Not looking for an internet peeing match. You clearly stated if he "had taken it to a qualified gunsmith not a band saw". His first post reads that he took it to a gunsmith. It's akin to going to a dentist. Unless you have prior experience and or recommendations on that dentist, how do you know if he is "qualified"? And by the way, it's Monday morning quarterbacking, not Monday night. And yes, I admitted in an earlier post that I had not read every post in this lengthy thread.
How to blowup your rifle
- Thread starter Winkfish
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I am not sure i agree with your assement. Stress relief has nothing to do with shrinkage do to cold.if poorly releived you could get warpage" just as you can with hot barrel "if the barrel barrel and the ammo were exposed at the same time the cold would have had a similar effect on the bullets. I am not buying a tight bore condition caused this! He had a pressure spike,vnot sure why, i am thinking more to a change of ignition and the peak pressure . the cold may have causied a delayed ignition, that acted like a super magnum primmer setting off the rest of the charge. and excessive spike! A hang fire going bad so to speak. That is just a guess!
SidecarFlip
Well-Known Member
You can 'blow up' any rifle if you try hard enough. I blew up a 10-22 years ago, anything is possible with enough stupidity.
pondskipper
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2010
- Messages
- 296
Correct but you are thinking of warpage in a single plane, it can cause the barrel to both bend and contract, at the pressures we're talking it doesn't take much for it to cause major issues with pressure in general, likely it could have been saved as well, no reason to cut it up either. It didn't explode he just had a stuck case which means it was something fairly minor like a tight bore due to the cold, if it had blown up or cracked something I'd be more inclined to agree with a hang fire idea. They are much more violent than what actually happened prior to whoever got their hands on it and cut it to pieces.
As for the bullets, likely lead core with a thin jacket. Lead has very little thermal expansion so they likely weren't the cause.
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Orange Dust
Well-Known Member
Sold it to a friend. He was with me when it happened. He still had it and was still shooting it when he died. He was much braver than me. Gunsmith said it was ok.... He bought it cheap. I got a facefull and didn't fire another Remington for 20 years. Only primer I ever ruptured. Switched to Weatherby rifles for a long time due to the shrouded and vented bolt. Never tested it to see if it worked though.
theosmithjr
Well-Known Member
Well. I destroyed my 300 RUM today.
Yesterday I was testing some load development on my 300 RUM with Berger 230 with Retumbo.
Everything went well and found a load that appeared to group well. 86.8 gr. COL of 3.600" Federal 215 primers on Hornady Brass.
The temps were 3 degrees and a slight breeze bringing the windchill temps down to -15.
I went home and loaded a few more rounds at that charge and try a couple other loads.
Today it was -10 with a 20mph wind. For some reason no one else was at the range. I fired 20 rounds of 190gr Nosler Accubonds to make sure that everything was working well and to warm myself up a bit. I am getting about 3100 fps out of the 190s with Retumbo at 91.5gr
20 rounds fired and not a single issue. I was firing a 2 rounds then I would let it sit for few minutes and fire other rifles.
About an hour into it I then switched over to the 230 grain rounds. I fired the first round. 3129fps and I couldn't lift the bolt. Something was seriously wrong. I broke off the bolt handle trying to open it at the range hitting it with my hand trying to open the action.
I took the rifle to my local smith and I attempted to get the bolt out. After three hours f trying everything under the sun, No luck. There is a picture of the results:
It was very difficult to put the gun on a band saw and cut it apart.
To say the least I am not happy. A perfectly good rifle is now a pile of scrap.
I went home and pulled all the bullets to check the powder charges. I used a two different scales and I was within .1 grain of what I loaded.
I don't know what happened. Obviously over pressured. It was 3 degrees out when I tested the rounds and it was only -10 today. There were no pressure sings, no cratered primers, nothing that would indicate that there were any issues on that same load the day before.
What a great way to end the year. I guess I will be looking for a new rifle in the new year.
