Baker Alvin
Well-Known Member
Very Interesting
Interesting lead free bullet design/concept
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Andrew Massi
Well-Known Member
Pretty soon to assume better performance from existing bullets vs a new bullet.
Andrew Massi
Well-Known Member
These all appear to be super light for caliber and marketed as a 0-300 yard answer for small-medium game. Often norma gets pulled by their European roots and is geared towards driven hunts, night hunts etc.
azsugarbear
Well-Known Member
I wasn't suggesting a comparison of existing vs. new bullets, but rather a comparison of "like/similar" bullets. BC is determined primarily by weight and design. There is no way that a copper or tin bullet can compete with a cup & core lead bullet at longer distances. They just don't have the mass/weight to carry their speed down range much beyond 600 yds. If you know your shots will be under that, then the mono's will do a great job delivering terminal peformance. Beyond that, they lose speed and become much more susceptible to wind - not ideal for a long range bullet.
Hence my suggestion to compare apples to apples or copper to tin. The bullet design of the new Norma offering (two part bullet) is not new. Nosler invented that concept 70 years ago when they came out with the Nosler Partition. Speaking of which, I suspect the Nosler Partition would hold up quite well in a comparison to any mono at ranges of 500 yds or less.
The only advantage I see with the mono's is being less harmful to the environment. The copper mono's are very lethal at 600 yds. and under but beyond that, they lose steam very quickly.
Hence my suggestion to compare apples to apples or copper to tin. The bullet design of the new Norma offering (two part bullet) is not new. Nosler invented that concept 70 years ago when they came out with the Nosler Partition. Speaking of which, I suspect the Nosler Partition would hold up quite well in a comparison to any mono at ranges of 500 yds or less.
The only advantage I see with the mono's is being less harmful to the environment. The copper mono's are very lethal at 600 yds. and under but beyond that, they lose steam very quickly.
Last edited:
Wedgy
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In one of the recent King of 2 Miles 9 of the top 10 finishers shot Cutting Edge bullets which are monos.
azsugarbear
Well-Known Member
They probably were using mono's. But I also suspect they weren't shooting the typical hunting rounds you and I use. Those guys are shooting the big 375's and 416's. Their rifles typically weigh 20+ pounds with a rule restriction set at max 40 pounds. Their goal is not terminal performance, but precision accuracy. Not the typical hunting scenario faced by you an me. Mono's are usually lathe turned, so they are much more uniform - hence better accuracy. But those big .375 bullets have BC's in the .95 to 1.0 range. That's well above any bullet BC found in our 30 and 7mm calibers - lead or mono. That's why they are using them.
For example: The largest 30 cal bullet made by Hammer is their 277 gr. Hammer Hunter. The stated G7 BC for this bullet is .326 (G1 BC = .630). Cutting Edge's largest 30 cal bullet, the 240 gr. Lazer Tipped Hollow Point has a stated G7 BC of .358 (G1 BC = .692). On the other hand, the Berger 245 gr. Hybrid Target has a G7 BC of .433 (G1 BC = .846). That is the real life hunting world for guys like us.
Don't get me wrong, I love mono's. I have and shoot both Cutting Edge and Hammer bullets. But they have their limitations. Just run these bullets in a ballistics model and you will see what I mean. At 800 yds., the difference in speed retention, as well as wind deflection begin to separate the lead from the mono's.
For example: The largest 30 cal bullet made by Hammer is their 277 gr. Hammer Hunter. The stated G7 BC for this bullet is .326 (G1 BC = .630). Cutting Edge's largest 30 cal bullet, the 240 gr. Lazer Tipped Hollow Point has a stated G7 BC of .358 (G1 BC = .692). On the other hand, the Berger 245 gr. Hybrid Target has a G7 BC of .433 (G1 BC = .846). That is the real life hunting world for guys like us.
Don't get me wrong, I love mono's. I have and shoot both Cutting Edge and Hammer bullets. But they have their limitations. Just run these bullets in a ballistics model and you will see what I mean. At 800 yds., the difference in speed retention, as well as wind deflection begin to separate the lead from the mono's.
Jon Bischof
Well-Known Member
Don't know about these light for caliber tin non-toxics. Might be great for thin skinned game, but I don't have direct experience with them.
On the other hand, I have evil plans to lead-poison some deer this Fall with Norma Whitetail and have had an absolute blast with Norma Bondstrike out to 400 yards with both 6.5 Creedmoor and 30-06.
If God grants me the opportunity, I will post my results on deer with both of these luscious lead laden bullets. My condolences to those who hunt in States where lead is prohibited.
Evo and Eco may or may not be long range gems, but Bondstrike is a whole 'nuther beast. Check out the BC on Bondstrike. .308 is G1 0.615 and
6.5 is
On the other hand, I have evil plans to lead-poison some deer this Fall with Norma Whitetail and have had an absolute blast with Norma Bondstrike out to 400 yards with both 6.5 Creedmoor and 30-06.
If God grants me the opportunity, I will post my results on deer with both of these luscious lead laden bullets. My condolences to those who hunt in States where lead is prohibited.
Evo and Eco may or may not be long range gems, but Bondstrike is a whole 'nuther beast. Check out the BC on Bondstrike. .308 is G1 0.615 and
6.5 is
Ballistic coefficient
G1
0.629
G7
0.313
A friend of mine has done two seasons of wild boar driven hunting and red deer stalking with the norma bullets you are talking about in France. He uses a 9.3x62 .
His shooting distances are from short range up to 300m and they perform really well even on large deer (200kg+) and large wild boars.
Another of my friends is a professional stalker in Scotland and has successfully used the norma in his 6.5x55 for the last year or so. With more than 150 red deer , fallow and roe deer taken successfully at ranges up to 400yrds.
His shooting distances are from short range up to 300m and they perform really well even on large deer (200kg+) and large wild boars.
Another of my friends is a professional stalker in Scotland and has successfully used the norma in his 6.5x55 for the last year or so. With more than 150 red deer , fallow and roe deer taken successfully at ranges up to 400yrds.
Hard rock
Well-Known Member
I bet one thing for sure , I bet anyone on this forum they don't copper up your bore.
Jon Bischof
Well-Known Member
Which Norma bullet did he use?
It's quite disburbing that you'd have that photo saved on your phone ....
but hey, It's 2022 ... lol
Grabbed it from the errornet just for you... cheers....lol
Partitions ?
