Hard/impossible extraction Rem 700

[kevinmorgan]

Serial numbers that start with RR is when it all went sideways for the most part.

Thanks

 

[okie22br]

Serial numbers that start with RR is when it all went sideways for the most part.

Yes, I agree with the RR serial # actions having issues. I had a Rem 700 with an RR serial number in 22-250 and it wouldn't even extract a fired factory ammo load. It would chamber the round just fine, but after firing it was almost impossible to extract the case. Come to find out the bolt handle was tigged onto the bolt just a touch out of battery. Ended up ordering a new one piece bolt from PTG and got lucky that I didn't have to have the headspace changed.

 

[25WSM]

I've been seeing some real straight remmies lately. Most have been within .002 and most of the old ones were .004 to .005. I just wish they would get their act together and put that bolt handle where it belongs. How freaking hard is it to put it in the right spot.
Shep

 

[243winxb]

Action timing?

 

[Kiwi Greg]

Thanks for the replies Guys
It is a 6.5 Saum, this rifle has a Shillen #2 or similar profile barrel with carbon stock & easily shoots sub 1/2 moa & always has, quite impressive for such a light rifle.
It doesn't appear to be overloaded, but I don't have access to the brass, which has only been fired in the rifle.
I can't get a bore scope into the rifle as I don't currently have it.
It wouldn't easily extract two bits of fired brass I got back with the rifle at one stage.
I realised the brass was dirty & probably the chamber was as well so gave the chamber a clean & quick polish with Autosol, after which the dirty brass extracted flawlessly
I think after a year or so the chamber is dirty again possibly due to cleaning fluid contamination or water etc (this is a hunting rifle) or the stuff off dirty brass being forced into the chamber again, seems to have be happening since the rifle was built
The owner is adamant it is solely a primary extraction issue
I find this hard to believe considering the brass was left behind in the chamber when the bolt was opened & hit back,
In my opinion no amount of primary extraction will help if the case is stuck so firmly in the chamber that the rim is torn off or the extractor cams over it, requiring a cleaning rod to remove it from the chamber ?
Your thoughts ?
Can the Rem 700 primary extraction cams be hurt/damaged by repeated abuse ?

 

[243winxb]

I would look at the extractor . There are old & new types, plus a 3th, if i remember correctly?

https://www.midwayusa.com/s?userSearchQuery=Remington+extractors&userItemsPerPage=48

 

[Edd]

You have described two issues.

"Hit back" is one of them. The bolt shouldn't have to be "hit back". If it lifts to the stop, the primary extraction cam should have already moved it back far enough to loosen the case in the chamber. At this point you should be able to point the muzzle to the sky and it shouldn't take much more than gravity to open the bolt and eject the case.

"Ripping the rim off" is another. If you are "ripping the rim off" your case is stuck in the chamber. The reason why will have to be determined by someone in possession of the rifle and brass.

 

[243winxb]

the stuff off dirty brass being forced into the chamber

Just how dirty. A bad combinitaion of components can produce strange results & secondary pressure spikes.

To clean up a loading- Mag primer, faster burn rate powder, increase neck tension, seat bullet deeper into the neck, shorter COL.

 

[STI]

Funny thing the Internet I stumbled across this thread turns and it out its regarding my actual rifle, a Remington M700SA in 6.5RSAUM. It has a Serial number in the RR series

This thread has made interesting reading

The rifle was quoted for and built 2014 exactly as quoted. All parts were new and none supplied by me. The rifle was to be my "hunting rifle" and as such is only used 3maybe 4 times a year to fill the freezer. (I have other rifles for range shooting.)

It shot the load, supplied with the rifle superbly for some time, then began to have extraction issues and I found the solder was letting go where the bolt body / handle were joined. ( I believe there were primary extraction issues encountered during the build)

It was sent away to be fixed by the supplier and then my extraction issues appeared.
(Pretty much exactly as described by Oki22br above)

Since then the bolt handle has been re-soldered , screwed and finally last time tigg'd on, I do not believe the welding job was well executed at all.
I could post a picture but that is unfair on the supplier as he personally did not to the work I believe.
I firmly believe the issue is primary extraction related and quite possibly made worse as the result of repair attempts.

If I look closely on the extraction cam's I cannot see any evidence, they actually meet or contact at any point in the extraction cycle. There are no polish marks on either surface which would indicate they have been in contact.

