Win Model 70 or Browning A Bolt in 300wm

[Lefty7mmstw]

The brownings are throated normal instead of long so the mag length isn't an issue. If you want to make an issue of it there is a thread here on how to lengthen the mag's. I shoot my browning 300 win at 3.34" oal and it's got a .020" jump to the lands after 1500 shots.
I've also never to really be able to get a browning to shoot poorly, and the trigger actually adjusts easier than the m70's, so if you have an issue with it pop off the stock and turn a screw. You don't even have to beat the rifle getting the bedding loose like I did on my m70 coyote. I'm sure browning has put out at least some bad rifles; they all do. I've had good service from my browning.

 

[etisll40]

I'm going to pick up a 260 or 308 sometime again, sometimes people just dump them n Gunbroker. I do like the shorter bolt throw, it's one of those things that's a little different. Lots of good rifles out there but if I was a 1 rifle guy, I'd probably buy a Browning A-Bolt. They are now on A-Bolt's but they still are making the original A-Bolt.

 

[dakota1tn]

The brownings are throated normal instead of long so the mag length isn't an issue. If you want to make an issue of it there is a thread here on how to lengthen the mag's. I shoot my browning 300 win at 3.34" oal and it's got a .020" jump to the lands after 1500 shots.
I've also never to really be able to get a browning to shoot poorly, and the trigger actually adjusts easier than the m70's, so if you have an issue with it pop off the stock and turn a screw. You don't even have to beat the rifle getting the bedding loose like I did on my m70 coyote. I'm sure browning has put out at least some bad rifles; they all do. I've had good service from my browning.

the newer Brownings may be throated normal but the older ones werent! To touch the lands the bullet had to be seated to a much longer oal. I had 3 different 300 win mags and couldnt get them to touch or even close and fit in the mag. I even milled the mags out as much as possible and them still function correctly. Im not downing a Browning!!! Thats the only problem I ever had. I do hope the newer ones have larger mags. I would luv to hear from people that have bought Brownings less than 2 yrs old! My experience is with older ones 5 yrs & older.

 

[etisll40]

Dakota, one of the earlier posts on here suggested to just call Browning and get the 338 win mag box and install that. That appears to solve the oal problem?

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

the newer Brownings may be throated normal but the older ones werent! To touch the lands the bullet had to be seated to a much longer oal. I had 3 different 300 win mags and couldnt get them to touch or even close and fit in the mag. I even milled the mags out as much as possible and them still function correctly. Im not downing a Browning!!! Thats the only problem I ever had. I do hope the newer ones have larger mags. I would luv to hear from people that have bought Brownings less than 2 yrs old! My experience is with older ones 5 yrs & older.

Dude, my browning pipe in 300win is 15 years old!!! They haven't changed a thing. I bit of jump is a good thing anyway as it helps smooth out peak pressures. The only thing that sucks about mag. restristions is you can't seat long nosed pills like the 225 hdy hpbt out enough. That's what my 300 rum is for anyway.

 

[Marble]

I have a 338 magazine in my A-Bolt 300wm I am at work so I cant measure it for you now. I am telling you without a doubt the 338 magazine is a lot longer than the 300wm magazine.

Thanks! Let me know!

 

[Marble]

I have 3 A Bolts, all three are maxed to the end of the mag and are not touching the lands. It would only take me a few minutes to see if I can push the bullet out. Sometimes it helps, sometimes it doesn't.

 

[Jammer65]

Hands down, the Winchester. It is vastly superior to the Browning or pretty much any other mass produced action out there. There is a reason it has been called "The riflemans rifle".

 

[MudRunner2005]

Hands down, the Winchester. It is vastly superior to the Browning or pretty much any other mass produced action out there. There is a reason it has been called "The riflemans rifle".

Really??? That's why more custom rifles and military and police issued sniper rifles are built off of Remington 700 actions, right?

Also, please, pray-tell, what makes the Win 70 "far superior" to the Browning or any other mass-produced action out there? And don't say, b/c the guy writing the magazine article said so, or b/c I read it on the internet somewhere...

 

[Jammer65]

Really??? That's why more custom rifles and military and police issued sniper rifles are built off of Remington 700 actions, right?

Also, please, pray-tell, what makes the Win 70 "far superior" to the Browning or any other mass-produced action out there? And don't say, b/c the guy writing the magazine article said so, or b/c I read it on the internet somewhere...

Yes, really! The issue of Remingtons being used for police and military sniper rifles is one of institutional momentum. That is what has been used since the 60s and there are a lot of replacement parts available for them. Good thing too becuase there is much about them that needs improving. Their design was centered around manufacturing cost, not performance. There is little about the Remington that is all that impressive. Little wonder that it is usually cheaper to buy a custom action that uses the Remington footprint than it is to do all the work necessary to bring one up to high performance standards.

