What is the the most flat shooting cartridge yall can think of?

[Phil Rizzo]

Duckman knows this game, and he knows it's not easy to get to 350 and beyond with a tight +/- 2" requirement.
He's going to shoot deer with it also.
He KNOWS the answer is a very warm .257 with 85gr BT's
It'll take the right twist and a long barrel.
After lunch we will get a reply!

 

[BrentM]

204 running 39/40 grainers at 3980 is an easy button. My 15" pistol runs them at 3480. For yotes it's a simple one for me if I'm not packing my prc.

 

[JiggyIi]

come on fellas! Everyone knows it's the the DoAll 6.5Needmore️

 

[Mach1Morgan]

I was having a conversation with a fellow member here over "flat shooting cartridges" because I've been in search of a flat shooting cartridge/bullet combination for coyotes.

I'm currently shooting a 25-06 which gives me a MPBR on a 4" target of 298yds with a 115vld. I'm switching to an 80gr barnes ttsx to see what kind of speeds I can get and hopefully stretch that MPBR a little bit more. When this barrel goes south I will probably go back with a 25-06AI or 25sherman.

I know there are some wildcats out there that could possibly be "flat-er" and a realistic choice for coyotes and would like to hear yalls opinions.

I'm not looking to neck down a 308win to 17cal or run a 110vmax in a 300rum or anything wild like that. I'd like to keep powder consumption as low as possible. Barrel life isn't a huge concern but it like to get 800 rounds out of it.

What are yalls thoughts?

Look up the 224 McDonald. It's basically a 6mm Rem case that's given the Ackley treatment then necked to .22 caliber. It's in the 4800 fps range with 40 grains and with 30 grain Bergers goes over 5200 fps. It was designed by Charley McDonald who lived just a few minutes from me. Unfortunately Covid got him about three years ago and he's not with us anymore.

 

[Rosebud]

22-250 52 grain Hammer Hunter 4000 FPS MPBR 347. 1.9 inches high at 100. . Death Ray.

 

[LRNut]

I burned up a 22-250 in my teenage years shooting mostly 55gr pills. Occasionally 40's. But for me the 55's were the better all around bullets. Most of the time it was shooting pigs out around 300 yards in hay meadows.

After I smoked the barrel in that one I moved up to 243win and now 243AI. I'm loving the 6mm bullets. I can drive a 55gr faster than a 40gr out of a 22-250. It was right at 4150 in the straight 243, haven't loaded any for the AI yet. The 62gr barnes varmint grenade was a fun one also. My fireforming load shoots half moa pushing an 85gr gameking around 3200. I've got a few more to fire form then I'm going back to the lighter bullets.

I do often find myself longing for another 22-250 though. I'll have another one eventually.

I shoot 55 gr 6mm bullets in my .243 Win for exactly this reason - pretty flat.

 

[crazymonkey]

22-250,204ruger,or25-06 for me.

 

[LRNut]

Duckman knows this game, and he knows it's not easy to get to 350 and beyond with a tight +/- 2" requirement.
He's going to shoot deer with it also.
He KNOWS the answer is a very warm .257 with 85gr BT's
It'll take the right twist and a long barrel.
After lunch we will get a reply!

I like your tight 2" plus or minus. Too many shooters ignore the fact that half your bullets are going to strike above your maximum trajectory ordinate (how much high depends on your rifle's accuracy and your holding ability). I see this a lot with big game discussions; people think a MPBR with a max bullet path ordinate of 4" is good to go. Generally, the max ordinate is about 180 yards or so, which means you need to shoot 1 MOA in order not to risk missing high.

Before laser rangefinders there was a period of time where I sighted my 7RM rifles dead on at 400 and then held the crosshairs at the bottom of the brisket, which is what tanks used to do before LRs. That worked well on caribou, sheep, and antelope, but I nearly blew it on a grizzly bear at 50 yards - caught myself aiming at the bottom of the brisket with my .338 WM.

These days, I zero dead on at 200 yards (actually, I zero my LR rifles at 500 on a calm morning in Phoenix, then correct my vertical adjustment to match what my SIG 10K says I should be at 500). But a week ago I was shooting PDs, and found that when they were "laid out flat" at around 140 yards, I did better aiming 1 MOA low.

