RockyMtnMT
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Then we'll have to change our plumbing from copper to PEX. 
Lead Poisoning
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Ucsdryder
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2016
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I paid $.34 a round for my eldm 225s, within the last 4 months. As reloading components prices sky rocket, this allows me to continue to reload for well under $1 per round. I hope to continue to do so for a long, long time.
Ross1147
Well-Known Member
I'm a little late to this post. Finally watched the video. I'm not sure how anyone can watch this and not think this is 100% propaganda for non-lead bullet makers. I have no issues using hammers, they shoot great in most my guns and kill. But, I'm not made of money and can't afford to only shoot copper. Since I've moved back to a free state I haven't purchased any copper due to cost. It's videos like this that put the hunting community against each other and reduce the supporters we have in the game.
bigngreen
Well-Known Member
Is it the video or our reaction to them that divide?
We've always been able to voice our opinion and present them for the public, that should never change even if I don't like the content or agree!!
It's most certainly not the content that divides!!
I practice and shoot a lot of different calibers. I shoot the 140g Barnes TTSX(7 Mag & 7 STW), Barnes 127g Long range(6.5x55), and Barnes 110g TTSX(270 Win). Those barrels do not get shot much. So far, the copper does it's very best to equal the cup and core bullets on deer and hogs, but I have not shot any Hammer bullets. There are a lot of You Tube videos of guys not liking copper bullets. Since I am a doubting Thomas, I like to test the waters myself, and we butcher our own game.
Through the years, I have been caught in some shortages, and it is disgusting that you allowed yourself to get caught "Short". I like to buy projectiles 1000-1500 at a time when I can, hello Hornady, Sierra, and some Berger.
Like most hunters, I look at the lead ban as just another facet of gun control through the back door by controlling the ammunition. The whole issue in Ca on banning lead bullets to aid the Condors was pure BS...I lived there. I wonder if the Dove and Pigeon hunting is extinct in Ca at this time?
Now, Wind Turbines and Solar farms are killing more birds of prey than lead ever did, and no one is going to do a darn thing about it either.
I shoot the 180g ELDM in a 7 Rem mag, 280, and 280 AI along with the 162g ELDM. Concerning the 180g ELDM & the 162g ELDM, some things you just have to see for yourself, they put deer on the ground RIGHT NOW! Both the ELDX and the ELDM are worth building a rifle around. Till you get past 1200 yards, the 162's maybe ahead of the 180s slightly. I am about to start shooting the 162g ELD in a 7/08 where I was shooting a 160g Sierra TMK, which has disappeared from the market.
Through the years, I have been caught in some shortages, and it is disgusting that you allowed yourself to get caught "Short". I like to buy projectiles 1000-1500 at a time when I can, hello Hornady, Sierra, and some Berger.
Like most hunters, I look at the lead ban as just another facet of gun control through the back door by controlling the ammunition. The whole issue in Ca on banning lead bullets to aid the Condors was pure BS...I lived there. I wonder if the Dove and Pigeon hunting is extinct in Ca at this time?
Now, Wind Turbines and Solar farms are killing more birds of prey than lead ever did, and no one is going to do a darn thing about it either.
I shoot the 180g ELDM in a 7 Rem mag, 280, and 280 AI along with the 162g ELDM. Concerning the 180g ELDM & the 162g ELDM, some things you just have to see for yourself, they put deer on the ground RIGHT NOW! Both the ELDX and the ELDM are worth building a rifle around. Till you get past 1200 yards, the 162's maybe ahead of the 180s slightly. I am about to start shooting the 162g ELD in a 7/08 where I was shooting a 160g Sierra TMK, which has disappeared from the market.
Calvin45
Well-Known Member
Fair enough. Again, I'm not biased either way. I shoot hammers Barnes swift hornady ppu Sierra Speer Nosler…. They all work, some brilliantly in specific applications. Hammers and the lightweight Barnes going fast are just awesome. Not needed, it's not like game animals were invincible before. But they are amazing performers. I like my magnums. I've also found no fault with the standard cartridges. I don't need magnums. That doesn't mean there's 0 reason to use them
. I absolutely do not NEED copper bullets…that also is not the same thing as saying zero reason to use them. I could very easily get around town with a bicycle…doesn't mean there's zero reason to own an automobile of some kind haha. Certainly not arguing against the viability of the eld match. I love the 225 grain out of my 300 win and of the 3 deer I've taken with that particular bullet, 2 went straight down and one did a drunken stagger about 20 yards before piling up.
