7mm STW Brotherhood - For those who shoot the 7mm Shooting Times Westerner

[284nut]

I have an aquaintance who swears by the 175 gr sierra game kings. Anybody out there have any experience with them in the STW?

They work Phenomenally well, seen 2 Oryx shot with them on White Sands Missile Base, talk about putting a thump on a critter!

Both were mature bulls in the 400-500 pound class.

 

[bobs]

Was the gun an STW and did they exit? Yardage? Any other info on the terminal performance?

 

[284nut]

Was the gun an STW and did they exit? Yardage? Any other info on the terminal performance?

7 STW 79.0 grains reloader 25
3079 fps

Bull 1 was at 350 yards and never took a step. Quartering away shot, Bullet entered on left side and out behind the off shoulder no bullet recovery.

Bull #2 475 yards through and through behind shoulder with no bullet recovery, internal organs were essentially red jelly and ribs broken on both sides in both cases. Exit would approximately 2.5" in diameter with minimal blood shot or tissue damage on the exit wounds.

The 160 grain game king holds together well, haven't been able to keep the 175's in the body cavity yet, but am looking to hunt Bison again this fall, maybe I can get one recovered there.

Hope this helps.

 

[7stw]

The thinner jacketed hunting VLD, I've seen it happen with a .300 RUM. We pushed a 190g at 3400 FPS and the went poof! I also was one of the origional testers for the Hunting VLD Back in 2003 when Berger was trying to get them out in the market. I took a nice Muley at 335yds with a 168g and have since taken 4 elk (the longest shot being 525yds) and several other bucks with them. They work great out of my .30-06 AI. I am a Fan!

I however understand their limits sue to bullet construction. Eric Stecker and I had a lengthy conversation about the VLds back in 2003 as I wasn't too keen on even giving them a chance. It went against all I believed about bullets. But I tried them anyway and I found that I had a precision load that given propper shot placement will do the job nicely.

He specifically said that they were never meant to faster than 3200fps as the Berger guys even found the they exploded. The Target versions are much thicker and will definately go faster. The only problem is reliable expansion as they could pencil straight through the animals.

Hope this is helpful.

Dan

I'll second that notion, been there, done that! That all being said, and as Dano said, if you hyper drive them, they will become ballistic bombs. Now, I do believe that if you keep them considerably under the 3200 mark, they will work. I have personally had three mis Haps, in two calibers, and care not to go down that road again. Don't get me wrong, I am not "Berger Bashing". I was quite upset at the time, and I believe understandably so. I have enjoyed great accuracy with them, and still do use them in other calibers, and mostly for target purposes, but when I go to the game fields, it's probably going to be a Barnes LRX, TTSX, TSX, or a nosler Partition, ot BT, CT.
Different strokes for different folks does apply, and this is just MHO, but I'm not alone!
Thanks Dano!

 

[ButterBean]

I'll second that notion, been there, done that! That all being said, and as Dano said, if you hyper drive them, they will become ballistic bombs. Now, I do believe that if you keep them considerably under the 3200 mark, they will work. I have personally had three mis Haps, in two calibers, and care not to go down that road again. Don't get me wrong, I am not "Berger Bashing". I was quite upset at the time, and I believe understandably so. I have enjoyed great accuracy with them, and still do use them in other calibers, and mostly for target purposes, but when I go to the game fields, it's probably going to be a Barnes LRX, TTSX, TSX, or a nosler Partition, ot BT, CT.
Different strokes for different folks does apply, and this is just MHO, but I'm not alone!
Thanks Dano!

X-2

 

[80 grains]

Last week i called Sierra. The conversation began with a question on twist, velocity and bullet weight and wound up back to velocity. The fella knew my questions before i could ask and had the answer awaiting me...over and over. I know Berger 180's are the topic and some may ask, why is this nut bringing Sierra into this?
Ok...Sierra 180 HPBT . Hmm...recommendations were for 2900-3100 fps. Awesome idea! Personally i don't see the need in launching a 180 any faster. Good Lord! That's a chunk man!
I do have some Bergers loaded with 82 grains of US869. I've not used a chronograph yet, so i have no idea of the mph, but...the holes in the target touch each other at considerable range.

As far as the STW is concerned, the 180 grainers aren't the choicest for speed. I like 140's for that.

 

[Dano1]

Good info right there! I was going to ask you about the Target VLD's but you covered it. Have they done any tests on them in the ballistics gel? How fast do the Target VLD's need to be going for proper expansion?

I really don't know if any testing has been done in Balistics gel. I do know that the current hunting VLDs are the same as the old standard VLDs that they first made. The Target VLDs were made to address the vaporizing problem. I have cross sectioned both a Target and a hunting VLD and the diffrence isn't much.

I assume that driven fast enough they should behave like the hunting VLDs. Berger hasn't (to my knowledge) tested them for hunting purposes. There are a few guys, I remember hearing about but can't remember names, who have used them and didn't have issues.

As far as Velocity, you got me. They should come appart quite easily, but a thicker jacket when pointed like the VLD would be pretty thick and might just behave like a FMJ and pass though with out expanding at all. You'd have to give them a try.