 

[Calvin45]

257 WBY with 75 grain Hammer Hunters. Crazy flat out to 500 yds.

Can confirm, took my whitetail with that exact combo last year. Very flat. 4150 fps out of my 24 inch vanguard.

 

[Calvin45]

While the track record for accuracy in small arms is abysmal if we're just talking pure muzzle velocity and greatest hypothetical mpbr the ultimate will be a saboted round of some kind. If only they shot worth a hoot.

There's a fella on YouTube used some of the accelerator type sabots in a handloaded .300 win mag to drive .224 cal bullets north of 5100 feet per second.

 

[jessej]

Here is a fan experiment, if you think BC is not a factor in MPBR try loading the 115 VLD backwards with the same charge and see what your actual dope/drop. Yes, there a guy that did it with CEB (ESP Raptor) - without tip, with tip, and backwards.

With this , we are limiting the cartridge to only one achievable velocity . If we handicap our selves with this parameter, Then, BC becomes the only thing that that can change the maximum point blank range.

In the real world, ANY CARTRIDGE MADE, will have a greater MPBR, with a lighter weight fast pill.

For example, the old favorite 30-06. Loaded to saami pressure with a Nosler 210 ablr, g1.661,
200 grain accubond,
150 grain accubond, and
125 grain accubond G1 .366

Which one has the greater mpbr?

Feenix, I know you are a very intelligent person, and I know you that you know these are facts.

^^^^^^^^^^^^ This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

No.
The only way to increase range in regards to MPBR, is to decrease TOF to the target in order to keep the maximum trajectory parameters set by the shooter.

Probably somewhere around the 45" MPBR target size is where the 210 ablr would catch up with the 125 ab. (Just a rough guess, driving, no time to run the numbers).



Let me be clear. I love high BC bullets. I shoot 300 grain pills in my my longest range rig. Light and fast won't do at extended ranges.

But for point and shoot, no dialing,
4" to 6"target MPBR, light and fast wins every time.

 

[436]

Perhaps we should set a max range for the cartridges like say; 400 or 500 yards as to what cartridge is the flattest shooting, just a thought. Cheers

Oh, by the way... I'm in the .257 Wby Mag camp.

 

[Calvin45]

With this , we are limiting the cartridge to only one achievable velocity . If we handicap our selves with this parameter, Then, BC becomes the only thing that that can change the maximum point blank range.

In the real world, ANY CARTRIDGE MADE, will have a greater MPBR, with a lighter weight fast pill.

For example, the old favorite 30-06. Loaded to saami pressure with a Nosler 210 ablr, g1.661,
200 grain accubond,
150 grain accubond, and
125 grain accubond G1 .366

Which one has the greater mpbr?

Feenix, I know you are a very intelligent person, and I know you that you know these are facts.


No.
The only way to increase range in regards to MPBR, is to decrease TOF to the target in order to keep the maximum trajectory parameters set by the shooter.

Probably somewhere around the 45" MPBR target size is where the 210 ablr would catch up with the 125 ab. (Just a rough guess, driving, no time to run the numbers).



Let me be clear. I love high BC bullets. I shoot 300 grain pills in my my longest range rig. Light and fast won't do at extended ranges.

But for point and shoot, no dialing,
4" to 6"target MPBR, light and fast wins every time.

Yes "flat" can mean different things to different folks. I take it as simple the greatest "hold on hair" range. For that, among commercially chambered rounds , you will not meaningfully beat the 257 wby or the 30 cal magnums with lightweight pills I don't think, and my own two contenders for hold on hair range are the .257 bee with 75 grain hammers at 4150 fps and the .300 win mag with 120 Barnes tacx bullets at 4050 fps. Fella on YouTube got the .30-378 doing 4200 with a 130 Barnes.

Once we're past hold on hair range with any combo, the big 7mms are about the sweetest spot for getting truly high BC bullets still north of 3000 fps out of portable hunting rifles that don't beat the snot out of the shooter. A 28 nos, 7 RUM, or 7 stw with 180 Eldm (bc .79) leaving at well over 3000 feet per second is gonna be flatter shooting than most other contenders if we're going past 500 yards.

 

[6.5x300 WBY]

I'm gonna say my 6.5x300 weatherby is gonna be a top contender for this. If not top but surely top 3. For a production cartridge my 6.5x300 is absolutely a serious contender.