World record group

[Mikecr]

No reason to over estimate a shooter or equipment either..
It's an interesting event in shooting, but a wallet group from a tiny underbore at point blank range is not advancing to a LRH endeavor(our efforts here).
There is no moral in it that applies to us, and there should not be attempts to connect our different efforts.
It's just interesting,, that's all.

 

[TOM H]

Wind is a condition that all shooters have to deal with when shooting at any distance and yes many good shooters could shoot a group at 400 yards or more if they were good at reading the effects of wind on there particular load and bullet combination.

Don't know where the pistol got into this discussion but many people have/can shoot there pistols at greater distances than 400 yards with 100% success and some scary groups.

One of the best groups I ever shot out of a specialty pistol at 300 yards was .437 5 shot group and conditions were not very good. There are many pistol shooters better than I am and with the right equipment
shoot much better than I can.

The point to the post is, We can all do better and we can always learn and improve.

PS: as one poster said "Never under estimate another shooter or his equipment".

J E CUSTOM

That small group was more than like shot at a range that was set up like this.
http://internationalbenchrest.com/photos/gallery9/pages/20160601 1631.htm

 

[J E Custom]

No reason to over estimate a shooter or equipment either..
It's an interesting event in shooting, but a wallet group from a tiny underbore at point blank range is not advancing to a LRH endeavor(our efforts here).
There is no moral in it that applies to us, and there should not be attempts to connect our different efforts.
It's just interesting,, that's all.

I would have to disagree that there is no connection in the different types of shooting and equipment. They all have something in common like precision machining of the rifle components, precision in loading the ammo, precision in the optics, precision and consistence in the shooters ability and most of the time just some good luck that everything comes together.

To send any projectile 100 yards and place them in a hole only .007 thousandths larger than the projectile 5 times requires all of the elements above and then some.

I agree that there is little similarity in out types of shooting, but all of the requirements for successful long range shooting/hunting are still the same. Accuracy, consistency, proficiency are still the requirements to be successful in any shooting sports.

Just my opinion

J E CUSTOM

 

[rafterfp]

The pistol comment was sarcasm, 20 yrs active duty turned me into a smart ***, did you really take that **** literally ? And *** does underestimating another shooter have to do with anything ????? That group and that gear represents zero knowledge that can be used in a long range hunting application, with the exception that u have to find some one that can run a lathe and screw on a barrel, and those dudes are everywhere not that hard to find. We pick certain projectiles, velocities and twist rates to an end goal of terminal performance at distance on game.

 

[bigngreen]

I'm with JE on this, I take a lot from how this level of rifle is built and how it's shot and apply it to building and shooting long range rifles. There is definitely things to glean from other precision minded types of shooting.

 

[blinderthanascope]

What does precision pistol shooting at short range have to do with long range hunting? Could you hit a bullseye with that " rifle " and load at even 400 in a variable wind situation?

lol ching ching

 

[codyadams]

That group and that gear represents zero knowledge that can be used in a long range hunting application

There is no moral in it that applies to us, and there should not be attempts to connect our different efforts.

Extensive load development
Proper barrel selection
Proper twist selection
Proper bullet selection
Proper action selection
Putting it all together correctly
Trigger control
Breathing control
Understanding how to get a consistent shooting position
Wind reading (yes, wind is a factor at 100 yards when your ctc group is that small...)
Getting every bit of accuracy out of a rifle and shooter

Nope......I don't see ANYTHING that applies to long range shooting there. Not one bit.

C'mon guys, are you really giving JE flack because he posted this? All he is saying is keep an open mind in our sport and continue to advance it.

What is the first thing we do after we get a long range rifle put together? We try to get a load worked up that prints the smallest groups possible at 100-300 yards and pick that load to stretch out. So attaining a 5 shot group at 100 yards well under one one-hundredth of an inch represents zero knowledge that can be used in a long range hunting application? There is no moral that applies to us? I don't know about you, but I sure would like to pick that guys brain about load development. Because I'm fairly certain he is probably better at it than all of us involved in this conversation.

You can learn something from every situation. Try to keep an open mind people. If you are certain that there is nothing to be learned, then you will learn nothing.

