Carbon fiber weight savings

[waveslayer]

If the performance outweighed the cost you'd see these on the firing line... not so much. Did you just say a proof is lighter than a sporter barrel?

Not sure what firing line you are on, but you do see them and a lot! even several special forces units run Proof Carbon barrels. Several of the top PRS and 3 Gun run carbon barrels as well. Most shooters are slow to transition from what they have always known. So not seeing on "your" firing line isn't abnormal. I see them all the time.

as for weight a 24" Sendero Proof weighs about 2.8 pounds... How much does your sporter weigh? My 26" Sendero Proof weighs about 3.2 with a tad longer chambering to support my Warbird.

 

[ohiohunter]

Not sure what firing line you are on, but you do see them and a lot! even several special forces units run Proof Carbon barrels. Several of the top PRS and 3 Gun run carbon barrels as well. Most shooters are slow to transition from what they have always known. So not seeing on "your" firing line isn't abnormal. I see them all the time.

as for weight a 24" Sendero Proof weighs about 2.8 pounds... How much does your sporter weigh? My 26" Sendero Proof weighs about 3.2 with a tad longer chambering to support my Warbird.

Your "several"= less than 10%... most people call that "some".

Zero in Fclass, and highly doubt any in BR. You're saying 2" of proof barrel weighs nearly 1/2lb? Most people aren't going to drop $1k per barrel especially when they're running hot 6mm's getting less than 2000rnds/barrel. My point is why drop $1000 on a barrel (that will not last forever) to save weight while you're running a toad of a stock.


Fluting is subjective, a lot of variables to throw a blanket statement on them as you did. Yes they will be less stiff than the original barrel, but it will be stiffer than smaller diameter at same length.

As for POI shift, there shouldn't be any.

 

[waveslayer]

Your "several"= less than 10%... most people call that "some".

Zero in Fclass, and highly doubt any in BR. You're saying 2" of proof barrel weighs nearly 1/2lb? Most people aren't going to drop $1k per barrel especially when they're running hot 6mm's getting less than 2000rnds/barrel. My point is why drop $1000 on a barrel (that will not last forever) to save weight while you're running a toad of a stock.


Fluting is subjective, a lot of variables to throw a blanket statement on them as you did. Yes they will be less stiff than the original barrel, but it will be stiffer than smaller diameter at same length.

As for POI shift, there shouldn't be any.

There is always a POI on some barrels, especially smaller diameter ones because of the heat and stress. So yes, there shouldn't be, but there is... Try it some time doing a 20 shot string quickly with a pencil barrel.

Fluting is not subject, facts are facts. So my throwing blanket statements are in fact actual data. Using your logic of the of smaller diameter, you will save a lot on weight and have less of a POI shift as you heat up the barrel using Christensen Arms barrels. because of the Carbon (weight savings and Heat dispersion)

You are correct, most people won't drop a ton of money, but those that are searching and asking about Carbon barrels as the OP asked would like some real life experience. A hunting gun won't see a lot of use, and the weight savings might be worth it, especially on the West coast, where tree stand hunting is almost non existent.

As for my earlier comments, most old timers have a hard time making any changes, especially in shooting. So F-Class not switching is no surprise, besides a heavier barrel isn't an issue, you are shooting F-Class. especially BR. BR should be using very large contour barrels... makes it easier to find a good load.

Bottom line, is the cost worth it? it all depends if it meets the needs of the shooter and makes sense... then yes, why not?

 

[ohiohunter]

There is always a POI on some barrels, especially smaller diameter ones because of the heat and stress. So yes, there shouldn't be, but there is... Try it some time doing a 20 shot string quickly with a pencil barrel.

Fluting is not subject, facts are facts. So my throwing blanket statements are in fact actual data. Using your logic of the of smaller diameter, you will save a lot on weight and have less of a POI shift as you heat up the barrel using Christensen Arms barrels. because of the Carbon (weight savings and Heat dispersion)

You are correct, most people won't drop a ton of money, but those that are searching and asking about Carbon barrels as the OP asked would like some real life experience. A hunting gun won't see a lot of use, and the weight savings might be worth it, especially on the West coast, where tree stand hunting is almost non existent.

As for my earlier comments, most old timers have a hard time making any changes, especially in shooting. So F-Class not switching is no surprise, besides a heavier barrel isn't an issue, you are shooting F-Class. especially BR. BR should be using very large contour barrels... makes it easier to find a good load.

Bottom line, is the cost worth it? it all depends if it meets the needs of the shooter and makes sense... then yes, why not?

Why would anyone run a 20rnd string on any hunting rifle? Furthermore I merely suggest a more economical method for lightening up his rig, based on the fact that at the moment a proof barrel exceeds the cost of his entire rifle. Sometimes the cool factor exceeds the functional and practical factors.

