Berger 245 EOL Best Cartridge

[Ladd-]

What is the turn around on getting a +P barrel done?
Thanks

Mine have always been about a week or less but I'm only 1-state away.

 

[Earnhardt]

Mine have always been about a week or less but I'm only 1-state away.

Cost Per barrel?

 

[Ladd-]

Cost Per barrel?

Mine have been in the 200s with shipping.

 

[treillw]

The standard Ackley treatment is to minimize wall taper and blow the shoulder forward to 40°. The base of the neck is usually set tight on the parent cartridge so they fire form in place better - it headspaces on the base of the neck.

That 30 SM is less wall taper and 40° instead of 30° like the original PRC. Those two things give more case volume and usually less stretch to the case. It also masks pressure since the case doesn't get pushed as hard back. The bolt itself doesn't see the pressure either so arguably more pressure would be easier on the lugs too with that design. The barrel and chamber still see the increased pressure though they are usually fine to much higher levels. With top quality brass the increased pressure is probably ok but it's still there.

So why hasn't Hornady thought of this in their design with the PhDs they probably have involved in the project?

I don't know anything about the developer of the Sherman design, but I would imagine it's hard to improve upon the extensive knowledge that the Hornady team should have.

Just my first thoughts.

 

[treillw]

300 Norma improved.

Is there a list anywhere that documents the case capacities and other pertinent info on all of these cartridges? If not, there should be!

 

[treillw]

300 RUM 26-27" barrel 1/8 twist. You will get all the good out of that particular bullet without a lot of overbore which will give you longer barrel life. Velocity should be right at or just over 3000+fps.

The PRC won't give you much if anything over the Win Mag and anything else larger would require a bolt change or modification.

It's posts like this that scare me - prc is equivalent to a win mag. I don't want to be near any win mag shooting 245s at 2900/3000 fps!

Reading the prc posts stating 2900+ fps make me want to jump on board. Then there are 10 people who say it's a win mag, which is more like 2700 fps in my experience.

Who to believe, who to believe? Haha

 

[B.C.]

It's posts like this that scare me - prc is equivalent to a win mag. I don't want to be near any win mag shooting 245s at 2900/3000 fps!

Reading the prc posts stating 2900+ fps make me want to jump on board. Then there are 10 people who say it's a win mag, which is more like 2700 fps in my experience.

Who to believe, who to believe? Haha

Unfortunately performance varies ranging from brass used (internal volume and strength) to how the chamber is cut (variations in throating etc), powder primer lots etc.

Start with usable case capacity (these are aprox) 300rum 110gr h20, 300win mag 93gr h2o, 300 Norma is about 105gr. Prc is a few grains more than 300wm if memory serves me correct.

Some cases designed will be more efficient than others, however the old adage remains true, in the end there is no replacement for displacement. More powder volume = more speed.

Do your homework. Make an educated decision.

You have multiple viable choices that will get you where you want to go.

 

[CApighunter]

Norma improved, or a 30-338 lapua improved would be my choices. The only thing keeping me from going that route is loading from the floorplate with a Wyatt's box if you don't want a dbm.

 

[jpndave]

There are advantages and disadvantages to the Sherman design just like an Ackley. Aside from the wildcat design, mostly feeding with the improved design. Less taper and steeper shoulder make them more difficult to feed.

So why hasn't Hornady thought of this in their design with the PhDs they probably have involved in the project?

I don't know anything about the developer of the Sherman design, but I would imagine it's hard to improve upon the extensive knowledge that the Hornady team should have.

Just my first thoughts.

 

[elkaholic]

It's posts like this that scare me - prc is equivalent to a win mag. I don't want to be near any win mag shooting 245s at 2900/3000 fps!

Reading the prc posts stating 2900+ fps make me want to jump on board. Then there are 10 people who say it's a win mag, which is more like 2700 fps in my experience.

Who to believe, who to believe? Haha

Here is some added info:
I designed the 30/375 S.I. several years ago which was basically the 30 SM now.
Hornady made the dies for it!
About 3 years ago, Hornady came out with the 300 prc. If it wasnt for my slightly smaller neck diameter, I could have chambered their round and fired it. Head space was nearly identical! Of course they kept their normal 30 degree shoulder, but they straightened the case wall closer to a Sherman from the 375 case.
At that time, I changed my neck diameter to take advantage of the factory brass. While I was at it, I took out a little more taper, and added some FB for the newer high b c bullets.
That said, the 300 prc is no WM and will outrun it easily and the SM will outrun the PRC easily. Part of this is due to capacity and part is due to case design; And PART of the case design is it will allow more pressure to be run without destroying brass (grips the sidewall better and lessens bolt thrust) IMO, the 40 degree shoulder helps facilitate more powder burning inside the case and cuts down on case stretching as well.

 

[jpndave]

It's posts like this that scare me - prc is equivalent to a win mag. I don't want to be near any win mag shooting 245s at 2900/3000 fps!

Reading the prc posts stating 2900+ fps make me want to jump on board. Then there are 10 people who say it's a win mag, which is more like 2700 fps in my experience.

Who to believe, who to believe? Haha

PRC is a little bigger than the Win mag and will be maybe 100fps faster. Your concerns are exactly why I like comparing chamberings in QuickLOAD as it gives relative numbers at the SAME pressures rather than crazy claims one way or the other. That only matters if you are loading the rounds. If only using factory ammo then look at those numbers.

 

[codyadams]

There are advantages and disadvantages to the Sherman design just like an Ackley. Aside from the wildcat design, mostly feeding with the improved design. Less taper and steeper shoulder make them more difficult to feed.

Beat me to it. Exactly this. The advantages are less case stretch, and if you use tough brass like Lapua, ADG Peterson or the like, you can run SLIGHTLY higher pressures without any adverse affects. Though as far as feeding, I haven't had any issues as long as I run a centerfeed design. Tried to run a BDL feeding system and ran into issues.

If a person doesnt handload, then none of this is relevant to them and an improved design is not useful.

 

[westcoasthunter]

I have done 5 300 prc with saami spec reamer with 225 eldm factory ammo 3 had 24" barrels and 2 had 26" the 24" shoot at 2830fps ish and the 26" was 2860 fps ish. With great accuracy. I'm not sure about 300 win but with a Saami spec reamer I don't see them matching those number. I could be wrong

 

[treillw]

There are advantages and disadvantages to the Sherman design just like an Ackley. Aside from the wildcat design, mostly feeding with the improved design. Less taper and steeper shoulder make them more difficult to feed.

Is this a problem in a bolt gun?