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Deleted member 103481
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Weird, I was under the impression proofs were known for their lack of mirage compared to something like hellscanyons carbon wrap.
Lightweight steel vs carbon fiber barrels
- Thread starter packgoatguy
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Country Bumpkin
Well-Known Member
Everyone keeps talking about the 1-2 shots that we expect to take when killing an animal. Yes, I agree, that's the goal....
We are also talking about semi-long range hunting with light rifles. So pushing the boundaries of equipment with rifles that are inherently difficult to shoot accurately/consistently because of their lack of mass.
With that, I opted for a Proof CF barrel because I wanted to be able to practice a lot with it to ensure I'm proficient and confudtnt to take those one-shot kills we strive for.
Ever taken a magnum rifle with a pencil barrel to the range for practice.....? it takes HOURS to shoot enough to get a reasonable session.
A Proof barrel allows for "almost-as-light" 1-shot performance as a pencil barrel but has the added benefit of longer consistent strings when practicing.
We are also talking about semi-long range hunting with light rifles. So pushing the boundaries of equipment with rifles that are inherently difficult to shoot accurately/consistently because of their lack of mass.
With that, I opted for a Proof CF barrel because I wanted to be able to practice a lot with it to ensure I'm proficient and confudtnt to take those one-shot kills we strive for.
Ever taken a magnum rifle with a pencil barrel to the range for practice.....? it takes HOURS to shoot enough to get a reasonable session.
A Proof barrel allows for "almost-as-light" 1-shot performance as a pencil barrel but has the added benefit of longer consistent strings when practicing.
aaronoto
Member
I'm running a 20" Proof carbon on a .308 that I built up. The sole reason for using carbon fiber was the weight savings while being able to swap it into a heavy chassis during the off season and shoot a few matches - a true "do it all" gun so to speak.
Would I use a Proof again for weight savings alone on a dedicated hunting rig? Probably not. So far the carbon barrel has lived up to the claims though.
Would I use a Proof again for weight savings alone on a dedicated hunting rig? Probably not. So far the carbon barrel has lived up to the claims though.
Gamesniper19
Well-Known Member
I have no experience with the Hells Canyon CF barrel so I cannot compare directly - the additional mirage in a Proof CF barrel comes from engineering the of movement of heat more efficiently and quickly from the core. Again, great for barrel life but it does have a noticeable increased mirage over a steel barrel, and significantly more in an AR platform.
I have no issue running a CF barrel on my bolt guns. Especially hunting platforms. My AR's are being switched back to steel as they shoot out. The weight savings in an 18 or 20 inch barrel within a 10 - 12lb AR platform is not a priority for me to offset the cost differences.
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Deleted member 103481
Guest
Hmm. I've not noticed much mirage on mine and noted the steel felt hotter to the hand than the carbon wrap. I'll have to put a temp reader on it and check it out.
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
jmcmath,
You could get an infrared thermometer for less than $20. Mine is about the size of a tube of lipstick.
I use it every time I go to the range.
You could get an infrared thermometer for less than $20. Mine is about the size of a tube of lipstick.
I use it every time I go to the range.
RockyMtnMT
Official LRH Sponsor
I am still leaning in the camp that the carbon wrap insulates the barrel and makes it feel cooler to the touch. My 280ai with Proof Sendero light will be done soon. We have a 280ai with steel barrel that I will try and do some comparing with the same ammo. Thinking a meat thermometer in the chamber after a string with each may give an idea of which is cooler. Cooler to the touch is likely misleading. If the carbon is, in fact, moving heat from the steel faster it should read cooler in the chamber/throat. When touching the CF barrels after shooting they feel cooler to the touch. I would think this should be the opposite if the carbon was moving heat from the steel. I have not noticed more mirage from the carbon barrels, but have not thought about it. I will try and make note when comparing these rifles.
Let it be known that I don't care about the heat transfer thing with cf barrels. I put the Proof cf on my personal carry rifle because I like how they shoot and handle. I do think the cooler barrel is marketing hype that is difficult to prove, thus easy to claim. Longer lasting...Good luck proving that. Tips melting in flight...Hmmm. Bullets that can sense when they have penetrated 3" and then blow up...Hmmm. Small 6.5 caliber cartridges that out perform 300wm at 1000y on big game...Hmmm.
Lots of snake oil and unicorns sold to the shooting world.
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Deleted member 103481
Guest
Yeah I couldn't care less. Overall Weight, balance, and it looks cool.
@Rich Coyle kicker is I have one, I just keep forgetting to toss it in my bag. Used it to see if my rtic cooler was worth triple my Coleman extreme costed.
Gamesniper19
Well-Known Member
You are hitting on some pretty solid points. The data I am about to share has to be shared with some generalities to protect IP.
I personally asked some of the exact questions of CF scientists who sit around all day making carbon fibers and developing resin compounds. I have been in the shop and seen it done. Their words "If you have a carbon barrel, made of 100% solid carbon and no resin and compared it to a 100% solid steel barrel of the same contour - heat transfer would be similar"
I have seen the testing - conducted by the military so there is some unbiased data to support the premise that military steel barrels are bought for 125 bucks and carbon barrels are bought for 2x or 3x barrel over barrel, so they better give better performance and life span by atleast >3x to justify.
In that test, the temp of a steel barrel and a CF barrel are nearly exact seconds after the shot. As time progresses post shot is where the difference starts. The CF barrel core is statistically significantly cooler over time - meaning the carbon is moving the heat away from barrel faster. Also, the outside temp of the CF barrel was hotter - so when you touch it "feels" like it is hotter than steel when in fact, that is what you want. side effect - more mirage, especially during long strings of fire
Secondly - under that same test, firing a bullet every 10 seconds for 20 rounds, the core of the proof CF barrel was statistically significantly cooler than the steel barrel of the same contour after the first shot. The outside temps again were hotter with CF barrel - moving heat faster.
Not all CF barrels are the same. CF is not the same, resin is not the same, wrapping patters are not the same. So, not all CF barrels have the same results. The proof cocktail does NOT insulate the barrel. It moves heat faster than steel
I dont work for Proof so I have no vested interest in anyone going out and buying one. In fact, I buy other barrels too. I do have a vested interest in data and understanding exactly what is going on with what I do buy - so sharing what I learned is why I am here - knowledge is power and sharing that knowledge is valuable.
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Country Bumpkin
Well-Known Member
Was it?
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Deleted member 103481
Guest
It for sure kept cold things cold way longer. Mine kept frozen water bottles frozen over a week.
What I've decided is if you use a lot of coolers having one of the heavy/fancy ones is worth it. There is no point in having all rtic/yeti/whatever coolers because they are inconvenient physically(crazy heavy) and money wise. However having one can be super useful especially to replinish ice for the others. Or if you go out on a boat in the sun/very extreme conditions.
Country Bumpkin
Well-Known Member
Agreed, I've ended up with a 50/50 mix of Coleman's and Rtic/Yeti/Cordova. It's nice to have both. I put two big blocks of ice in the expensive ones and leave them in my better coolers for my 4 day hunts, amazing how well they work. Come back with elk quarters, break up and distribute the ice and make a run to the gas station for more. Okay, I'm done thread-jacking (this one).
