Eradicate the Wolf???!

[Deleted member 107796]

I am seeing posts that essentially, call for the eradication of wolves, Any of us that hunt and consider ourselves conservationists in any way and part of a bigger system than ourselves, see about as much sense in that, as the eradication of the American bison. The biological system that God created, is in a balance and has been for much longer than humanity has existed. I came to the conclusion that I will never forgive those that used governmental policy and business interests to decimate the bison and just hope that each of us can look at what we see as a nuisance species and still see God's place for them.
Yeah, yeah, I know the place for them is at the tip of my 130gn GMX bullet, but you folks know what I'm saying. Cheers

 

[middleofnowhere]

With the amount of people we have now encroaching in the wilderness, it would be impossible to go back to a completely "natural" and balanced ecosystem. That said, there is a place for wolves and they need to be in our environment. They need to be managed, and if done properly, the management can provide valuable recreation and economic benefit.

Prediction: this thread will melt down pretty quickly when the wolf "exterminationst" jump on board LOL.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

It simply can't and won't happen. They are here to stay.

 

[Deleted member 107796]

Steve, I should've added 130gn Hammer!
That last sentence of yours is strong.

 

[TG-5150]

God bless the wolf.....sick to stomach.......barffff

 

[Pdvdh]

Human behavior seems to swing to extremes, like a pendulum. The pro-wolfers have had their way. Now we see wolf control starting to make it's way.
But getting rid of wolves is unlikely, unless government climbs aboard. As has been mentioned, I don't see that happening.

Wildlife management and natural resource management is all designed to mess with the natural order of nature (God's balance). It generally provides benefits to human beings, otherwise the practice would not have persisted. We've been effectively messing with God's natural order for at least a century now. Whether your opinion is it's for the better or worse, those management practices will continue.

 

[TG-5150]

Human behavior seems to swing to extremes, like a pendulum. The pro-wolfers have had their way. Now we see wolf control starting to make it's way.
But getting rid of wolves is unlikely, unless government climbs aboard. As has been mentioned, I don't see that happening.

Wildlife management and natural resource management is all designed to mess with the natural order of nature (God's balance). It generally provides benefits to human beings, otherwise the practice would not have persisted. We've been effectively messing with God's natural order for at least a century now. Whether your opinion is it's for the better or worse, those management practices will continue.

Well put.
I grew up in the very N.W. corner of Montana. I remember being maybe about ten, I was with my dad. He was bear hunting and I got to call every black stump a bear and shoot grouse with my .22. We came across some tracks in the skiff of snow that was on the road. I asked if they were lion tracks, my dad said no, that they were wolf and he hadn't seen any in several years and that they drift down from Canada from time to time. He then explains what they do to conservation in a conservative ecosystem. It stuck with me. That's how it was till wolves got reintroduced.
The rest of my youth and up till the late nineties, things were like that. You hardly ever saw the tracks. Unless you were a cat hunter, trapper or snowmobiler. I was all three, myself and several friends tried the "Three S's". It never worked. In the three counties we ran you could feel the wolf population squeeze in on the game like the volume going up on a rap song, not being able to shut it down.

Edited for some grammar

 

[clyancey]

Several posts have vaguely referenced "God's natural order" with surrounding context that implies God's command to Adam does not exsist. Just to clarify for those beholding to the Bible as the sole source of Truth, God commanded Adam to have DOMINION over all creation as well as to utilize and steward everything. This makes sense when you keep humans (the recieviers) as the penicle of Gods creation and dont elevate the gift (nature/creation) over the reciever. Creation was created for humans, the highest/only creation to be created in God's image and have God's breath of eternal life breathed into him.

If you believe the Bible it simply isn't accurate to assign God's will or original intention to have man seperate from nature; quite the contrary. Genesis does not give command to needlessly destroy everything but the exact commands of dominion, stewardship, and intent for utilization are used (Genisis).

All that being said to Biblically justify Man's right and duty to impact God's creation, if we can feed more people with Elk meat in a near wolfless world and generate more funds for conservation in a near wolfless world why not? Given everthing comes with a tradeoff, do you actually believe as many conservation dollars can be generated by significantly declining game populations and their correlating hunters by offering up wolves in their place? The math simply does not support it. Hunters will never support it. Wolves give little to no meat, are exponentially fewer than the game populations they decimate and are exponentially harder to hunt (trapping is the only way to significantly influence their population). Ever consider that an all-knowing God built a resiliant ecosystem with a wolves as a place holder for humans eventual need/desire?

