6.5CM and 6.5x284.

I think loading your 6.5x284 with a slow burning powder at a modest velocity would be close to equaling the 6.5cm barrel life. I personally would just keep the 6.5x284. It's a better all the way around than the creed. And this is coming from a guy who's shot the creed since its conception(which is still a good round for what it is and it was intended to do)
 
Why not build a .25 CM with a 7.25" twist barrel to push the new Blackjack .257 131 ACE bullets. Also, more velocity than a 6.5 CM, and with a .330 G7 BC .257 bullet, better BC than the 6.5... ;)
 
Load that 6.5x284 with rl26 and the 147eldm. It will do things you cannot do with the creed. You would be near saum velocities, with extremely good ballistics. Build a creed for volume shooting and save the hot rod for hunting and occasional rock/steel busting
 
MudRunner2005 said:
Why not build a .25 CM with a 7.25" twist barrel to push the new Blackjack .257 131 ACE bullets. Also, more velocity than a 6.5 CM, and with a .330 G7 BC .257 bullet, better BC than the 6.5... ;)
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I dont put all my eggs in one basket..... just sayin. Not to mention the 147 eld and the 150 smk both still have higher BCs than the 131ACE. I'm not sure how fast a 25cm would push that 131, but it would have to be 3000-3100 to equal or overcome the 6.5 in the long haul.
 
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Creedmoor shooter said:
I dont put all my eggs in one basket..... just sayin. Not to mention the 147 eld and the 150 smk both still have higher BCs than the 131ACE. I'm not sure how fast a 25cm would push that 131, but it would have to be 3000-3100 to equal or overcome the 6.5 in the long haul.
Click to expand...

As far as the 6.5 Creed vs 6.5x284, there's no doubt they both are great cartridges but if your primary shots are 100-700 yards just wait until the 6.5x284 barrel gives up the ghost and switch over the 6.5 Creedmoor.

We could achieve 3000 fps in a 26" 7 twist 25 Creed - heck we got 2950 fps no pressure with a 26" 25x47. The 147 ELDs and the 150 smk are beautiful bullets in my opinion but they will require more powder to equal the trajectory or wind drift reduction to our lighter and efficient 131 ACE. There are plenty of circumstances where a heavier bullet is preferred to a lighter bullet.

None of the cartridge & bullet comparisons shown here are slouches by any means - they are all very able to pull a Win in the competitive scene and more than capable in the field. There's no doubt though, fired out of the same parent cartridge a 131 ACE will outrun the 147 and 150 smk - in these charts I only showed our 25 Creedmoor going 2925 fps to be as unbiased as possible. The 147 data is packed in-between other chart-lines and not labeled until the end of the Wind chart, but you get the idea. All things considered our 131 ACE and the 110 will run with each other so close it's not really worth arguing about - 110 on drop, 131 ACE in the wind. However 25 cal will give a considerable amount more barrel life than a 6mm.

I completely understand a portion of the market's hesitation to build a 25 Cal due to limited high performance options. No beef there. We are doing our best to bring great options to the market when no one else will take the risk of being the first. Before long there will be two Blackjack 25 Caliber bullets (ACE and HTR) and as more shooters make the switch there's no doubt you'll be seeing more come down the pipe.

Creed Family Drop.png

creed family add 123 ELDM.png
 
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257 Blackjack said:
As far as the 6.5 Creed vs 6.5x284, there's no doubt they both are great cartridges but if your primary shots are 100-700 yards just wait until the 6.5x284 barrel gives up the ghost and switch over the 6.5 Creedmoor.

We could achieve 3000 fps in a 26" 7 twist 25 Creed - heck we got 2950 fps no pressure with a 26" 25x47. The 147 ELDs and the 150 smk are beautiful bullets in my opinion but they will require more powder to equal the trajectory or wind drift reduction to our lighter and efficient 131 ACE. There are plenty of circumstances where a heavier bullet is preferred to a lighter bullet.

None of the cartridge & bullet comparisons shown here are slouches by any means - they are all very able to pull a Win in the competitive scene and more than capable in the field. There's no doubt though, fired out of the same parent cartridge a 131 ACE will outrun the 147 and 150 smk - in these charts I only showed our 25 Creedmoor going 2925 fps to be as unbiased as possible. The 147 data is packed in-between other chart-lines and not labeled until the end of the Wind chart, but you get the idea. All things considered our 131 ACE and the 110 will run with each other so close it's not really worth arguing about - 110 on drop, 131 ACE in the wind. However 25 cal will give a considerable amount more barrel life than a 6mm.

