Lighter weight, faster 308 win load

[Old Rooster]

For many years I have used 125 gr Ballistic Tips and 130 gr Barnes for white tails and hogs but here in Montana I went to bigger bullets due to the muleys being bigger than white tails.
The 308 and Win748 is a match made in heaven.

 

[asd9055]

I have a Browning Short Trac Hog Stalker (FN Herstal FNAR with a paint job) that I shoot suppressed.

150 gr TTSX over 46.5 gr CFE223. Pretty mild load at 2660 ft/sec. Mild mannered, bullets readily available, and plenty accurate. I like that the powder meters so well.

Thank you for sharing. I have an old FN-FAL variant (piston) and a DPMS (DI) in 308, both 20 inch and I am looking for some fun but accurate loads.

 

[asd9055]

I'm pushing 130 gr TTSX's with Lapua brass, 210M's and 53.4 gr of Win 748 out of a 20" Rem 700 at 3220 FPS. I have a video of the last deer I shot with it at 291 yds, it performs exactly as my buddy who filmed it exclaims in the video: "You f-ing smoked him!"

Good information. Thank you for sharing

 

[Dean2]

748 woks good in warm weather but is is highly temperature sensitive. From 32F to -35 F the loads I tested lost 300 FPS. That is WAY more velocity variation than I get with any other powder. Makes it pretty much unusable up here. Never tried it in hot weather to see if it gains 300 FPS at 90 F.

I have never tried Hammer Bullets but I can say that 130 TSX, TTSX at 3100 fs flatten Moose, Elk and Deer just fine. Been shooting them for 15 years out of my 308, nothing walked away yet.

 

[asd9055]

748 woks good in warm weather but is is highly temperature sensitive. From 32F to -35 F the loads I tested lost 300 FPS. That is WAY more velocity variation than I get with any other powder. Makes it pretty much unusable up here. Never tried it in hot weather to see if it gains 300 FPS at 90 F.

I have never tried Hammer Bullets but I can say that 130 TSX, TTSX at 3100 fs flatten Moose, Elk and Deer just fine. Been shooting them for 15 years out of my 308, nothing walked away yet.

That is great variation....thanks for sharing...

 

[Petey308]

748 woks good in warm weather but is is highly temperature sensitive. From 32F to -35 F the loads I tested lost 300 FPS. That is WAY more velocity variation than I get with any other powder. Makes it pretty much unusable up here. Never tried it in hot weather to see if it gains 300 FPS at 90 F.

I have never tried Hammer Bullets but I can say that 130 TSX, TTSX at 3100 fs flatten Moose, Elk and Deer just fine. Been shooting them for 15 years out of my 308, nothing walked away yet.

Any ball powder, such as 748, will be temp sensitive. It's just an inherent nature of the beast for that type of powder. Some are worse than others.

And as far as all copper bullets… light and fast is always the best approach for best terminal performance. I would definitely stay away from any copper bullet heavier than 165gr in a 308, and ideally lighter than that is best.

Happy 4th everyone!

 

[FEENIX]

also works good with heavy .224 bullets. Speer 70 sp. with close to max on their website will get an honest 3000fps in 20-22" barrels. it is also one of the powders to test with the Maker bullets

Thank you, Sir!

 

[asd9055]

Any ball powder, such as 748, will be temp sensitive. It's just an inherent nature of the beast for that type of powder. Some are worse than others.

And as far as all copper bullets… light and fast is always the best approach for best terminal performance. I would definitely stay away from any copper bullet heavier than 165gr in a 308, and ideally lighter than that is best.

Happy 4th everyone!

Petey, back in the day.....maybe close to 50 years ago, I was taking apart some old military rounds. They were either .303 British or .50 BMG, memory not what it used be to anymore. The "powder" looked like really thin "angel hair pasta". Any idea what this was and temperature stibility?

 

[Petey308]

Petey, back in the day.....maybe close to 50 years ago, I was taking apart some old military rounds. They were either .303 British or .50 BMG, memory not what it used be to anymore. The "powder" looked like really thin "angel hair pasta". Any idea what this was and temperature stibility?

Cordite. It was the "powder" in a lot of rounds back in the day. I'm sure it wasn't temp stable, but I've not tested that.

The good temp stable extruded powders we have today are treated with additional chemicals to make them so. There are still quite a few extruded powders that aren't very temp stable. RL-17 is one I had a lot of issue with regarding MV swings as temps changed.

All the Hodgdon Extreme powders come from ADI Thales, in Australia, and those are treated with 2,4 Dinitrotoluene (DNT). It's what gives the powder is pale yellow color as well. It's a burn rate modifier, as well as a water-proofer, and is what I've been lead to believe is specifically what gives their powders better temp stability than others since pretty much no one else uses DNT. It's actually been banned in Europe now and other places.

