How to blowup your rifle

[Barrelnut]

I have thought about detonation, but wouldn't there be noise, recoil, and if enough, parts departing?

The OP got 3129 FSP out of the 230 Gr bullet! That's faster than the 190 gr bullet load he had. So yea, I bet he had some recoil.

It wasn't a squib load but acted in a similar fashion due to erratic ignition of the powder. It just wasn't like a full detonitation that would blow the action apart.

 

[Bowfishn]

I use the word detonation only to describe a rapid increase in pressure causing powder to burn at higher rate than normal creating pressure and speed.

 

[Winkfish]

I agree with the information provided from the manufactures. In most cases I would suspect they would point to another component being the issue. It is good to get all the viewpoints from the manufactures and them make an assessment based on all the information available.

As a side note: Hodgdon representatives stated that they have seen both low/weak initiation as well as high pressure spikes with the Federal 215 primer in sub zero operations. They indicated that Remington and Winchester primers did not produce the same results in like conditions.

We can file that as one vendor checked off the list. I will be giving Federal a call next and get their opinion.

 

[bigngreen]

The detonation is just the whole powder column going at once vs a burn, the ones I've seen you could hear a very definite difference in the ignition, like a flint lock, hammer drop small pop then a large ignition accompanied by a puff out the action.
Powder bridging is also bad juju but I don't get that as a cause here with the 30 cal hole, fresh reload and a common powder for that case.

 

[BEEMAN]

I don't know about the Federal primers being the problem. Me and my friend only shoot Federal GM 215M in the -20 to -30C temps I posted about earlier. Never had a problem. All our guns that use a magnum primer are Federal GM 215M. Not saying that it couldn't be a problem, but we've never experienced it.

 

[Winkfish]

I think all components are a variable. That was just the opinion of Hodgdon. I would guess that when I talk to Federal they would point to one of the other components or operator error as being the issue. I have used Federal primers in 308 and 223 (with Varget) in similar conditions without fail.

 

[bigngreen]

Shot an aweful lot of Fed 215 and Retumbo in cold weather. Though funky primer stuff can lead to a not ideal ignition!

 

[Scooterbum]

Wink,

How do u charge ur cases? Drop tube? If so, is it clear of foreign object?

 

[Pdvdh]

Buyer Beware !!!. If you talk to Federal, They will probably say it was the Hodgdon powder. Manufactures will never admit that there products were the problem.

It is good that you are doing follow-ups on this with the manufactures, but don't expect a lot. It is always the other guys fault or the owners responsibilities when all else fails.

J E CUSTOM

Yup. Doesn't hurt to ask them. But how many times does a company blame itself. How many times does a person blame himself. "I gave you the keys". "No, I gave YOU the keys."

And if you got Federal and Hodgdon at the same table together, they'd say it must have been the Hornady casings.

And if you got Federal, Hodgdon, and Hornady, all at the same table, they'd say it was Berger.

When all the reloading equipment suppliers are at the same table, they'd say it was Remington.

And when Remington's at the table, they'll say you must have overloaded the cartridge.

Which is the reason we'll never know what really happened, after the cartridge was fired, after the gun blew up, and after the band saw was put to use.

The ultimate mystery. It's like the big bull, the big buck, or the big fish, that got away. Who knows how big he was. As big as you want, because they're commonly gone forever.

 

[Trickymissfit]

Po Ackley Did that, purely to find out the effects of it. I don't know how far he went, but I know he fired a 8mm bullet in a 30/06 without catastrophic results. But back then, no one loaded to the max because there were many rifles that were not designed for anything more than
52 to 53,000 LUPs and many were around 48,000 LUPs (Lead units of Pressure).

Pre world war 2, Many of The old bolt guns with rear locking lugs, were notorious for blowing out the back of the action If loaded hard.

When Roy Weatherby decided to start manufacturing rifles He started with the Mauser action. Feeling he needed a stronger action for his Big cartridges, He designed the Mark 5 and the rest is history. He even had White Laboratory's do a destructive test on all commercial actions at the time to do a comparison of strength.

I have tried to get a copy of this Test, but it is proprietary and they cant release it. But ALL actions failed except the Mark 5. they over charged the cartridge with faster burning powder and blue all the actions up Destroying them. When the mark 5 was tested this way, It melted the case and brass flowed out all around the bolt locking it up but there were no failures that could cause injuries to a person other maybe a soiled pair of shorts.

The fact that the action did not fail, is testament to the strength of modern actions and gives cause to think about loading beyond the SAMME pressures (which we all have probably done at One time or another) I Have, but no longer now that we have better components and faster cartridges at normal pressures. Why abuse a good action and brass when a cartridge change will probably get you what you want
without excessive pressures that with ANY mistake could be disastrous .

J E CUSTOM

On Roy's desk sat a MK.V action made into a paper weight. Behind the door sat a barrel with a large bulge in the middle. That barrel was chambered in 300 Mag. The story goes that there was a squib shot leaving the bullet lodged in the barrel. Tey simply pushed it out with a full load .300 Mag. The bolt opened as if nothing was wrong. The action became his personal paper weight, and he kept the barrel behind the door. I know several folks that have seen the action and the barrel. There was another example in Dan Wesson's office. I know two or three guys that have seen that one as well.
gary

 

[Scooterbum]

I don't know about the Federal primers being the problem. Me and my friend only shoot Federal GM 215M in the -20 to -30C temps I posted about earlier. Never had a problem. All our guns that use a magnum primer are Federal GM 215M. Not saying that it couldn't be a problem, but we've never experienced it.

I bet u hafta wear her mukluks, doncha !

Eh ?

 

[BEEMAN]

You gotta wear everything you own! Still cold. Wonder why we live here sometimes.

 

[LongRange338]

A couple questions I haven't seen answered yet:

-How many rounds fired since cleaning barrel?

-Please describe cleaning regimen used and products used.

-Was brass trimmed to length?

-Factory or custom barrel?

Could a "donut" of copper and carbon fouling and possibly a long case neck crimping down on the bullet have caused this much of a pressure spike?

Interesting thread and certainly happy for OP that the rifle was the only casualty

 

[Winkfish]

As to how I charge the cases. I have one cartridge holder with primed and ready to go cases and one that is empty. I move one case over then I individually weigh each charge on a scale. Once the charge is ready I have a small powder funnel that I place over the mouth of the case. I then pour in the powder. Move the next case over and repeat. I do small batches, 20-50 max. In this instance it was just 20 rounds in total.

There were about 50 rounds down the barrel since the last cleaning.

As for cleaning agents I use a combination of Gunslick pro foaming bore cleaner, Hoppe's Elite Gun Cleaner and Hoppe's #9 in various combinations.

The barrel is factory.

I measured the cases and they were within spec.