before you drop the hammer you should think of all the things that will change.ih oregon the so called fear of life and limb defense will not fly.if you have or had the chance to flee you must,or go to court.that will cost you and that is a debt you can not recover.we have been taken over by the so called do gooders from cali.so think about what is going to follow the shot.our law and order has changed now it is all about money and they will take take it if you shoot some one.
Don't think it can't happen to you.
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T3-OleMan
Well-Known Member
That rings a bell! "Back in the day" (1964) I asked the top Fed Judge in CharlieSouth "when, in self defence, can I kill another person without worry about the hassel of the law and the courts". His words "WHEN YOU CAN RETREAT NO FURTHER"! Some states may require you to flee till you can't, but a threat can improve their odds while you are running away. Thats the problem and it can cost alot $$$$$ to keep your rights. FIGHT or FLIGHT, like good old v p Joe would say..... is a "BIG F~N DEAL"!
Footnote: "If you break your arm in three places-stay out of those places".
We don't get to pick the time or places so good luck to all.
Truer words were never said. Having the shooting skills is only half the battle.
More importantly or at least just as important is to learn what and how to say things WHEN something happens. Massod Ayoob has several good books and videos that cost less than a gun(for all of them) but will save you $100,000 to fight criminal charges.
Know which lawyer you would call if you needed one?
Never, never, never carry reloads, carry only factory top quality self defense ammo.
Learn rules of self defense. if the aggressor raises hands or starts to retreat; what can you legally do?
Keep shooting, but learn the skills that will keep you out of jail.
BH
padd54
Well-Known Member
I read Oregon law differently, here is a case that shows there is NO Duty to Retreat; http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/ORSCSelfDefense.pdf
Now, if there has been a change in the law since, i stand corrected.
I'm glad you had a good outcome with your bluff. I have had several instances over the years that the "bluff" worked but my hand was actually on the grip. I have never had to clear leather and that is just fine with me.
There was one time though that was not life and death but just funny. I got home from work and started a construction job on my house when i saw a groundhog out back that I was after for weeks. So I sneeked and crawled and got into close range, reached down for the .38 that is always so comfortable in my waistband only to find a tape measure, yep, the 38 was on top of the fridge!! Shortly after I got a .22 for the back pocket.
There was one time though that was not life and death but just funny. I got home from work and started a construction job on my house when i saw a groundhog out back that I was after for weeks. So I sneeked and crawled and got into close range, reached down for the .38 that is always so comfortable in my waistband only to find a tape measure, yep, the 38 was on top of the fridge!! Shortly after I got a .22 for the back pocket.
ss7mm
Well-Known Member
Yup, it's kind of hard to pop a chuck with a tape measure.
milanuk
Well-Known Member
Would you go for the higher velocity of a 12 footer, or the higher BC of 50?
ss7mm
Well-Known Member
Ammo is kind of expensive if you are shooting 50 footers so I'd go with the 12' since it's short range stuff.
Kevin Thomas
Well-Known Member
Okay, so long as we're talking about ultimate dumbasses here, I've got one for y'all. I was at the scene of a burglary late one night, hanging out of a window and dusting for prints. From about a block away, I heard the heavy booms of several large caliber pistol shots. I called to see if our air unit was still up (it was), and asked for a fly by near the corner (Holt and Hershey) where I'd heard the shots. About 30-45 seconds later, I heard the chopper, followed closely by the big wobbly light from the sky. Over my radio, I heard the air crew note that there was a subject down at the intersection, and asked to roll another ground unit. In time, they added a request for a homicide unit on scene. I finsihed up the burglary, and made my way over to the other units. There on the ground near a phone booth was one of our local gang bangers, sporting several recently implanted large caliber holes in his chest and torso, now obviously deceased. Tragic to see such a thing. A promising future as a career criminal, cut short by senseless violence. It was in a deserted parking lot of a muffler shop, obviously closed at this time of the evening. No other witnesses, no suspect, nothing else at the scene.
About a week later, one of our traffic units stopped a guy for some petty violation, tail lights, registration, something like that. As the officer was approaching the rear quarter panel of the vehicle, the driver suddenly stuck his head out the window and began proclaiming (LOUDLY!) "I didn't mean to kill him, really I didn't!" Whoa. Time out, let's go back to the begining and talk this over. The guy was hooked up and taken down to the station. Seems that he was in that phone booth the week before, when he looked up and saw two of our local gangbangers coming towards him from 25-30 yards out. They split apart, and continued to advance on him, now trapping him in the phone booth. Having been the recent victim of yet another robbery a few weeks earlier, he clearly recognized what was up, and had taken to carrying a .45 since the previous incident. As the two Vato Locos drew closer, our late hero hit him up with "Hey man, how much money you got on you? Let's see it now!" Out came the 45, held down, and still not pointed at our two heros. Upon seeing the gun, and being apparently insulted that the victim had the audacity not to play the game fairly, hero #1 became righteously indignant about this new development. Fixing him with a steely eyed glare, he shifted into macho overdrive (a very bad idea) and declared, "You gonna pull a fookin' gun on me, you better USE IT!" What followed were the shots that I'd heard, as Vato #1 probably had a micro-second or two to regret his poor choice of words before suffering a dramatic case of lead poisoning. Vato #2 suddenly decided he needed to be somewhere else, and promptly headed that way at high speed. Apparently remembering that he, too, had a gun, he fired a shot or two over his shoulder as he hauled *** outta the AO. He copped to this after we rounded him up a few days later, and confirmed the victims account of the story right down the line. You wouldn't believe how indignant he sounded, all because some victim turned the tables on them.
