Improving the 308 Win performance

[Varmint Hunter]

Shoots bug holes. Like .05 MOA.

That sure would be "Bugholes"

 

[Grifm]

In a (probably vain) attempt to keep this thread on topic...has anyone tried Hammer Bullets in 308. Specifically the 151 absolute hammer. HB says that the AB line doesn't line up with conventional load data and results in much faster velocities. In fact on the web page they reference "3200fps out of a 308".
I'm curious if anyone has experience with this. If so what barrel length is needed to achieve it?

.308 Cal-151gr Absolute Hammer™ - Hammer Bullets

A 1-12" twist rate Absolute Hammer™ that will be fantastic in the 308 Winchester. Imagine 3200 fps in the 308 with a bullet large enough for any of the North American big game. Absolute Hammer™s are designed with an ogive that does not get engraved by the rifling. This results in much lower...

hammerbullets.com

I was able to get the 151AH to 3150 out of a Winchester m70 22" barrel with both Tac and Power Pro Varmint. Couldn't consistently get accuracy I was looking for with the Varmint but with Tac I ended up with a load that would consistently shoot .5-.75MOA going just above 3100

Matt

 

[xsn10s]

I was able to get the 151AH to 3150 out of a Winchester m70 22" barrel with both Tac and Power Pro Varmint. Couldn't consistently get accuracy I was looking for with the Varmint but with Tac I ended up with a load that would consistently shoot .5-.75MOA going just above 3100

Matt

Well then my best guess is that the 150 BD2 should be able to get to the same velocities. At my altitude that's a 650 yard elk rifle. 700 yards if I'm okay with around 1400 ft/lbs energy.

 

[Grifm]

Well then my best guess is that the 150 BD2 should be able to get to the same velocities. At my altitude that's a 650 yard elk rifle. 700 yards if I'm okay with around 1400 ft/lbs energy.

I've never shot the BD2 but I'd say be careful. If you look at the AH the only part of the bullet that full diameter is the scallops on the side, I think they call them PDBs so the bearing surface is very small. I haven't really done much research into the BD2 but I did read that they're designed to reduce bearing surface. Looking at the pictures I can't immgine that they've reduced the bearing surface as much as the AH. Because of that I would expect to hit pressure a bit earlier. For reference in the same rifle I could push the 150 TTSX to just over 2900 with CFE223. LVR is a bit slower than CFE so maybe you could get a little more velocity with LVR but I'd expect the BD2 to fall somewhere between those two but if I had to guess I'd say somewhere around 3050 would be a reasonable velocity for initial calculations.


-Matt

 

[JAYgs8163]

I've never shot the BD2 but I'd say be careful. If you look at the AH the only part of the bullet that full diameter is the scallops on the side, I think they call them PDBs so the bearing surface is very small. I haven't really done much research into the BD2 but I did read that they're designed to reduce bearing surface. Looking at the pictures I can't immgine that they've reduced the bearing surface as much as the AH. Because of that I would expect to hit pressure a bit earlier. For reference in the same rifle I could push the 150 TTSX to just over 2900 with CFE223. LVR is a bit slower than CFE so maybe you could get a little more velocity with LVR but I'd expect the BD2 to fall somewhere between those two but if I had to guess I'd say somewhere around 3050 would be a reasonable velocity for initial calculations.


-Matt

If I'm not mistaken the bearing surface on the 150 BD2 is even less than the Hammer. @nralifer is the expert though!

 

[xsn10s]

I've never shot the BD2 but I'd say be careful. If you look at the AH the only part of the bullet that full diameter is the scallops on the side, I think they call them PDBs so the bearing surface is very small. I haven't really done much research into the BD2 but I did read that they're designed to reduce bearing surface. Looking at the pictures I can't immgine that they've reduced the bearing surface as much as the AH. Because of that I would expect to hit pressure a bit earlier. For reference in the same rifle I could push the 150 TTSX to just over 2900 with CFE223. LVR is a bit slower than CFE so maybe you could get a little more velocity with LVR but I'd expect the BD2 to fall somewhere between those two but if I had to guess I'd say somewhere around 3050 would be a reasonable velocity for initial calculations.


-Matt

I've researched it and I've also made monos on swiss machines. I don't see their design as being a problem. This isn't a new idea, it's been around for well over forty years. It's a new take on an old design.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I'm still in shock over the report of a 150 BD2 at 3200 fps out of a 308win. I don't see how this is possible, and if it is, the pressure would scare the hello out of me.

Here you go.
Not a Badlands but a 150 class mono out of a 20" 308.
Some folks aren't scared to buck the long accepted norms and do their own testing.

 

[Grifm]

I've researched it and I've also made monos on swiss machines. I don't see their design as being a problem. This isn't a new idea, it's been around for well over forty years. It's a new take on an old design.

Not saying that there is a problem with their design. Just that as bearing surface goes up pressure is going to go up for the same charge. Simply by looking at the pictures on their website, I'd guess that the BD2 will hit pressure sooner. Maybe that can be mitigated with a slower powder but that could open up other issues, especially in a cartridge with lower case capacity (not trying to go back to the earlier discussion). Certainly give it a try and let us all know how it goes.

My 308 is a 1in12 twist and BL lists the minimum for the 150 BD2 as 1in11so it isn't something I'm going to be trying personally.

 

[xsn10s]

Not saying that there is a problem with their design. Just that as bearing surface goes up pressure is going to go up for the same charge. Simply by looking at the pictures on their website, I'd guess that the BD2 will hit pressure sooner. Maybe that can be mitigated with a slower powder but that could open up other issues, especially in a cartridge with lower case capacity (not trying to go back to the earlier discussion). Certainly give it a try and let us all know how it goes.

My 308 is a 1in12 twist and BL lists the minimum for the 150 BD2 as 1in12 so it isn't something I'm going to be trying personally.

Have you manufactured bullets?

 

[Mark37082]

150 BD2 in 308 shows 1/11 I believe on the website.

 

[Grifm]

Sorry miss typed… will correct my post

 

[Grifm]

Have you manufactured bullets?

No I haven't, but not exactly sure what that has to do with anything/why that would make a difference. If you work up a load and you get the same or even more velocity with the BL2 as I or anyone else gets with the AH, that's great, share the info. I have nothing against BL and if I ever end up putting a new/faster twist barrel on my 308 I'll give them a try.

 

[TexasPride]

I'll take a look at it thanks.
I have a 308 barrel that I'm thinking about cutting down for a suppressor, so I'm looking at options to get the best velocity I can out of it.

I got the 151 AH to 3173 fps average 12 ES with 5 shot group of 49.3 gn TAC. 22.4" 308 Tikka, once fired Lapua brass, CCI 200s, 2.76 COL, 1/4 crimp Lee FCD. ALWAYS start lower… every rifle is different.

 

[Mark37082]

I stand corrected on my doubting on the FPS out of a 308win. I only have one 308win in 1/12 twist. I also will not be able to try the BD2 in this rifle. I did order some 284 150 BD2 while I was looking. I'm a sucker for new bullets…..