Berger close range impact

[dworrel]

I have probably killed over 100 deer elk and hogs with Berger bullets at this point. The Berger hybrids are my preferred bullet.

I do think you have to be thoughtful as to bullet placement particularly on close shots. If you hit hard bone at high velocities, they can expand rapidly.

Probably the worst performance I have had (facetiously), was a bull elk That I shot at 250 yards. He came running down the mountain to call and was facing just about straight at me. I saw shot him just off center in the chest with a 28 Nosler and 195 Berger EOL. He staggered, turned sideways, and I shot him again and put him down. 3075 FPS at the muzzle.

I shot a mule deer in Utah at 1083 yards and a 130 hybrid from a 6.5 SAUM fully penetrated and was lodged under the hide of the opposite shoulder.

The one negative performance arguably would be a Dall sheep shot this past August by my brother-in-law in Alaska. He shot it broadside at 330 yards. Sheep ran off and they were fortunate enough to find it the next day a mile away. It was still feeding. They finished it off and when they skinned it it did have a fist sized hole through its chest wall.

We were both shooting Berger 140 hybrids. I shot a black bear on the same trip at 250 yards quartering slightly towards me. Fully exited with fist sized exit wound.

 

[Greyfox]

I have been using the 140 Berger HVLD's and JLK's(which perform similarly to the Berger's) for about 8 years and have shot several dozen whitetail, mule deer, and antelope, including the +250# big bodied Canadian deer. Shots have ranged from as close as 100 yards to 1200 yards. I find that 3000FPS seems to be the sweet spot for these bullets that will put animals down, mostly DRT, or within 20-50 yards depending on placement. At the shorter ranges, I have not experienced bullet bow-up/low penetration. Bullets will exit 50% of the time with a 1" entrance, 2-3" exit depending on angle. I will find major internal damage and bullet fragments when shot do no exit. Most all game is DRT on chest shots. At the longer ranges, on big bodied deer, I have recovered 50-65% retained weight about 50% under the far side hide, looking like a perfect mushroom. IMO, fragmentation problems can arise at the shorter distances with the VLD's(or any bullet for that matter) when velocities exceed 3050-3100FPS and a more stoutly designed bullet is in order. The trade off is as the longer ranges, issues arise with under-expansion. I have very successfully stuck with VLD's which has given me the killing latitude over a wide range of distance, but, with the understanding that bullet performance will be different, and placement may need consideration fo an effective killing shot. IMO.

 

[azsugarbear]

Getting back to the topic of bullet failure: Every bullet will fail at some point or in some situation. There simply is no one bullet that does it all. Bonded bullets will generally perform better than Bergers on shoulders at closer ranges, but they yield to Bergers on long range shots due to their lower BC's. There is always a trade-off.

This topic was discussed several years back, but I thank reloaderlen for a reminder of what can happen. I shoot Berger in nearly all my LR rigs. If I know my shots will generally be under 400 yds., I use Barnes bullets with great terminal results. Based on the Berger failure discussion several years ago on this site, I bought a tool that uniforms and the lightly cones the inside of a hollow-point bullet (like Berger) to increase my confidence. If interested: google "bullet tipping die".

Again reloaderlen, thanks for sharing your results with us.

 

[FIGJAM]

Some may have taken my post wrong. I'm not putting down Burger bullets . I'm in total support of them.
This was just my first time to shoot something close and wanted to share my good results.

I have poked stuff (coyotes, mule deer, whitetails, elk, blackbears) with bergers from 50 yards to 650 yards with everything from my 25-06 to my 300 RUM. They have yet to let me down.

 

[adinallo]

Folks, I have a question: I shoot a 338 LM w MV=3008 FPS w a 300 gr Berger OTM. How would you all expect this bullet to perform on game (I do run a tiny drill into the hollow point to ensure it is open)? Thanks.

 

[ncwg2boatguy]

pass through with jelly inside. works for me. Cant say the same for close range ELD-X.
It punched through behind left leg, blew out lungs and cut top off heart and destroyed right shoulder leaving. It was at 70yds . 105gr in my 6 creedmoor at 2950 fps

 

[Allen Kitts]

I have been using Bergers for the last ten or so years with no lost game at distances of 60 yards to 650 yards. Shooting a 7LRM with 180 grain Hybrids and a 6.5 x 284 shooting 140 grain Hunter Elites. Animals from an 800 lb. Bull elk to a 100 lb. Impala. All animals dead within 20-25 yards if they didn't drop on the spot. I do see some meat loss from these bullets, more than what I did from the Barnes TTSX I was shooting before, but they do there job and generally speaking, at least for me, the animals don't go very far after the hit.