All I'm really taking issue with is the blanket statement that 100 percent copper bullets are for those that love narrow wound channels. That's factually, demonstrably not true and I have the photographs to prove it.
Ross1147
Well-Known Member
Is it the video or our reaction to them that divide?
I don't think it's the reaction. I think it's the support from individuals who serve to gain monetarily from a ban. I was born and raised in CA. Left in 2001 and have only moved back because the military made me. When CA moved to non-lead I always wondered how much non-lead bullet makers donated to the cause? Follow the money.
Agree Calvin, the Barnes at speeds and distances we hunt at make a mess on white tails which means dead deer quickly. Having said that, I have not drank the Kool Aid on copper bullets.
I killed two bull elk with the Then NEW 140g nosler ballistic tips out of the 7 mag and they flopped when hit at a dead run. Up to that point, we killed 7 Elk with a 7/08 with 140g Sierra flat base. We know our limitations, and shoot when we can put the bullet where it should go.
My Brother and I were talking about how we killed all those deer with the crappy BC speer bullets? Speer Hot Cores have worked well for us on short range, 350 yds and under.
I will repeat it again, having got caught short a couple of times where our favorite bullet could not be had, we hope to not be there again. However, here we are with half a dozen bullets we love that are just magic killing bullets that can not be found. These shortages are horrible, and I fear that we have not seen the worst of it.
I killed two bull elk with the Then NEW 140g nosler ballistic tips out of the 7 mag and they flopped when hit at a dead run. Up to that point, we killed 7 Elk with a 7/08 with 140g Sierra flat base. We know our limitations, and shoot when we can put the bullet where it should go.
My Brother and I were talking about how we killed all those deer with the crappy BC speer bullets? Speer Hot Cores have worked well for us on short range, 350 yds and under.
I will repeat it again, having got caught short a couple of times where our favorite bullet could not be had, we hope to not be there again. However, here we are with half a dozen bullets we love that are just magic killing bullets that can not be found. These shortages are horrible, and I fear that we have not seen the worst of it.
bigngreen
Well-Known Member
I remember the first ones put out by Barnes BUT no one is divided till the people watching them decide to pick un movable sides. I don't agree with a lot of stuff, doesn't mean everyone has a nefarious reason to not agree with me.
I have a brother in-law that is about as rugged an ild mountain cowboy and guide as you could find, he LOVES raptors, I'd just as soon have the right to shoot them BUT there are more important things that we agree on that actually matter so we don't need to discuss it much.
Calvin45
Well-Known Member
Yep no argument here. I honestly just really find bullet testing interesting as well and will always want to see if something works better when what I have works just fine.
I shudder to think of how little real world difference in deer killing power there is inside 250 yards between the cheap Winchester 150 grain power points out of my 270 and anything I've used since I've started handloading haha. And how way more deer are taken inside that range than beyond it, for me anyway.
Ross1147
Well-Known Member
I think you're correct and we agree. I don't want someone telling me you shall only use "xyz".
I just went into my reloading room looked, I have 14 boxes of hammers sitting on the shelf. Add a couple boxes of Barnes and CE and I'm almost 20 deep into copper. I'll be honest. All were purchased when I was stationed in CA. Do I still use them, yes 100%. But it's based off choice and not mandate.
The last gun I purchased was a 300 BLK to shoot suppressed. It's a blast to shoot with 220grn ELD-Xs. If I want to use this gun hunting I need to step it down with weight and get some speed. The Barnes VOR-TX seems to be the best bullet. Checked hammer and they had the 101grn. I had them in my cart to buy, but then checked midway. They had 110grn seconds for .10 a pill. A 110grn lead will kill the same as a 101/110 grn copper at the distances a BLK is used at 1/10th of the cost. I'm not a rich man try to save where I can so lead wins.
Ok, let's just go hunting...
M1A1ABRAMS
Well-Known Member
Seems most new homes are going PEX. Not saying it has anything to do with health issues, but more on cost. But then was there a study ever made on copper piping ? Funny they used lead pipes for how long till they determined it was unsafe. Just turn on the TV & there's a new lawsuit for just about anything these days. Just saying.Then we'll have to change our plumbing from copper to PEX.
