Caliber size or Velocity and Energy?

[BCC72]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

While I certainly believe 6.5PRC is plenty for elk at moderate hunting ranges, I think there are better bullet choices than Berger to do the job.
When you punch the numbers with any bullet that's sleek like the Berger's, you're going to see more energy down range due to the high BC's. However, a tougher constructed bullet such as a Partition or AB is going to have way better penetration. Especially if the shot is slightly off its mark and bone is involved.
Elk are thicker skinned than Moose even.

 

[dblman]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

It's simply an "American" thing. since WWI and the original 30 cal US ARMY rifle and cartridge the 30 caliber has been the darling of the American hunter. WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, all were fought with 30 Caliber American weapons. of course the 5.56 came out for Vietnam for the original M14 was 30 Caliber, what we call the .308..
Your 6.5 will kill just as good and many times better than any 30. Hunt with it with confidence.

 

[Radman]

I have been told that my 6.5 PRC is too light for elk and I am sure many of you on here will agree. But I when I look at the ballistics, my 156gr Berger with H1000 have more energy and velocity after 400yds than my buddy's 300wm with 180gr ABs. which is an acceptable elk cartridge. Since hunting bullets are made to expand why is initial bullet size important?

So your rifle/caliber isn't what someone else was using? Perhaps if you had paid a much higher price for your weapon it would have $uited them? I get so sick of this type of thing. I see it all the time. ie; If your American car will hit 140 & their !*%¤$ will also hit 140 - then your car isn't as fast because they paid nearly twice as much for their's. I see it all the time. What you are shooting is fine. Besides - it's all in the shooter. (One of the biggest bears ever taken was killed by a woman using a .22 short!) There will always be naysayers.* Enjoy your rifle!
*Research it yourself.

 

[Highbrass]

Walter Bell was very successful at taking hundreds of elephant with nothing more than a 7x57. But he was all about shot placement.

 

[ridgewalker]

Poachers have been killing elk for a long time using 22 LR, but that doesn't make it an elk cartridge. I have hunted elk for over 45 years and taken 17 using either a 30-06 or 300 WM. I've seen elk wounded by 243s and similar. I know people who still hunt them with 243. A rancher I know has hunted them for years and taken a lot using a 25-06. A bud took a nice bull and when skinning out we found a shoulder completely ruined by someone using an inadequate cartridge or bullet at least a year before. I know a guy from PA who took a spiker using his 30-30 in dark timber at less than 50 yards, but not my preference. A friend who loves his 6.5 PRC after using it went back to his 338 WM. He told me he preferred a cartridge that he knew would do the job from any angle.
What ever you use make certain it is a good penetrating bullet and put it in the boiler…not a raking Texas heart shot or even a shoulder shot if it is not a good bullet! Respect the game because they deserve it.
"Use enough gun" as Mr Ruark wrote.
Best of luck whatever you decide to use because the hunt will be fun and challenging!

 

[2ndhandrifles]

Below is what I got using Berger calc 156 G7=.347, 180 NAB G1=.507 at 3300' with a 200Y zero:

View attachment 437915


View attachment 437924

I'd check your input parameters for the 6.5 PRC. I used Hornady's Calculator and the G1 BC of .679 for the 156 gr Berger with a muzzle velocity of 2920 and here's what I got.

 

[haisardao]

6.5 PRC is enough for elk, within reasonable hunting distances, reasonable meaning distance is based on velocity and energy on target, bullet choice and shot presentation. Possible not the best cartridge for a frontal or severely quartering to shot, but as it's been said before, if you put that bullet in the chest cavity, that elk would be dead.

 

[FEENIX]

I'd check your input parameters for the 6.5 PRC. I used Hornady's Calculator and the G1 BC of .679 for the 156 gr Berger with a muzzle velocity of 2920 and here's what I got.
View attachment 438768

I am not sure what you are trying to imply but I think this issue has been re-established/resolved. But I guess you missed that part.

 

[dblman]

Walter Bell was very successful at taking hundreds of elephant with nothing more than a 7x57. But he was all about shot placement.

True, but also many of his elephants were taken with a Mannlicher carbine in 6.5X54... Both calibers killed many 1000 elephants for WDM Belll...

 

[BrentM]

I am not sure what you are trying to imply but I think this issue has been re-established/resolved. But I guess you missed that part.

Buried on page 1 and 2 and likely missed the whole g1 vs g7 discussion. The entire thread is a back and forth discussion that is like the spokes of wagon wheel and about as out dated. ha ha

 

[Eric H]

They all will do the job in a well placed shot. I couldn't care less if they used a club and spear as long as they have meat in the freezer and food on their table. That's what it's all about or is it?

 

[FEENIX]

Buried on page 1 and 2 and likely missed the whole g1 vs g7 discussion. The entire thread is a back and forth discussion that is like the spokes of wagon wheel and about as out dated. ha ha

Yep!

 

[dblman]

A. No matter how you slice the pie (or make apples to oranges comparisons), the 6.5PRC will not have a ballistic advantage over a 300WM.

B. "Initial bullet size" matters because both bullets will expand and the larger diameter bullet will have more frontal mass/diameter, thus resulting in a larger wound channel, all things being equal.

It's just my opinion, but any 30cal mag would make a more efficient elk cartridge than a 6.5PRC. Will the PRC work; sure, and so will the 6.5 Creed as noted by shooters right here on LRH.

Use whatever you're comfortable with.

Shooters all have individual personalities, thank goodness. Shoot whatever you're comfortable with.

 

[Eric Musgrove]

Took my ID bull last year with my 6.5 PRC, I had worked up the 156 burgers with their original load data, then they went and lowered their load data way down with H1000. My load was pretty far over max, so I decided to load up the 143 ELDX. This bull was only 152 yards but quartering pretty good, it went in mid body and exited just in front of the off shoulder. It was over 24 inches of penetration, I never expected that I kept hearing they damp everything inside but after the recoil all I saw in the scope was his legs in the air as he rolled *** over tea kettle, unfortunately to the bottom of this dry creek bed.