As to the characteristics that make the Winchester (and its FN counterpart) vastly superior, they are:

1. Non Rotating extractor that provides a dramatic improvement in extraction power over the nearest competitor (excluding the Ruger 77 and Mauser variants). Nothing like the cute little thing that Remington uses and the aftermarket thrives on replacement options goint to an M-16 style of extractor
2. Fixed Ejector that provides absolute reliablity over the spring loaded plungers of most other manufaturers. A fixed ejector also give the operator the option of manually removing the brass from the action port, dropping it just outside with a easy nudge to the rear of the bolt stroke(for reloaders that dont like to have to chase down their brass), or decisive ejection dependant upon how hard you stroke the bolt.
3. Controlled round feed operation is smooth and positive, giving the operator the ability have complete control over the cartridge during the feeding process. It permits reliable feeding at all possible angles of orientation. Pretty much every serious repeating dangerous game rifle employs CRF for one simple reason, it works when the chips are down and your life may be in jeopardy if it doesnt. Same reason why the Mauser action was so prevalant in the last two world wars. Mauser actions dominated the sporter market and spawned a lot of post war variants copying its form and function, the Win 70 being one.
4. 3 position bolt mounted safety. One of the most copied safeties in the industry. In the safe position the firing pin is pulled away from the trigger sear and locked into position. The mechanism is virtually foolproof and works reliably in extremely adverse conditions of temperature and grime.
5. Simple, reliable trigger that is easily inspected, cleaned and adjusted
6. The recoil lug is integral to the action, not a sandwiched piece between barrel and action. Even the heaviest aftermarket tactical Remington recoil lugs are pretty tame compared to that of the M-70's.

While the Browning is a decent piece and the Remington passable enough to get the job done, they dont hold a candle to a Winchester/FN action. Period.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Whatever you say, but all I'm hearing is the same BS that's been spewed for years and years by the Win70, Mouser 98, and Ruger supporters....

I mean, I could sit and bash on everyone else's actions allday too, if I wanted to, but I have better things to do with my time.

I'm just saying, don't be an idiotic supporter bashing on everyone else's stuff, just b/c you are a big fan of your own. Nothing wrong with being proud, just don't be obnoxious...

Yes, the Mouser 98, Win 70, and FNH are good actions. Nobody said they weren't, but I want to know on a personal level how many Remington 700's you have owned, and how many have had TRUE failures vs, something that could have been avoided by simply taking care of the gun...and not abusing it.

Also, please tell me how many Remington 700 ejectors you've seen fail...PERSONALLY! B/c I've never seen one and I've been around and been shooting guns my entire life. I even asked my gunsmith before, after hearing about this M-16 or Sako extractor upgrade....They all said it's all just in how much money you want to spend, they'll all do the same thing...Factory or aftermarket.

The Browning A-Bolt II is one hell of an action. I don't think anyone can deny that...Except maybe you. Which I still don't see how you can think they're inferior. Some of the most expensive rifles in the world are built off of A-Bolt II actions.

The Remington 700 may have been designed for cost,over function, but Remington sure hit a dinger of a homerun with it, didn't they? Pretty sure it's also been perfected over the years. Also, tell me how they don't feed properly, since I've had Ruger 77's since I was about 14 and they are constantly needing re-racking to ensure proper feeding of bullets from the magazine.....Last time I checked, the old style 77 with the Tang safety was almost identical to the Win 70.....Still have those old Rugers, but now they just sit in a safe collection dust. I've had Remington 700 actions that were 20+ years old with the original bolt, and God knows how many shots fired through them, and still had a new barrel put on it, and it was shooting 1 ragged hole groups, and the ejector spring was still pumping out strong...

So, out of natural curiosity.....Where in all this world of "crap actions" (other than the Mouser 98 and Win 70, according to you) does the Weatherby Mark V fall? Last I checked it has a 60* bolt throw, 9...Yes I said 9 locking lugs, oversized bolt body for increased strength, 3 steel rings built into the action design itself for support and rigidity. And one of the strongest extractors on the market.....

 

[Jammer65]

I gave common facts about the action, period.

Nowhere did I say that anything was crap, but apparently that is what you wanted to hear. I have owned Remingtons, Rugers, Mausers, Savages, Brownings, Sakos, and Tikkas. Never have owned a Weatherby and never felt the desire to. They are all perfectly usefull tools, some more than others. Maybe you should get off of the internet and get out and do some shooting with a variety of rifles. You might be suprised what you might learn along the way.

The OP had a question and I gave my opinion.

Welcome to your opinion, population............................................ You.

 

[MudRunner2005]

I do own a variety of rifles.... Ruger 77's, Remington 700's Browning A-Bolt II's, and Weatherby Mark V's....As far as bolt-guns go. And have owned alot more different varieties than that, that have been sold or traded for other guns.

I don't own a Winchester 70, b/c as you so quaintly put it, "I have never had a desire to". But that doens't mean that I haven't shot a number of them in the past.

Remember....I wasn't the one making the claim that there was only 1 best of the best action...I was simply asking you as to why you felt that there was, but wanted to hear it backed up with personal experiences and not generalizations.

 

[Jammer65]

You asked for details, "not just becasue some guy in a magzine said so" and I gave them to you. I was indeed speaking from personal experiences as I have four Wincheser/FN actions.

Give one a try some time. You just might be surprised.