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Several posts have vaguely referenced "God's natural order" with surrounding context that implies God's command to Adam dont exsist. Just to clarify for those beholding to the Bible as the sole source of Truth, God commanded Adam to have DOMINION over all creation as well as to utilize and steward everything. This makes sense when you keep humans (the recieviers) as the penicle of Gods creation and dont elevate the gift (nature/creation) over the reciever. Creation was created for humans, the highest/only creation to be created in God's image and have God's breath of eternal life breathed into him.

If you believe the Bible it simply isn't accurate to assign God's will or original intention to have man seperate from nature; quite the contrary. Genesis does not give command to needlessly destroy everything but the exact commands of dominion, stewardship, and intent for utilization are used (Genisis).

All that being said to Biblically justify Man's right and duty to impact God's creation, if we can feed more people with Elk meat in a near wolfless world and generate more funds for conservation in a near wolfless world why not? Given everthing comes with a tradeoff, do actually believe as many consrvation dollars can be generated by significantly declining game populations and their correlating hunters by offering up wolves in their place? The math simply will never support it. Hunters will never support it. Wolves give little to no meat, are exponentially fewer than the game populations they decimate and are exponentially harder to hunt (trapping is the only way to significantly influence their population).

This was well said.

I am going to shorten it for the simple minded folk like me. To believe something different than this you would have to believe that everything on earth is here on purpose and humans are here on accident and do not belong.

 

[clyancey]

Bingo. That is their ultimate position whether they have thought that far or not.

 

[hrnhntr]

The problem with "gods balance" being spoken about here is this is not the wolf that was eradicated before. Those are extinct. As mentioned above, humans mess with everything trying to fix what they messed up. In this case introducing the much larger timber wolf. These wolves made their living up north on moose. So when introduced to Yellowstone the deer, elk, moose and now even bison have suffered. I have many friends and a couple outfitters I know in the area who can attest to how few elk and moose they see now days. The wolf population has been well over population objectives since well before they started working to de-list them. Unless the government poisons the pups in their dens they will never be eradicated. I'm not saying eradicate, but the population needs to be reduced substantially or that entire ecosystem is going to crash. There used to be in excess of 20k elk on the elk refuge in the winter. Now it's somewhere around 5k.

 

[hrnhntr]

Several posts have vaguely referenced "God's natural order" with surrounding context that implies God's command to Adam does not exsist. Just to clarify for those beholding to the Bible as the sole source of Truth, God commanded Adam to have DOMINION over all creation as well as to utilize and steward everything. This makes sense when you keep humans (the recieviers) as the penicle of Gods creation and dont elevate the gift (nature/creation) over the reciever. Creation was created for humans, the highest/only creation to be created in God's image and have God's breath of eternal life breathed into him.

If you believe the Bible it simply isn't accurate to assign God's will or original intention to have man seperate from nature; quite the contrary. Genesis does not give command to needlessly destroy everything but the exact commands of dominion, stewardship, and intent for utilization are used (Genisis).

All that being said to Biblically justify Man's right and duty to impact God's creation, if we can feed more people with Elk meat in a near wolfless world and generate more funds for conservation in a near wolfless world why not? Given everthing comes with a tradeoff, do you actually believe as many conservation dollars can be generated by significantly declining game populations and their correlating hunters by offering up wolves in their place? The math simply does not support it. Hunters will never support it. Wolves give little to no meat, are exponentially fewer than the game populations they decimate and are exponentially harder to hunt (trapping is the only way to significantly influence their population). Ever consider that an all-knowing God built a resiliant ecosystem with a wolves as a place holder for humans eventual need/desire?

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Prey animal numbers fall, wolf numbers fall. Prey animal numbers rise, wolf numbers rise. And on it will go in that manner. It doesn't balance out it continues to bounce. We had great game numbers and the wolf population exploded. We have wolves now in greater numbers than I think were expected by all. With that said I am seeing less wolf sign than I used to. So maybe we are bouncing the other way now.

 

[trhall]

I am seeing posts that essentially, call for the eradication of wolves, Any of us that hunt and consider ourselves conservationists in any way and part of a bigger system than ourselves, see about as much sense in that, as the eradication of the American bison. The biological system that God created, is in a balance and has been for much longer than humanity has existed. I came to the conclusion that I will never forgive those that used governmental policy and business interests to decimate the bison and just hope that each of us can look at what we see as a nuisance species and still see God's place for them.
Yeah, yeah, I know the place for them is at the tip of my 130gn GMX bullet, but you folks know what I'm saying. Cheers

I don't want to eradicate the wolves and grizzlies but I do want their numbers GREATLY reduced. The problem that most people have with them and get emotional about is that the number have FAR exceeded what was sold to us as the sustainable population objective and now greatly impact our elk and moose herds.