30-06 load flattened primers?

24 or 26 inch barrel, what rifle.

Footsie80 said:

Now to the question, I'm .3 gn above the suggested max load and safely worked up from 2.2 gns under. No obvious signs of pressure, easy bolt lift etc. However, upon examining the cases in artificial light I think that the primers might be a little flat - even when well under max load. The one on the left is at 2.2 gns under, the one at the right is .3 gns over. What's your opinion on the safety (and the results) of this load work up?

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"I" do not like any pressure signs on my load. It appears you are concerned about pressure; otherwise, you would not post it here. If you are concerned, take it down a notch to a much safer zone. You have the ultimate choice to proceed with what you have and people's recommendations, but you are also responsible for your safety. There is no substitute for safety - SAFETY, SAFETY, SAFETY ...

Not sure how many reloads you'll get out of Starline brass at those pressures, heavy bolt lift is a key sign. Don't make my mistake. Check for CARBON RING about every 50-100 rounds. THAT will ruin your chamber once your pressure spikes.
I have a 330 WM and a 300 NM. 300NM after 250 rounds had an occasional velocity jump of around 50-75 fps. Then came the 200+, and I had no idea what happened. Borescoped and found the big, fat, crusty ring. I'm told VV N565 can build rings faster than other manufacturers. FYI.

MagnumManiac said:

Hmmmmm, I don't think so….
178g bullets will surpass 3200fps in a properly throated 300WM.
Next step for your load will be loose primer pockets, no way would I be running that load more than once.

Cheers.

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Yeah, I realized that you can get more out of the cartridge - just going by the Hornady estimates which have 3000 as the max load for most powders.

simo hayha said:

24 or 26 inch barrel, what rifle.

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22" in a Savage 110 with stainless barrel and action.

You have to be your own best judge. Nothing wrong with asking, can get some good info. In the end, it's you behind the rifle, and you suffering the results of any mishaps.

When I was 13, I loaded some hot .44 Mag loads. My Dad said "Don't shoot them in my revolver." I just pulled the bullets on those, 60 years later. In the 60s I was seeking a .44 Mag+ . Why? Didn't ask then, can't say now. Now I have .454 Casull and 475 Linebaugh.

If you want 300 WM velocities, maybe better to get a 300 WM. One of the things I love about the '06 is it's reliable middle of the road performance. Higher velocities might be had using lighter weight (130) Hammer or Barnes. One way or the other, I won't push the limits.

Good Luck!

Footsie80 said:

22" in a Savage 110 with stainless barrel and action.

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I have some starline brass where the primers seat pretty deep. I find on their brass where the primers seat deeply, I get pretty flat primers no matter the load. Of course they're less flat when shooting a lower charge but they're flatter than you'd expect.

So in a case like this, I'd compare the primers of that load to a load well under book max. As long as it's not filling the whole primer pocket and there's no cratering and zero other signs of pressure, I'd probably be ok using it but would be sure to not shoot it in hotter weather and not let your rounds sit on the sun while you're shooting.

However....I think you said you're 0.3gr above book? . In the Hornady data in their app, I see 59.3 as max and 2750 for velocity with a 24" barrel. Yours is a 22". That's a huge velocity difference and there's no free lunch. You're likely above their max pressure but they do not state the max pressure of that load. It could be 57k psi, or 59k psi. With your 22", it would be ~2950fps with a 24". That's 200fps difference.

So......? If it were me, I would not be worried for my safety as long as it was not hotter weather and i only had a couple reloads on the brass. But I'd probably back down 0.5-1.0gr, just to be sure I don't have any pressure spike problems when hunting and to lengthen brass life. If you're on the edge of pressure that will cause problems (stuck bolt etc), then getting some moisture in the chamber or something similar when hunting can cause a pressure spike, then stuck bolt, then you're kinda screwed on your hunt.

338 dude said:

Primers are definitely flat. You're very close to pressure signs, as long as you worked this load up during the warm temperatures it will be fine during hunting season.

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The only thing there is, how do they work in the cold season or winter time? You are very right on working powder the at hight heat with temp sensitive powders. There can be a large increase in pressure with several powder. Especially at the max loading above the manual max load.

Mike Matteson said:

The only thing there is, how do they work in the cold season or winter time? You are very right on working powder the at hight heat with temp sensitive powders. There can be a large increase in pressure with several powder. Especially at the max loading above the manual max load.

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I've never been able to find a reliable source for temp sensitivity factor for this powder. However, in the 23° difference between initial testing and fine tuning the difference seemed minimal. The drop in velocity in the 59.2 loads I accuracy tested earlier in the day vs. initial work up was about 15 fps average. This is within the ES, so who knows if it was even temp related. I'll be shooting at closer to 0° in a few weeks time, but in the field. We'll see how it goes! Thanks to all for the conversation

You could put the ammo in a zip lock freezer bag packed on ice, transport to the rifle range for testing, OR just realize that temps will be much lower in your hunting where pressures will drop a tad bit.

My load with H4350 and Nosler 180s is very warm in my Rem 700 '06, primers are flat and lettering on case head gets thinner which is the accuracy node for the barrel. This is not a target or steel shooting rifle, it gets fired to verify zero and then when hunting.

Temp sensitivity can be dependent on cartridge and bullet (maybe charge too) per Hornady testing that they discussed in their recent podcast. I've heard this before but it was good to hear them talk about it.

There are some tests out there you'll find on the web that might be for the same cartridge, but they're often done at extremes when that's not necessarily helpful. The changes could be different for different temp ranges. It is best to test in the temp ranges you'd potentially use it. Say... 15F to 80F if that's the only temps you'd experience when shooting it rather than doing 0F to 120F.

All of my savages had excessive headspace. They would close on a no-go but not a field gage. Luckily only 1 had iron sights. The rest I screwed the barrel in a degree or what it took to just not quit close on the no-go but close nicely on the go gauge. I had a misfire from time to time in my 06's. The 7 Rum, 338, and 7 mag never misfired. Something to check.

The 30-06 has always been handicapped by a low (60,000 psi) SAAMI pressure compared to say a .270.

In a previous barrel I had a load in a 22" barrel with IMR 4831 and a Nosler 180 AB that was almost 2850ish fps. The load was definitely above 60,000, but I doubt it exceeded 65,000. Brass lasted about 8 reloads in Winchester brass before the primer pockets were looser than I liked. That load was pushing the boundaries in that rifle, but it was consistently accurate.

That same load in a new barrel was too much and started showing pressure.

That is a big advantage to reloading. You can individualize a load to a specific rifle and specific needs.

IMO your load is over 60,000 if you care. You could measure your brass in front of the rim on the body with a micrometer before and after. .0005" used to be the accepted max. That is also dependant on the brass. Hard brass will mask more pressure.

Or push the easy button and back off to the next lower node and live stress free.