Dan

 

[Dano1]

Last week i called Sierra. The conversation began with a question on twist, velocity and bullet weight and wound up back to velocity. The fella knew my questions before i could ask and had the answer awaiting me...over and over. I know Berger 180's are the topic and some may ask, why is this nut bringing Sierra into this?
Ok...Sierra 180 HPBT . Hmm...recommendations were for 2900-3100 fps. Awesome idea! Personally i don't see the need in launching a 180 any faster. Good Lord! That's a chunk man!
I do have some Bergers loaded with 82 grains of US869. I've not used a chronograph yet, so i have no idea of the mph, but...the holes in the target touch each other at considerable range.

As far as the STW is concerned, the 180 grainers aren't the choicest for speed. I like 140's for that.

Thgose guys at Sierra know their stuff. Even when you're talking about other brands of bullets. You're right about the Velocity of the 180 VLDs. I'm actually pushing mine just about 3100FPS. They Shoot Wonderfully. It's interesting that your will shoot US869, mine wouldn't group with it. I'm shooting 80g of Retumbo. With my bullets seated almost to the lands, I have more room to fit the extra powder with out a pressure problem.

Dan

 

[Dano1]

I have an aquaintance who swears by the 175 gr sierra game kings. Anybody out there have any experience with them in the STW?

Not on game yet, but they will shoot 1 hole groups out of my rifle and still be seated to fit in the magazine. Still looking to see if I can up the velocity some more and retain the accuracy.

Dan

 

[MudRunner2005]

I really don't know if any testing has been done in Balistics gel. I do know that the current hunting VLDs are the same as the old standard VLDs that they first made. The Target VLDs were made to address the vaporizing problem. I have cross sectioned both a Target and a hunting VLD and the diffrence isn't much.

I assume that driven fast enough they should behave like the hunting VLDs. Berger hasn't (to my knowledge) tested them for hunting purposes. There are a few guys, I remember hearing about but can't remember names, who have used them and didn't have issues.

As far as Velocity, you got me. They should come appart quite easily, but a thicker jacket when pointed like the VLD would be pretty thick and might just behave like a FMJ and pass though with out expanding at all. You'd have to give them a try.

Dan

I wish ballistics gel wasn't so **** expensive, or I'd do my own experiments. I still might one day, just to do a side x side comparrison.

 

[ButterBean]

Last week i called Sierra. The conversation began with a question on twist, velocity and bullet weight and wound up back to velocity. The fella knew my questions before i could ask and had the answer awaiting me...over and over. I know Berger 180's are the topic and some may ask, why is this nut bringing Sierra into this?
Ok...Sierra 180 HPBT . Hmm...recommendations were for 2900-3100 fps. Awesome idea! Personally i don't see the need in launching a 180 any faster. Good Lord! That's a chunk man!
I do have some Bergers loaded with 82 grains of US869. I've not used a chronograph yet, so i have no idea of the mph, but...the holes in the target touch each other at considerable range.

As far as the STW is concerned, the 180 grainers aren't the choicest for speed. I like 140's for that.

80, THe folks at Sierra are great people thats for sure and they have been a big help to me over the years and the Bullets the offer are tried and true ......the Gameking is like the Partition,It a no question Bullet, Now I have said this before but it was you were in the hood..... This is just my way of doing things.......when I find a load that shoots to my standards, thats when I use the Chrony .....I look at the speed only( if its shooting sub moa I dont care what the FS and SD are ......its just a number) and then I figure my Ballistics from there........My thinking is, if its accurate I dont care how fast its going...Thats what your elevation dial is for .........My Two Cents

 

[MudRunner2005]

80, THe folks at Sierra are great people thats for sure and they have been a big help to me over the years and the Bullets the offer are tried and true ......the Gameking is like the Partition,It a no question Bullet, Now I have said this before but it was you were in the hood..... This is just my way of doing things.......when I find a load that shoots to my standards, thats when I use the Chrony .....I look at the speed only( if its shooting sub moa I dont care what the FS and SD are ......its just a number) and then I figure my Ballistics from there........My thinking is, if its accurate I dont care how fast its going...Thats what your elevation dial is for .........My Two Cents

I have to completely agree with this. If it's an accurate load, it doesn't matter if it's 50fps slower than you anticipated. It's still gonna work better than a faster, less accurate load will.

 

[7stw]

80, THe folks at Sierra are great people thats for sure and they have been a big help to me over the years and the Bullets the offer are tried and true ......the Gameking is like the Partition,It a no question Bullet, Now I have said this before but it was you were in the hood..... This is just my way of doing things.......when I find a load that shoots to my standards, thats when I use the Chrony .....I look at the speed only( if its shooting sub moa I dont care what the FS and SD are ......its just a number) and then I figure my Ballistics from there........My thinking is, if its accurate I dont care how fast its going...Thats what your elevation dial is for .........My Two Cents

Yes sir re Buddy, dial it, and pile it!
I would much rather have a bullet that is traveling at a reasonable speed, that is CONSISTENT, then one that is screaming, and only accurate at times. This caliber is no different then any other, in the fact that it shoots it's BEST at the upper end, and close to the edge of maximum for YOUR particular rifle. Once you find that load, with the emphasis on accuracy, and repeatability, your search is over. THEN bring out the crony, input your BC, and velocity, and your all set.

 

[80 grains]

Yes and Amen