

[Ucsdryder]

But seriously, I don't care what NM or Utah are doing, never going to hunt there anyway. Most of the western states are messing with their money with all the tag regulations and resident restrictions.

I wish more people felt the same way!

 

[Tac-O]

Utah has not planned to change any ML season scope laws. There has been discussion of it, but there always is. The rule on scopes in Utah has changed several times over the years. There isn't any official plan to change it, for now

 

[CMP70306]

Funny all the "I know a guy" comments. Let's talk about the vast majority of hunters, not the .1% guys. Yeah, there was a guy in 1492 that shot 5000 yards…how about we talk about the typical guy with a typical muzzle loader. Take away a scope and you're cut MER in half, maybe more. Pretty simple.


I guess most of you guys didn't see what Utah is doing. I can't wait to hear all the crying about that!!!!

The vast majority of hunters are using a scoped T/C, Traditions or CVA break action inline and shooting animals well under 200 yards. A 300 yard shot to them is unthinkable with a rifle let alone a muzzleloader. They already aren't shooting that far and all removing scopes is doing is making their shots even at close range that much less precise in poor lighting.


You were the one who brought up people shooting animals at 800 yards on the first page of this thread.

GOOD! muzzle loader is supposed to be a PRIMITIVE weapon. We've basically turned them into single shot rifles capable of 800 yards. If you want to shoot 800 get a rifle tag. If you want to shoot a primitive weapon (usually during better dates, like the rut) then use a primitive weapon. I don't see how someone wouldn't support this. Colorado has it right with their ML regulations.

 

[Ucsdryder]

The vast majority of hunters are using a scoped T/C, Traditions or CVA break action inline and shooting animals well under 200 yards. A 300 yard shot to them is unthinkable with a rifle let alone a muzzleloader. They already aren't shooting that far and all removing scopes is doing is making their shots even at close range that much less precise in poor lighting.


You were the one who brought up people shooting animals at 800 yards on the first page of this thread.

So you're saying it'll limit distance?