So SORRY to HEAR & SEE what happened to you and your rifle. I had a very similar problem this past August with a Remington Action and Federal Primers. Gold Medal Match 205M's to be exact. Perhaps your problem is like mine; I honestly BELIEVE it was the PRIMERS in my case! I have fired 315 rounds of 22 grains of Vihtavorhi N135, Federal GMM 205M primers, .37gr. VLD Bergers off of .223 Lapaua Brass that is Necked down to .172 and the necks turned. I developed this load in 93 degree weather and it's a SCREAMER! The Brass has all been Fired Formed and loaded for the 3rd time. NOTHING WAS CHANGED! I nearly LOST my RIGHT EYE when the PRIMER TOTALLY EXPLODED and DISINTEGRATED! No signs of pressure as a warning. It JUST BLEW! The BOLT Handle lifted easily after the mishap. I cycled the action but the case did NOT extract. I re-cycled it and it extracted on the 2nd attempt. I looked at the primer and it was GONE! Nothing left of it at all! I was rushed to the ER of thge local Hospital and underwent grueling treatment to remove numerous metal fragments that were embedded in the 2nd & 3rd layer of the Cornea of my right eye. I also endured 3 more days of attempts by a Eye Surgeon to remove the remaining debris that was high velocity splattered into my eye. I contacted Federal with the Data and Facts of the incident and gave them the LOT # of the primers. I buy my primers by the case and keep very accurate load and performance data on every single round I load and fire! As a 50 year extremely loyal customer of Federal and using their products exclusively I was a bit put off at the treatment I received from their Tech's. NOTHING is what I received! As soon as I stated I was a Hand-Loader they SHUT UP COMPLETELY! I informed them that I had NO INTENTION of any legal action against them and that I was still going to use their products; I simply wanted some sort of explanation or comment on the mishap! If anyone ever needs to call FEDERAL Tech's with a complaint or questions the validity of their products, DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME! All you do is WAIT on HOLD, then LISTEN to KEYS TYPING as YOU speak, then TOTAL SILENCE as YOU WAIT FOR A REPLY or ANSWER! I mean I GOT NOTHING! Not a frigging WORD! So you ask me my opinion, IT was the PRIMERS if you're absolutely certain that your case prep was correct, your primer seating was correct, your charge and loading of the case was exact, and the bullet and seating of it matched the records of your prior SAFELY FIRED loads and your data charts at the range noting temp, elev., and humidity, ect., ect. WHAT ELSE COULD IT BE? I and I suggest YOU Thank the LORD that you did NOT endure the PAIN and near BLINDING or FAR WORSE INJURY I sustained off of what can and will ONLY be ATTRIBUTED to FAULTY FEDERAL Primers by ME and my GUNSMITH! Theosmithjr
Well. I destroyed my 300 RUM today.
Yesterday I was testing some load development on my 300 RUM with Berger 230 with Retumbo.
Everything went well and found a load that appeared to group well. 86.8 gr. COL of 3.600" Federal 215 primers on Hornady Brass.
The temps were 3 degrees and a slight breeze bringing the windchill temps down to -15.
I went home and loaded a few more rounds at that charge and try a couple other loads.
Today it was -10 with a 20mph wind. For some reason no one else was at the range. I fired 20 rounds of 190gr Nosler Accubonds to make sure that everything was working well and to warm myself up a bit. I am getting about 3100 fps out of the 190s with Retumbo at 91.5gr
20 rounds fired and not a single issue. I was firing a 2 rounds then I would let it sit for few minutes and fire other rifles.
About an hour into it I then switched over to the 230 grain rounds. I fired the first round. 3129fps and I couldn't lift the bolt. Something was seriously wrong. I broke off the bolt handle trying to open it at the range hitting it with my hand trying to open the action.
I took the rifle to my local smith and I attempted to get the bolt out. After three hours f trying everything under the sun, No luck. There is a picture of the results:
It was very difficult to put the gun on a band saw and cut it apart.
To say the least I am not happy. A perfectly good rifle is now a pile of scrap.
I went home and pulled all the bullets to check the powder charges. I used a two different scales and I was within .1 grain of what I loaded.
I don't know what happened. Obviously over pressured. It was 3 degrees out when I tested the rounds and it was only -10 today. There were no pressure sings, no cratered primers, nothing that would indicate that there were any issues on that same load the day before.
What a great way to end the year. I guess I will be looking for a new rifle in the new year.
Theosmithjr,
I almost hate to ask, but were you wearing glasses or any sort of eye protection?
That is truly a scary story.
I almost hate to ask, but were you wearing glasses or any sort of eye protection?
That is truly a scary story.
Dude, just send it back to Remington with the fired case. They don't know if it was factory or handloads. You'd be surprised that they would probably replace the barreled action. Always deal with the manufacturer first. They don't want the liability. It would cost them a couple hundreed dollars for a barreled action. They may offer to replace the barreled action for you cheap if they don't cover it fully. !!!
Bigaldepr
Well-Known Member
Looks like low temperature embrittlement to me. It broke at the receiver which does not get much heat from each firing and cools down quickly. Pronounced embrittlement occurs at -40F but is still a factor at -15F. Barrels and receivers are cold worked in the first place to make them hard but this also makes the steel brittle. Low temperature embrittlement does not affect the ultimate strength of steel but makes it susceptible shock loading, like igniting 86.8 grains of Retumbo behind a 230 grain bullet. Look it up "Low Temperature Embrittlement."
Predator 22
Well-Known Member
It didn't break. It was cut with a bandsaw.
bigngreen
Well-Known Member
Can't believe I just read that!!
Scooterbum
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2016
- Messages
- 89
Well, like Gilda would say after a long speal, then getting brought up to speed.....
Never mind.,!
Never mind.,!
Me either. In the first place, that's dishonest. I wouldn't want to do any business with someone like that. In the second place, the manufacturer isn't that stupid.
In the bike world we call that a JRA. As in, I was just riding along and this wheel I bought from you just folded in half. People think they are being clever and going to get something for nothing, but the willingness to help someone out goes away pretty quick when they start playing that game.
