Deer camp and Win vs Rem debate

[reloaderlen]

Last year while at deer camp the old Winchester or Remington which is better came up , of course me being a diehard Remington fan stuck by its side . Out of nine men five were Rem fans
Two were Win one Savage and one Sako. Caliber debate is another story another time . Well after hours of sitting by the fire and a few beverages down the hatch a wealthy friend of mine Larry spoke up and said we will settle this once and for all. His plan was to purchase two rifles from each
Win and Remington as close to the same specs as each other. Same mounts ,glass etc . Test fire them stock then glass bed and float the barrels plus after market triggers .

Winchester Batco
Model 70 300 Win super grade
Model 70 300 Win extreme weather

Remington
700 BDL 300 Win
700 sendero 300 Win
Leupold mark 4 /LR 4.5-14x50 30mm
Leupold base and rings
The scopes and bases were all things Larry had new on hand .
We loaded 165 gn hornady interbond
With 75 gn RL 22 and fed primers
We tested each gun firing three cold bore shots then three back to back .
All at 100 yards .
Here are the results

Win mod 70 super
Cold = 2.35 BTB= 2.75
Win= mod 70 extreme
Cold =1.45 BTB= 2.15

Rem 700 Bdl
Cold=1.62 BTB 2.10
Rem 700 sendero
Cold = 1.24 BTB 1.64

Yes just as I said all along Rem the
Clear winner .
We glassed and pillar bed the super grade and Bdl Timmey triggers
Skim bed the extreme and sendero
And triggers for them too .
Back to the range
Win mod 70 super
Cold =.545 BTB=1.19
Win mod 70 extreme
Cold=.325 BTB= .429

Rem 700 Bdl
Cold =.830 BTB=1.65
Rem 700 Sendero
Cold=1.00 BTB=1.28

It took a year to do all of this on our free time and a local Smith did all the bedding.
Days at the range were same weather conditions within a few degrees of each other. Larry and I both tested each rifle and came up with the same
Results on a average.
As much as I can't stand it I will eat Crow and admit that Win Won !
Makes me sick ! We did do further testing with other bullets , seating depts and powders and I will tell you that I will be posting a couple of Remington's up for sale to fund a new
Winchester Extreme Weather!

 

[nwmnbowhunter]

What is skim bedding? That you did on the extreme?

Thanks

 

[oldno7]

So you found a good load for the Win's. but not the Rem's.

 

[TexSavage]

Glad you didn't throw a Savage in the frey, that crow might have shown up twice at the dinner table, er campfire, er adult beverage time.

 

[reloaderlen]

No matter what powder or bullets we used the Win out preformed the Rems. Yes all the rifles preformed well
enough for hunting but bottom line is the Win won hands down . I think Remington's quality has fallen over the past 20 years. I have plenty of older Remington's that will put shoot these .
The skim bedding is done on stocks that have aluminum bedding blocks
Just shave off some stock material around the action and then glass it with devcon. Not as much required as a wood stock .
We are already working on a Savage vs Tikka in 270 wsm , should be done by May. Nice to have a friend with money to blow. I hope he stays single
If he gets married the fun is over lol

 

[FatBoy...]

I have had this debate as well, with guys just getting into shooting mostly. The vast majority of my rifles have custom actions and none have stock barrels except my 788. Accuracy has never been a selling point, as I think out of the box they are both about the same and neither has good twist rates.

I personally prefer M70s. I like the integral lug. I like the simplicity of the trigger. I like the 3 position safety and the functions it allows. like that it's not going to fire when I take it off safe and to a lesser degree, I like the sweep and feel of the bolt handle. That said...

I generally steer new guys toward M700s or clones if they won't pony up to a custom action. Most of my buddies will eventually upgrade the parts on the rifle and there are 100 M700 stocks out there for every m70 and these guys have zero patience.

Funny the things we will dedicate time towards....

 

[reloaderlen]

Yes I have a few customs and countless factory with up graded stocks and triggers. Glass that cost as much as a custom. Funny thing is I only hunt with one The same one doesn't mater what I'm after big game that is. I do have just one for 100 yards and less. Some how I just want more. I lay awake and can't sleep at times just thinking how I can improve what I have or build it better next time . Lol.
The money spent on a high end factory rifle will get you a custom in
10 months or less just the way you want it . Dream it now and have it next season.

 

[Capt RB]

The longer tenon of the Win and the flat bedding surface also make for a better fast twist build. If smiths would start building on the howa/vangard action you would see alot of builders like them for a factory action build. Just because of the options you don't need to upgrade alone. The longer box doesn't suck either

 

[1100 Remington Man]

Call me crazy I like both.
.223 Rem 700 VSII
6mm Rem 700BDL
.264 Win Model 70 XTR
300 H & H Model 70 prewar

I like the Safety on the Model 70XTR the best, I like the Magazine release on the Model 700 the best.
I like the Stock trigger on my Model 70XTR the best. There both Winners
I also have a Ruger 77/17HMR which is a great rifle, did a wright up on it here.