 

[Hand Skills]

If you couldn't decipher between neck and shoulder with your target standing 40 yds away, it was too dark to be shooting no matter what your states laws dictate.
I'm a berger shooter and destroying an entire shoulder goes against every reason why I hunt. Ans that's for the meat.

You know, I felt the same way for a long time. In fact I somehow was unable to open my mind to their use before I read an article titled '' Meat hunting bullets" by John Barsneses.

"...I particularly like the lack of meat-damage from Berger when hunting open country game like pronghorns, where the high BC and super accuracy are useful for longer shots. Berger's do so much internal damage I often aim a little farther behind the shoulder than with conventional bullets, because they still drop game quickly..."

Just about any Hi-Power round into a shoulder blade or spine is going to result in a lot of bloodshot. I thought this was a unique argument FOR the use of Berger's in a meat saving capacity!

 

[Bang4theBuck]

I think others read the beginning like I did, thinking that you meant that the thing that changed was that you had a bullet failure. When really the thing that changed was the distance of the shot not being in your normal (300-500 yds) range. Glad the result was what it was as I am planning to continue to use berger for hunting bullets.

 

[tworr]

WOW I came here to post my experience from my hunt this weekend and have a different impression. I was shooting the Accubonds before and had excellent results but wanted to try the berger's, I'm shooting the VLD 130's in a 270wsm.

Whitetail buck normal entrance, exit was dime size. Shot (125 yards) slightly quartering away through the lungs, entrance between the ribs exit hit part of 1 rib. Buck ran about 75 yards then hit the ground. Very little blood where I shot him. Inspected the internals when cleaning and appeared the bullet didn't start expanding till the very end. Very little damage internal.

Trophy Axis don't know because I lost it (120 yards) dropped, hit the ground hard where I shot him(assumed DRT) then 5 min later he gets up and takes off. Found little blood with tissue and that's it.

Axis Doe (150 yards) lung shot, dropped right there kicked twice then got up and ran another 100 yards. Internal looks like it expanded little after half way through.

I'm going back to my accubonds unless someone can convince me otherwise on what happened.

 

[stx]

Been using 115, 140, 168 & 210 VLDs for about 5-6 years and never lost an animal(deer, hogs, elk).....with exception of a couple all were DRT and those that weren't went less than 20 yds.....several didn't exit but DRT, nevertheless.

 

[TGVet]

I have been shooting Berger bullets for
Some time now . I have never had one fail me ,although most of my shots have been in the 300 to 650 yard range . That changed yesterday on a Whitetail meat hunt .

You are obviously NOT living in the Gestapo State of Washington having harvested game yesterday. Our laws/regs here SUCK. We pay $$$$ for a lousy couple of very short weeks for "modern rifle" and that's it.
WDFW says there are roughly 5,500 cougars statewide eating a deer a week that's 286 THOUSAND deer eaten just by cougar a year. We have no shortage of venison only a shortage of common sense laws.

 

[d500lnn]

I recall the first deer I ever shot with a Berger was back in 2009. It was a 140-150# Georgia deer. The shot was taken with a 140VLD Hunting bulllet out of a 6.5creedmoor. I've killed a lot of animals over the years, but it was remarkable the amount of internal damage on that deer. He did "run" more like somehow managed to pick himself up move forward about 40 yards. Pass through and an extraordinary amount of blood! Heart demolished, lungs were total jelly and overall I was way impressed. Most are bang flops, the ones that run are dead on feet and trashed inside. Another notable blood trail was a 95grn VLD out of a 243 at roughly 55 yards.....just awesome

 

[mikeinlouisiana]

I shot 2 whitetail bucks this season using 180 gr Berger at close range. Both deer ran off but was able to find. Bullets did disintergrate (explode) on impact. Did not have a blood trail. Looking for new bullet that I will be testing expansion with gelatin.