Granted, the guy shouldn't have left the scene, but the DA considered the fact that he was scared for his life at the moment, and acted under great duress in the instant. He wasn't prosecuted for anything, and was released with a copy of the DA's rejection to prosecute, free and clear. Anyway, that's become my Number One phrase of the worst things to have carved on your tombstone; "You gonna pull a fookin' gun on me, you better use it!", especially when uttered while you're currently engaged in the commission of a felony for which the victim has every legal right in the world to shoot you graveyard dead, right then and there. Man but there are times whe I really miss police work!
About a week later, one of our traffic units stopped a guy for some petty violation, tail lights, registration, something like that. As the officer was approaching the rear quarter panel of the vehicle, the driver suddenly stuck his head out the window and began proclaiming (LOUDLY!) "I didn't mean to kill him, really I didn't!" Whoa. Time out, let's go back to the begining and talk this over. The guy was hooked up and taken down to the station. Seems that he was in that phone booth the week before, when he looked up and saw two of our local gangbangers coming towards him from 25-30 yards out. They split apart, and continued to advance on him, now trapping him in the phone booth. Having been the recent victim of yet another robbery a few weeks earlier, he clearly recognized what was up, and had taken to carrying a .45 since the previous incident. As the two Vato Locos drew closer, our late hero hit him up with "Hey man, how much money you got on you? Let's see it now!" Out came the 45, held down, and still not pointed at our two heros. Upon seeing the gun, and being apparently insulted that the victim had the audacity not to play the game fairly, hero #1 became righteously indignant about this new development. Fixing him with a steely eyed glare, he shifted into macho overdrive (a very bad idea) and declared, "You gonna pull a fookin' gun on me, you better USE IT!" What followed were the shots that I'd heard, as Vato #1 probably had a micro-second or two to regret his poor choice of words before suffering a dramatic case of lead poisoning. Vato #2 suddenly decided he needed to be somewhere else, and promptly headed that way at high speed. Apparently remembering that he, too, had a gun, he fired a shot or two over his shoulder as he hauled *** outta the AO. He copped to this after we rounded him up a few days later, and confirmed the victims account of the story right down the line. You wouldn't believe how indignant he sounded, all because some victim turned the tables on them.
Granted, the guy shouldn't have left the scene, but the DA considered the fact that he was scared for his life at the moment, and acted under great duress in the instant. He wasn't prosecuted for anything, and was released with a copy of the DA's rejection to prosecute, free and clear. Anyway, that's become my Number One phrase of the worst things to have carved on your tombstone; "You gonna pull a fookin' gun on me, you better use it!", especially when uttered while you're currently engaged in the commission of a felony for which the victim has every legal right in the world to shoot you graveyard dead, right then and there. Man but there are times whe I really miss police work!
This thread has really been something; there's been instances that I'm laughing so hard
and instances where I'm so upset that I considered wise not to post. This garbage about
"run until you can run no more" is not my cup of tea. I'm a peaceful man by all means, but
will protect my self and my loved ones from any threat. I will deal with the consequences
after the facts. There has been some great advises and I appreciate that but the ups and
downs of my blood pressure I'm beginning to think I'll sue my friend Dick!!!
Just kidding buddy!!!
Good postings!
and instances where I'm so upset that I considered wise not to post. This garbage about
"run until you can run no more" is not my cup of tea. I'm a peaceful man by all means, but
will protect my self and my loved ones from any threat. I will deal with the consequences
after the facts. There has been some great advises and I appreciate that but the ups and
downs of my blood pressure I'm beginning to think I'll sue my friend Dick!!!
Just kidding buddy!!!
Good postings!
ss7mm
Well-Known Member
This thread has really been something; there's been instances that I'm laughing so hard
and instances where I'm so upset that I considered wise not to post. This garbage about
"run until you can run no more" is not my cup of tea. I'm a peaceful man by all means, but
will protect my self and my loved ones from any threat. I will deal with the consequences
after the facts. There has been some great advises and I appreciate that but the ups and
downs of my blood pressure I'm beginning to think I'll sue my friend Dick!!!
Just kidding buddy!!!
Good postings!
I agree, I'm too old to run and I'm more stubborn than old. Like you my friend, I'll deal with whatever happens.
Go ahead and sue me Javier but remember, you can't get blood from a turnip.