 

[blinderthanascope]

if you ain't learning every day reading and shooting then I guess you would know it all right, the best place to learn is short range benchrest they are meticulous about everything, they can read wind very well that's how they shoot those small groups, I have shot SR Benchrest you usually have 4 to 6 windflags at 100yds

 

[TOM H]

I shot BR and still shoot 6ppc.

I posted site that showed record target and below was his sighter target which is shot same time limit as record target. Lot shoot sighter then go to record so what you have is more than 5 shot fired to get that record group. He would of never shot that group without sighters.

The rules in BR are written by BR shooter to take advance of sighters which are unlimited to shoot smaller groups on record target.

Now maybe you can understand Mike comments.

This is article on that record group I posted

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/09/best-group-ever-michael-stinnetts-0077-five-shot-group/

 

[blinderthanascope]

my first visit to a BR match was at the Steamplant Galatin Tenn Bill Hall and Ed Watson were there and they both let My Brother and I shoot their rifles

 

[bigngreen]

Just because some refuse to look for useful information from other shooting sports does not mean it does not exist. As a long range rifle builder and occasionally dabbling in IBS I found a PILE of things that improved both my rifles and my shooting in the field, it really helped as I focused more in the field on how my rifle tracks and my cold bore shooting saw a huge benefit. If you don't see how it helps that's fine but that does not mean someone who does somehow does not have a valid opinion.

 

[Don A Parsons]

Thanks for sharing JE.

I guess I'm suppose too comment "I didn't learn nothing, and this post you put up dose not apply too me in any way shape or fourm". Ha """NOT""".

Now I'll speak from my mind since its this tidd-bit information sharing that keeps us up too speed.

This post you offer is for folks just like me and many others that "choose" too learn what is possible from the most unlikely cases.
No one today knows why the world record Moose was harvested at 35 yards with iron sights on a British 303 a few years ago.

Humans still wonder how the Germans were able too shoot their battle ship canons 98 kilometres on the open ocean and hit the target every 20 minutes consecutively in world war II.

When folks chat about distance, winds, marages, and the human factors, purhaps they could add in not seeing the intended target and do this from a floating plate forum.

I'm guessing stuff like this and your post are too much for alot of folks since us Canadians are allowed too shoot out of a boat so long as the motor is "shut off".

I choose too take in this informative information because its relevant in some way, shape and forum.

None of us know if this applies until we find our selves lost on a ocean in big waves with one shot from a shot barrel rifle as that one fish on the break will be lunch or not.

Learning something new keeps this Western Canada Don on the go.

 

[Toecutter]

Good article, thanks for sharing.
That being said, im constantly blown away by the need of some people feel superior or in some way seem more knowlegeable, no matter the subject. I wont begin to try and understand the psychology, but lately the amount of just plain rude and pointlessly combative comments that are made on here seem to be increasing. Would these armchair combatants speak this way in person? Doubtful, but somehow it is becoming more and more prevalent here. Id hate to see this place turn into a pit like some other sites i frequent. If an article on a great group fired off a bench gets this much flak on a shooting website, longrange or not, whats the sense in posting anything?(This wasnt a technical article in which pros and cons of different techniques needed to be debated after all) Point of this rant is if you have nothing intelligent, positive, or earth shattering to offer then just move on. Seems simple but apparently not. Maybe some people need to weigh or anneal some 22lr cases with all their free time.
Rant over.
Everyone have a good day

 

[J E Custom]

One more post.

The reason I posted this was explained several times but I will try one more time.

It was not intended to P!$$ anyone off Just to encourage all on this site to keep trying to Improve where we could.

Long range hunting has always been under fire sense Len Started this site And I can remember the flack He took and all of the naysayers that had to express there dislikes for anyone that endeavored to make shots much over 2 or 300 yards.

The fact that they couldn't make good shots over these distances had nothing to do with it I suppose. We still have to prove our skill all the time, So why not try to improve if we can. I learned Gunsmithing from a very Anal Bench rest shooter and master gunsmith and have always tried to match or exceed his skill and craftsmanship even though I have never built a rifle specifically for Bench rest but the principles have served me well even though this group was almost 5 time better than the best I have ever shot with a hunting rifle.

I am happy however to see so many shooters on this site that are interested in improving anyway they can no matter how good they are. It can only advance the sport even more. Look how much it has helped the advancement of Bullets, Powder, optics and all of the things necessary to be proficient at long distance.

J E CUSTOM