bigngreen
Well-Known Member
Look at the pic with the bases flush against against each other, same length, I'll walk back out and see if I can get a repeatable measurement.
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Hammer bullets WTH
- Thread starter tim2446
- Start date
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Yes, I have the same pack of tips and installation block that was sent with them.
Here's a quote from their website:
"Hammer HHT™ is our line of polymer tipped bullets. After a year of extensive testing on animals around the world for proper terminal performance, we launched the line of HHT's summer of 2023. The Hammer HHT™ has proven to be our most effective hunting bullet yet. This is saying something since we set the standard with our previous lines of bullets. Along with improved terminal performance they add some additional ballistic coefficient as well as protection of the meplat from accidental damage from rough handling of ammunition in the field, that could cause poor terminal performance. The added durability and stellar terminal performance are all the reasons needed to upgrade your ammunition to the Hammer HHT® line of bullets."
So I don't see anything that says they're intended to be used either with or without. What is implied from that quote above, and any page of any specific HHT, is that you install the tips yourself and use them with the tips.
Again, sure you could absolutely shoot them without them and I know some do. That doesn't mean that was the intent though.
adam32+P
Well-Known Member
Is it just me or does the actual bullet look different? Length, ogive shape and definitely the color of the copper is different
bigngreen
Well-Known Member
It's just the pic and lighting, I tried to get it all lined up perfect so the pic was representing it correctly but just wasn't happening, all the pics looked odd vs with your eye.Is it just me or does the actual bullet look different? Length, ogive shape and definitely the color of the copper is different
I can round Robin shoot these into the same group at a mile, their the same.
FireFlyFishing
Well-Known Member
Seems like a series of gel tests at different velocities would help show issues, yes?
I've seen some comparative tests from @fordy in video format, done on animals. You can definitely see a difference. Too bad you can't upload videos on here easily.
bigngreen
Well-Known Member
It would give you comparative data, you have to go shoot a sample size of game animals to compare to the gel. Also you'd have to shoot long range not just down load which messes up rotational speed at impact throwing off things. At this point the larger body of data data seems to see the same things happening as it did before, issues seems localized.
Go old school, tightly wound stacks of dry phone books
Videos are in the works
You can get a similar effect of long range with a short barrel and fast twist barrel. For example, for certain 30cal tests, you could use a really short barreled 300 Blackout and a 1:6 twist or faster barrel to get low MV but still a high RPM. I've done it.
IIRC, some are using 1:3" in 8.6 BO.
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Gday Adam on this post of yours Sorry to put theIs it just me or does the actual bullet look different? Length, ogive shape and definitely the color of the copper is different
emoji up as it may have confused so hopefully this explains on some pills you are 100% correct yet I've been told they are the same
Cheers
Gday Shane & quintus I think I can bundle you both in here
The tip issues are a little different but yet kinda the same
Double Dutch I know & once bean puts the video i did up I hope that answers a few questions
But I'll also add what you have with the hammer design regardless of style is the need for fluid to enter the hp to create the hydraulics that separates/sheds the petals from the shank
Now this has been documented extensively & as soon as a person done media testing that as @dogz put up
or like the results were straight forward & irregular shedding if much @ all & everyone basically over it & advised to put some h2o in front even a snap lock sandwich bag done wonders
Now what this has to do with the hammers now is simple in the beginning all hammers had the residual machine oil left in the hp which on impact in the critter pretty well regardless of the impact resistance ( yes got the odd nose over but your twist Band-Aid quintus basically solved it especially your ranges ( not eliminated )
So pretty well it didn't matter what part of a critter you hit the hydraulic system due to the oil residue gave consistency or a level of it anyway
Enter weatherby & they required no oil residue which the hammerheads as we were called tested this out & found nothing that was detrimental but we didn't understand the whole process or should say test enough & thoroughly enough
But as time went on we started seeing snippets of pill failures & myself included & took a penny drop moment when I was chatting to a mate over his latest batch of pills & getting extremely poor results & our minds straight to alloy issues as many others have ( yes alloy is important but not as important as I once thought ) but my mind went hang on on this pill
This is a hydraulic issue not a alloy
( that was found out around 30 years ago on different pills on some pretty cool testing a mate & I did ) hmmm moment yep so off testing I went but with Sierra first as that pill was the worst @ nose over I've ever used & wow the difference was incredible once I added the beeswax to the hp cavity
So then onto hammers & same results of couldn't get a failure
I was lucky to be invited on a deer cull & Pretty substantial numbers were taken that allowed some pretty good information on me understanding dry & wet impacts as I call them now
& here it is for you quintus imo
Keep smacking a critter in the fleshy shoulder meat or like impact's & pretty well all good without oil ( or beeswax in my case but plenty of substitutes that others put forward on finding out )
But you hit that rib on a angle on a lighter conditioned critter or spine of the scapular the bridge of the nose or the knuckle on a angle etc & get ready for the bingo raffle as these placed shots have basically no fluid in them ( dry impacts as I now call them) & the results are erratic to darn right terrible
So to me I don't have a issue shooting the hp varieties especially the hh&ah but without a hydraulic additive I would rather shoot a frangible lol & a light for calibre one at that
as @ least I know what out come I'd get pretty well ea time & only need to do oil or wax etc with the ones your hunting with not everyone
But one's own choice I'm not saying have to just what I've seen
Now the hht please don't add oil as that's a disaster
We tried various things like oil , shortening the stems add graphite to the tip prior to installing, lengthening tip stems thinking stems & more but with the current tip polymer you have got a pill that's still relying on hydraulic once again to get the pill to work & the properties of that polymer while it is majorly improved by getting a good friction to fit ratio but it in no way it's the magic bullet for terminals improving & especially so in the 3mm tip pills as everyone of those I tested give me the hp ones as they are terminally superior
Yet the original prototype tip tested was outstanding but also had its issues I believe but for me being a 500 & ( more 400) in guy I never saw a issue in accuracy but then again I'm not a good shot so I'm better keeping out of that stuff
There are some good hht but I've only seen a few of those and in the 2mm tips & the hp varieties just seem to be the easiest /safest option imo
Hopefully that answers the questions
Cheers
