while the SG is needed for stability and full BC it is also needed to make bullets function properly and track true after impact. we hear alot of instances where bullets end up in some pretty odd locations when the animal is skinned, and people say bullet failure
Bullet failures
- Thread starter adam32+P
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Once a bullet impacts something, its stability is immediately compromised though, especially when it begins deforming and/or coming apart.
but if a bullet is only marginally stable at impact the amount of compromise is more than if the bullet has full stability at impact.
even Bryan Litz has said that a marginally stable can be accurate on paper and we are learning unstable bullets dont always perform properly on impact
A marginally stable bullet will still be accurate on paper. It's not unstable to the point it's yawing in flight, it's only degraded in BC.
It might be a terrible analogy, but the first thing that popped in my head: putting more spin on a football won't change how much or how little it's affected by someone tipping it in flight.
I just don't believe the physics support that how many RPMs the bullet is at necessarily influences it's path upon impact. The amount RPMs do, however, affect terminal performance to a dregree in the form of centrifugal forces and how much a bullet deforms and/or comes apart. Once petals start to open up or a jacket begins to peel back, more centrifugal force (from higher RPMs) will cause the petals or jacket/core material to reach out wider that at a lower RPM. Of course there are still so many other variables in play it's extremely hard to quantify just how much it makes a difference.
I'm not ready to say increased stability has nothing to do terminal performance. I'm just staying my current philosophy on it. I'd love to see some actual supporting data that could be conclusive one way or another.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Hence my caution, "never shoot a target bullet at game".
Don't us a hammer for a wrench, don't use a target bullet for hunting... .
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Think more in terms of a Knuckle ball or "wounded duck" kick.
I've had bullets yaw in flight so bad they missed the target completely.
To confirm my suspicions I pulled the target in from 200 to 50 yds and saw the results of them keyholing through the target way the heck from where they should have been hitting basically covering a 12" target.
I've experienced that too. Causes ranged from the bullet simply not being stable, non-concentric jackets creating an imbalance in flight, and discrepancies with the cores.
SSgt G Cody
Well-Known Member
I read an article a while back about Jack O'Connor's contribution to the development of the Rem CoreLokt bullet development. He said a soft tissue shot on a deer (heart/lungs) needed the bullet to open up to at least 50% greater diameter for ideal shock value. Also, in a heavy bone shot (shoulder) the bullet needed to be tough enough to penetrate deeply and retain at least 60% of its original weight! Hopefully it passes all the way through the animal, creating an exit wound! He was also credited as an advisor later in developing the Nosler Partition bullet! I don't know if he ever shot solids!
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Unless he hunting large dangerous game like Big bears, elephants, tigers, lyons, hippo and rhino it's doubtful.
Now in his era and much earlier the "solids" most often used were had cast lead bullets. Only much later did the standard FMJ type rounds come along.
For the toughest, thickest skinned game solids are still preferred. In slower rounds like say a .458wm, hard cast solids are still used pretty frequently.
An Africa today there's a big move towards Brass and Copper Mono's for the same uses.
Are you saying this does not happen and they always penetrate the scapula into the lungs or don't penetrate to the lungs?
Agreed! But you know people will experiment on them (I included - Hornady A-Max/Berger target bullets on deer and antelope <400Y) on a game. I harvested a few games with them. Lately, I have been hearing ELD-Ms have better results than the ELD-Xs. Your statement remains true.
Yes 270 win. 130 gr. Nosler Balistic Tip. Shot wt doe standing broadside 50 yds. Bullet did not hit bone. Penciled through both lungs. The deer moved 10 yards and stood there. Thinking to myself what happened. I saw a red spot on the rib cage. Then a deer fell over Dead. When I Field dressed it Found a pencil hole straight through. I've killed 30 deer with that bullet and that's the only one that has done that.
NBTs are excellent bullet-on deer size game and smaller. I remember my first antelope harvest when I moved to Montana. I shot a fawn (fawn/doe tag) at <100Y with 180 NBT out of my .300 WM, and the fawn just stood there. I chambered a round for a second shot when my son said, "that's OK, Dad, it is not necessary." The fawn's legs locked and slowly dropped. The entry and exit are pencil-sized, but the internal organs are souped-up.