I replaced All my brass after the last repair attempt on the recommendation of the builder/supplier, but issue persists. I cannot try factory ammunition as there is none available.

The rifle was only worked on by the supplier or his gunsmith(s), until just recently, see below.

I no longer have the rifle in my possession currently, it has been sent to an independent gunsmith for repair at my cost as I feel 3-4 attempts by the supplier, over time, for a successful resolution is more than fair.

I have since purchased a new rifle to use for hunting but do not feel I should have to just scrap the SAUM as a bad experience and cannot sell a problem rifle to someone unsuspecting.
FWIW

If its somehow my fault then he will get an apology in person

 

[Kiwi Greg]

You have described two issues.

"Hit back" is one of them. The bolt shouldn't have to be "hit back". If it lifts to the stop, the primary extraction cam should have already moved it back far enough to loosen the case in the chamber. At this point you should be able to point the muzzle to the sky and it shouldn't take much more than gravity to open the bolt and eject the case.

"Ripping the rim off" is another. If you are "ripping the rim off" your case is stuck in the chamber. The reason why will have to be determined by someone in possession of the rifle and brass.

The Rem 700 doesn't have a high surface area cam like the Defiance for instance & isn't as aggressive.

With the brass constantly being tight in the chamber the cam would probably be being overworked until a case is stuck, then something has to give & the extractor is overworked damaging the brass.

Previously when the chamber was cleaned & lightly polished the problem disappeared & the rifle functioned as it should, returned to the happy customer, then over time the problem comes back again.

This problem has probably been happening for the life of the rifle with the bolt handle showing signs of being repeated hit, the last time it was fixed the bolt handle was tig welded in place with plenty of heat so it wouldn't try to come off again when abused

Just how dirty. A bad combination of components can produce strange results & secondary pressure spikes.

The brass is just dirty from use, doesn't appear to have been cleaned after after multiple reloads, when fired the residue on the cases will be pushed onto the chamber



The Suam case has a much larger surface area & less taper than say a 223, 308 case so all these problems are amplified

 

[STI]

With out getting into an argument the bolt has never been "hit" with anything ................ever.

 

[25WSM]

Put a feeler guage between front of bolt handle and the receiver. Tell us how big that gap is. The smaller the better.
Shep

 

[Edd]

Funny thing the Internet I stumbled across this thread turns and it out its regarding my actual rifle, a Remington M700SA in 6.5RSAUM. It has a Serial number in the RR series

This thread has made interesting reading

The rifle was quoted for and built 2014 exactly as quoted. All parts were new and none supplied by me. The rifle was to be my "hunting rifle" and as such is only used 3maybe 4 times a year to fill the freezer. (I have other rifles for range shooting.)

It shot the load, supplied with the rifle superbly for some time, then began to have extraction issues and I found the solder was letting go where the bolt body / handle were joined. ( I believe there were primary extraction issues encountered during the build)

It was sent away to be fixed by the supplier and then my extraction issues appeared.
(Pretty much exactly as described by Oki22br above)

Since then the bolt handle has been re-soldered , screwed and finally last time tigg'd on, I do not believe the welding job was well executed at all.
I could post a picture but that is unfair on the supplier as he personally did not to the work I believe.
I firmly believe the issue is primary extraction related and quite possibly made worse as the result of repair attempts.

If I look closely on the extraction cam's I cannot see any evidence, they actually meet or contact at any point in the extraction cycle. There are no polish marks on either surface which would indicate they have been in contact.

I replaced All my brass after the last repair attempt on the recommendation of the builder/supplier, but issue persists. I cannot try factory ammunition as there is none available.

The rifle was only worked on by the supplier or his gunsmith(s), until just recently, see below.

I no longer have the rifle in my possession currently, it has been sent to an independent gunsmith for repair at my cost as I feel 3-4 attempts by the supplier, over time, for a successful resolution is more than fair.

I have since purchased a new rifle to use for hunting but do not feel I should have to just scrap the SAUM as a bad experience and cannot sell a problem rifle to someone unsuspecting.
FWIW

If its somehow my fault then he will get an apology in person

Are your case rims being ripped off?

 

[25WSM]

Your not ripping rims off without beating on that handle. If you are your the strongest person I know of.
Shep