I completely understand a portion of the market's hesitation to build a 25 Cal due to limited high performance options. No beef there. We are doing our best to bring great options to the market when no one else will take the risk of being the first. Before long there will be two Blackjack 25 Caliber bullets (ACE and HTR) and as more shooters make the switch there's no doubt you'll be seeing more come down the pipe.

View attachment 101381
View attachment 101380
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Dont get me wrong I'm not knocking your endeavour with the 25 cal. I think it's great that we have another choice. I'd be interested in building one myself if we could get some more companies on board with this idea. The 25-06AI or a 25 creed would be what I'd be interested in running. At this point though I wouldnt be willing to jump into something like this just to have it go away again. Maybe when my 6.5 barrel burns out in the next year or so things will be different and I may look into it.
 
Creedmoor shooter said:
Dont get me wrong I'm not knocking your endeavour with the 25 cal. I think it's great that we have another choice. I'd be interested in building one myself if we could get some more companies on board with this idea. The 25-06AI or a 25 creed would be what I'd be interested in running. At this point though I wouldnt be willing to jump into something like this just to have it go away again. Maybe when my 6.5 barrel burns out in the next year or so things will be different and I may look into it.
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I find it interesting how lots of people stick 8" twist 30 cal bullets on but guys get the willies about doing basically the same thing with a 25cal. Blackjack is new and we are pretty new as we are part way into our 3rd year of sales. I don't think either of us are going away.

My point is if a fast twist .25 bore looks like a good fit in the safe, don't wait for the Jones' to do it 1st. If you are really worried about building a rifle with a fast twist that won't have any bullets in 10 years, get 10 years worth of bullets now. Plus a well constructed bullet like an AB will run fine in the fast twist barrel.

Not picking on you Creedmoor shooter, just quoting your post as a general statement. We heard the same stuff when we made our line of 25cal bullets, many of which need faster than standard twist. We took our 257 Bee to Africa and destroyed the 25cal stereo type. "That's too small a caliber to use on African game". Had nothing to do with the rifle and everything to do with the bullet.

What Blackjack is doing has nothing to do with the rifle either. They are making a great bullet that will bring the 25 bore back in the light. I am excited about it.

Sorry about turning the 6.5 thread into a .25cal discussion. I love 26 cal, they are magic!

Steve
 
RockyMtnMT said:
I find it interesting how lots of people stick 8" twist 30 cal bullets on but guys get the willies about doing basically the same thing with a 25cal. Blackjack is new and we are pretty new as we are part way into our 3rd year of sales. I don't think either of us are going away.

My point is if a fast twist .25 bore looks like a good fit in the safe, don't wait for the Jones' to do it 1st. If you are really worried about building a rifle with a fast twist that won't have any bullets in 10 years, get 10 years worth of bullets now. Plus a well constructed bullet like an AB will run fine in the fast twist barrel.

Not picking on you Creedmoor shooter, just quoting your post as a general statement. We heard the same stuff when we made our line of 25cal bullets, many of which need faster than standard twist. We took our 257 Bee to Africa and destroyed the 25cal stereo type. "That's too small a caliber to use on African game". Had nothing to do with the rifle and everything to do with the bullet.

What Blackjack is doing has nothing to do with the rifle either. They are making a great bullet that will bring the 25 bore back in the light. I am excited about it.

Sorry about turning the 6.5 thread into a .25cal discussion. I love 26 cal, they are magic!

Steve
Click to expand...
I agree with you Steve. Sorry if that came off wrong. I could never replace my 6.5 with a 25 cal. I would still need a 6.5mm of some flavor before I got a 25 cal. There's just something about the 6.5mm that seems "magical" I guess you call it. It's probably my favorite caliber all the way around. It's very well balanced. I've been running numbers and the difference between the 6.5 creed and the 25 creed would be a few minutes of drop and only a couple clicks of wind at 1,000 yards. Cetainaly not enough to make run out there and rebarrel. It is interesting though and may someday jump on the 25 cal bandwagon.
 
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