Irresponsible bullet manufacturers

[shaughn]

Administrative cost, I phone up a tech, I spent 100,000 dollars last month on products and it's not warranty or contract and what I am asking might not even be a workable solution or really a good way to go and a better way may already exist, but if I want to go that way they will accommodate me, but to put it together and supply it it will cost me a fee.

I have been there, explained it to the board and the boss and have even been the person on the phone or on site having to explain that yes we can give you that information but it will cost you, it is not free.

 

[7.62 Gunner]

This really isn't about the books I have several books and manuals I started buying books back in th 70s before the net was ever thought of its about customer service and believe it or not I can use the internet and I can look at other data figure things out for myself. If I spend my hard earned money on your products I expect a little help if I ask and I know if I ask here that this crowd will help out with everything imaginable that pertains to reloading and shooting and I sincerely appreciate it

I knew you were a Boomer after reading the first sentence of your post..
It's a generational thing, my parents do it too; complain about CS, turn back food at a restaurant for not being good enough, etc. etc.
On the flip side with our govs fiscal negligence, that $1 you'll have to pay Hornady for load data is worth like 5 cents from when you were a wee lad.

 

[xsn10s]

Well I guess there are a lot of options the OP can do, which has been the same for all of us for decades. He can choose another bullet from a different company. But the companies he listed have more expensive bullets that cost more than a dollar to ten dollars per box. He can cross reference for bullets of the same weight from different manufacturers a take a chance that the load data won't be over pressured. Or pay the $1 for the individual load data instead of buying the book and be happy. IMO the one dollar charge plus the cost of Hornady's bullets is still a bargain verses some of the other match bullets. That one dollar service could be considered a customer service plus. Here's a cost comparison for bullets in this weight class. https://www.powdervalley.com/produc...ort-by/7173/grain-weight/9091-9200-9108-9128/

 

[Darryle]

This really isn't about the books I have several books and manuals I started buying books back in th 70s before the net was ever thought of its about customer service and believe it or not I can use the internet and I can look at other data figure things out for myself. If I spend my hard earned money on your products I expect a little help if I ask and I know if I ask here that this crowd will help out with everything imaginable that pertains to reloading and shooting and I sincerely appreciate it

They are a company, they have a board of directors, shareholders/employees to take care of, profits to be met and in the end, research and development of new innovative products and they are one of the most affordable bullet/ammo/die manufacturers out there. They didn't do that by giving away data they spent company resources developing. If you don't like it, find someone who will give you all the data you want and charge you a premium for their bullets.

You can laugh, but the comparison is direct, you want to cheap out, save time and components by asking for a data point. How many times have you been given a data point that worked the first time? By your own admission, you can figure it out, then why'd did you waste your time on the phone instead of getting busy at the bench.

There is someone on this forum that has the data point you seek, but we all know, that doesn't mean squat until you put it into action and then it is a hail Mary.

 

[yogibearmech]

How is that irresponsible? They're providing a service that you're paying for (bullet manufacturing). Why should load data (also a service) be free? It's cool when it is, but to call out a mfg for being "irresponsible" when they won't give you stuff for free seems pretty out of line to me. Go buy a Hornady load book like the rest of us did.

Well, at least they answered you. I asked for 105 gr 6mm load data for a 6 Dasher and they didn't even reply. I have their latest reloading book but that caliber isn't in there. I am going to end up just buying the quickload software and being done with it.

 

[FEENIX]

Well I guess there are a lot of options the OP can do, which has been the same for all of us for decades. He can choose another bullet from a different company. But the companies he listed have more expensive bullets that cost more than a dollar to ten dollars per box. He can cross reference for bullets of the same weight from different manufacturers a take a chance that the load data won't be over pressured. Or pay the $1 for the individual load data instead of buying the book and be happy. IMO the one dollar charge plus the cost of Hornady's bullets is still a bargain verses some of the other match bullets. That one dollar service could be considered a customer service plus. Here's a cost comparison for bullets in this weight class. https://www.powdervalley.com/produc...ort-by/7173/grain-weight/9091-9200-9108-9128/

They are a company, they have a board of directors, shareholders/employees to take care of, profits to be met and in the end, research and development of new innovative products and they are one of the most affordable bullet/ammo/die manufacturers out there. They didn't do that by giving away data they spent company resources developing. If you don't like it, find someone who will give you all the data you want and charge you a premium for their bullets.

You can laugh, but the comparison is direct, you want to cheap out, save time and components by asking for a data point. How many times have you been given a data point that worked the first time? By your own admission, you can figure it out, then why'd did you waste your time on the phone instead of getting busy at the bench.

There is someone on this forum that has the data point you seek, but we all know, that doesn't mean squat until you put it into action and then it is a hail Mary.

This is the beauty of the good ole USA: we still have freedom of choice. We have plenty of options to choose from. What we do with those choices is another story. As previously noted, no one is forced to use any available products and services. The end-users have the ultimate responsibility, and whatever decisions/choices made must face their consequences. Cheers!

 

[Ol' Red]

For what it's worth, I use all free online resources and quickload. And though I approach it carefully and have not blown anything up in 30years, I consider myself the irresponsible party not the folks who charge for verified data.

Steve

Might I ask what happened 31 years ago?

 

[Ol' Red]

I bet there is a long list of stuff that "burns your butt".

What burns my butt is a flame about 31 and a half inches high. I had to break out the tape measure for that.

 

[GUNNNN]

I've had a blast reading all of y'alls responses to my rant but in my opinion the real issue is customer service I worked in the service industry for many years and my customers were my living and I did what ever it took to make them happy if they had an emergency and they called me in the middle of the night I answered and did what ever it took to fix their problem no matter what, now they paid for that service but if I could help them over the phone that didn't cost them one red cent they were my customers and I stood by my work if I tried to fix a problem and something needed tweaking I took care of if. And if any of y'all are naive enough to think these folks aren't making any money selling their products you had best think again. God bless all of y'all and God bless America

 

[FEENIX]

OMG!

 

[Monteria]

Might I ask what happened 31 years ago?

LOL, good catch. 31 years ago i was shooting factory ammo. I started reloading 30 years ago... so I've never blown anything up with my reloading.

 

[stinkyduck13]

What data did they withhold? All their data up till the 11th edition was released is included in that so the only thing they don't have is the newest stuff that is going in the 12th edition.
Some of the stuff for their new cartridges and bullets gets posted for a limited time but will be included in the 12th edition.

Load Data - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

Hornady develops and publishes reloading data for the Handbook of Cartridge Reloading and makes it available in three ways: the traditional hardcover book, an e-book on Apple iBook or on your Kindle, and on the Hornady Reloading App. Like the bound and...

www.hornady.com

Not too sure about that! I have a bunch of 195 eldm for my 300 win and wanted to load it with imr7828! The data is not there! I have the 11 th edition! LGS guy told me to look up what the factory Ballistics are and try to match it! I think I went with 74.5? At 2930! And it shot well? Another approach?

 

[shaughn]

We don't have a dead horse emoji or maybe I missed it

Sole proprietor......gives away a lot of stuff for free to keep people coming to his door..even when he should charge a small fee, because time and effort away from work is lost productivity.....lost money

Corporation......realism.....know's every action costs money and if they want to stay in business and keep paying thier employee's and making money. They must face reality and sometimes that means charging people money.

 

[Muddyboots]

Somehow this old cartoon just seems to fit.