Diphenylamine is used as well in other powders, as a stabilizer, in double base extruded powders (having both nitrocellulose and nitroglycerin), such as RL-16 for example, that are also treated with diisopentyl phthalate.

The Enduron line uses Centralites as their burn rate modifiers.

RL-16, as an example, is a double base extruded powder. It has both nitrocellulose AND nitroglycerin. Those powders are often referred to as "high energy" powders. That is the reason why you see more speed from RL-16 than you do with H4350, even though the burn rates of the two are similar.

The thing with double base extruded powders though is that they are inherently less temp stable than single base powders. Since RL-16 is specifically treated to be temp stable, it's likely good to go.

I have heard claims that high energy powders tend to erode throats faster, but I can't confirm that. The difference is likely not hugely significant, but the hotter burn and extra energy would have to equate to more firecracking in the throat in a basic physics standpoint. The 500 series of Vihta Vouri powders are also double base extruded, high energy powders.

 

[asd9055]

Cordite. It was the "powder" in a lot of rounds back in the day. I'm sure it wasn't temp stable, but I've not tested that.

The good temp stable extruded powders we have today are treated with additional chemicals to make them so. There are still quite a few extruded powders that aren't very temp stable. RL-17 is one I had a lot of issue with regarding MV swings as temps changed.

All the Hodgdon Extreme powders come from ADI Thales, in Australia, and those are treated with 2,4 Dinitrotoluene (DNT). It's what gives the powder is pale yellow color as well. It's a burn rate modifier, as well as a water-proofer, and is what I've been lead to believe is specifically what gives their powders better temp stability than others since pretty much no one else uses DNT. It's actually been banned in Europe now and other places.

Diphenylamine is used as well in other powders, as a stabilizer, in double base extruded powders (having both nitrocellulose and nitroglycerin), such as RL-16 for example, that are also treated with diisopentyl phthalate.

The Enduron line uses Centralites as their burn rate modifiers.

RL-16, as an example, is a double base extruded powder. It has both nitrocellulose AND nitroglycerin. Those powders are often referred to as "high energy" powders. That is the reason why you see more speed from RL-16 than you do with H4350, even though the burn rates of the two are similar.

The thing with double base extruded powders though is that they are inherently less temp stable than single base powders. Since RL-16 is specifically treated to be temp stable, it's likely good to go.

I have heard claims that high energy powders tend to erode throats faster, but I can't confirm that. The difference is likely not hugely significant, but the hotter burn and extra energy would have to equate to more firecracking in the throat in a basic physics standpoint. The 500 series of Vihta Vouri powders are also double base extruded, high energy powders.

Thank you sir! I always get a detailed explanation from you! I still think you should start publishing!!!! I'll even help

 

[Petey308]

Thank you sir! I always get a detailed explanation from you! I still think you should start publishing!!!! I'll even help

I actually have a "works" copyrighted right now and I'm in the process of first publishing it as an ebook. I'll work after that on hard copies. My first published works will be about bullets and terminal ballistics. I plan on doing publishes works on reloading and related subject matter, like info like this about powders. I'll probably publish more about bullets and terminal ballistics too over time, as it's an ever-evolving subject. There's always new bullets to test and talk about. Plus, this first book will be mostly about correcting misinformation out there. Future books would be more about applying correct info and test results on new bullets, etc.

At any rate, I appreciate your support and kind words. It helps keep me motivated lol.

 

[FEENIX]

I actually have a "works" copyrighted right now and I'm in the process of first publishing it as an ebook. I'll work after that on hard copies. My first published works will be about bullets and terminal ballistics. I plan on doing publishes works on reloading and related subject matter, like info like this about powders. I'll probably publish more about bullets and terminal ballistics too over time, as it's an ever-evolving subject. There's always new bullets to test and talk about. Plus, this first book will be mostly about correcting misinformation out there. Future books would be more about applying correct info and test results on new bullets, etc.

At any rate, I appreciate your support and kind words. It helps keep me motivated lol.

I agree with @asd9055. Thanks for letting me have a glimpse of your initial work. BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT!

 

[asd9055]

I actually have a "works" copyrighted right now and I'm in the process of first publishing it as an ebook. I'll work after that on hard copies. My first published works will be about bullets and terminal ballistics. I plan on doing publishes works on reloading and related subject matter, like info like this about powders. I'll probably publish more about bullets and terminal ballistics too over time, as it's an ever-evolving subject. There's always new bullets to test and talk about. Plus, this first book will be mostly about correcting misinformation out there. Future books would be more about applying correct info and test results on new bullets, etc.

At any rate, I appreciate your support and kind words. It helps keep me motivated lol.

I can't wait! Thank you sir!

 

[Petey308]

I agree with @asd9055. Thanks for letting me have a glimpse of your initial work. BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT!

Thanks for your feedback with it! It definitely helped improve the content.