Yes fluting is subjective, plain and simple, and to think differently is obtuse. Barrel diameter, depth, # of flutes, style of flutes all factor into overall reduction. Yes you are correct its a matter of ounces but whats the difference between steel sporter at 2.8lbs, heavy sporter at 3.2lbs and sendero carbon 3.2lbs? ... ounces. BTW a proof sendero is less rigid than a standard sendero contour. To get the rigidity of a sendero you will need a full bull proof, even then I don't know if it is as stiff (haven't uncovered that info yet).

PRS isn't an old timers sport and carbon barrels, though common, are no where near the majority.. so to portray them as popular is a misnomer. Hell they aren't even 25%.

 

[lancetkenyon]

I got my Proof for about 65% of your suggested $1000 price. I will give you an honest and accurate weight reduction from my #5 Shilen @ 28" to my Proof "Sendero Light" @ 26" when I get it all back from my Smith.

Diameter for diameter comparisons, like the OP is asking, show significant weight reductions. Light contour barrels might weigh less than a Proof, and be perfectly fine for a hunting rifle, but are definitely not as stiff.

 

[ohiohunter]

Correct, but I said same diameter steel vs carbon the steel is stiffer. But yes of course the carbon will be lighter. Not sure if the person was comparing a bull or sendero proof, but said the stiffness was equal to about a #5.

 

[lancetkenyon]

OP has a R700 LR. Heavy taper barrel. Wide stock barrel channel.
He asked about weight savings by going to a CF barrel.
I would not put a #2 contour barrel in that stock, it will look terrible. So spending $350 on a light taper barrel and a minimum of $300 on a B&C stock to fit puts you in CF barrel price range.

Contour for contour, a CF is lighter.
Weight for weight, a CF is stiffer.

With ALL of that being said, I have only 1 CF barreled rifle, a lighter weight hunting rifle in .280AI, and it is being built as we speak. I have shot several other CF barreled rifles quite a bit, between 50-100 rounds each, and I am still on the fence as if I like them or not. I sure hope the one I am building now shoots to my standards. I would hate to have to pull the barrel and sell it if it doesn't.

 

[ohiohunter]

OP has a R700 LR. Heavy taper barrel. Wide stock barrel channel.
He asked about weight savings by going to a CF barrel.
I would not put a #2 contour barrel in that stock, it will look terrible. So spending $350 on a light taper barrel and a minimum of $300 on a B&C stock to fit puts you in CF barrel price range.

Contour for contour, a CF is lighter.
Weight for weight, a CF is stiffer.

With ALL of that being said, I have only 1 CF barreled rifle, a lighter weight hunting rifle in .280AI, and it is being built as we speak. I have shot several other CF barreled rifles quite a bit, between 50-100 rounds each, and I am still on the fence as if I like them or not. I sure hope the one I am building now shoots to my standards. I would hate to have to pull the barrel and sell it if it doesn't.

$650, heck you could go into business here buying and reselling blanks. I said its gonna cost $1k b/c surely you would chamber your new cf barrel. Even buying blanks in the classifieds will put you near 1k after chambering.

Who suggested he shoot a #2?

"weight for weight, CF is stiffer".... marginal... worth the expense? Considering a sendero cf has the stiffness of a #5. At 24" they weigh about the same as a #4, the #5 will be slightly heavier.... as someone has already stated... "mere ounces"...

So to add to your list.. Contour for contour CF is lighter, but steel is stiffer.


I suggested saving weight in the stock especially if his rig did not need a new barrel. I mean why put $1k worth the "lightweight" barrel on a $200 toad of a stock? For about half the cost of the barrel he could shave off a pound.. not a few ounces, have better ergonomics and potentially increase the accuracy of his rifle.

 

[lancetkenyon]

A good carbon stock will most definitely save weight, a pound is attainable. But you still pay for those too. $500-700+. I have a couple Manners EH series and a McMillan with the Edge fill. One on my .280AI I am putting the Proof barrel on, and one on a lighter weight (9lbs 6oz w. S&B PMII 3-20×50) 7RM mountain rifle with a fluted #3 Bartlein.

My rifle I am putting the Proof on used to weigh 11lbs 2oz with scope. I shed 1# going from a B&C Medalist with full length bedding block and putting it on a Manners EH1. I lost another 10oz by swapping from a Steiner T5Xi @ 33oz to a Premier Heritage Light Tactical 3-15×50 @ 24.4oz and lighter rings. Then another 2oz by fluting my bolt, and 2 more additional ounces by swapping the steel Picatinny for an alloy one. Should lose another full pound or more with the Proof barrel. Making total weight savings approximately 3lbs and finish just over 8# with scope.

There are many ways to shave pounds or ounces. All of them cost money. Since the OP specifically asked about a barrel swap weight savings from a heavy contour steel to a CF, that was the info I gave. Not stiffness, not other ways to shave weight, not best bang for the buck to save weight.