What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700 L/A

[Long Time Long Ranger]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

Again, the 338-300 RUM has no edge or advantage over the 338 RUM. It is the other way around. the 338 RUM has all the advantages and is the better cartridge. They are twins performance wise however the 338 RUM wins in every other category.

If anyone thinks the 338-300 RUM has an advantage over the 338 RUM what do you think it is?

 

[SBruce]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

Again, the 338-300 RUM has no edge or advantage over the 338 RUM. It is the other way around. the 338 RUM has all the advantages and is the better cartridge. They are twins performance wise however the 338 RUM wins in every other category.

If anyone thinks the 338-300 RUM has an advantage over the 338 RUM what do you think it is?

Would you explain what you mean by the 338 RUM having the advantages?
I've always been under the impression that the whole reason for the 338 Edge was the added powder capacity of the 300RUM case as compared to the 338RUM case.

 

[Kiwi Greg]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

.338 EDGE! All the people that swear by them can not be wrong. Do some research and watch the videos. Also go to www.defensiveedge.net/ and watch the videos. Shawn took the 338 Edge and made it what it is today. May as well get all you can from your 700 action as far as accuracy and velocity with 300 gr bullets and that is the EDGE.

Jeff

+1 Awesome cartridge on a Standard Magnum bolt face in a Rem 700

The 4 I have built have shot incredibly well, no blueprinting, just a 700, with an after market barrel & you are GTG.

How can you argue with a 26" barrel 9-9.5lbs all up with scope & 2800 FPS, 1/2 moa

 

[Mike 338]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

What is a .338 edge and what is the advantage it has over the .338 RUM? As components and dies are readily available for the .338 RUM?

I don't know for sure (other than what's in that article) but you should call Shawn @ Defensive Edge. I seem to remember him stating that he cuts the chamber a little differently.

 

[Mike 338]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

I don't see the 338 Norma mentioned anywhere. Any thoughts?

 

[Broz]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

I have loaded for and shot many 338 Rums and many 338 EDGES. I have another 338 RUM to do this week. It is simple. The .338 EDGE has more case capacity allowing it to obtain more velocity. Using H-1000 and a 300 gr bullet the Rum will max out at 88 or maybe 89 gr of powder. But the EDGE will allow 92 and sometimes 93 gr of powder. That equals more velocity which is why Shawn develoed his version of the EDGE. Anyone that does not understand this is simply in denial or so arrogant they can't see the forest for the trees.

Jeff

 

[Outlaw6.0]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

Would you explain what you mean by the 338 RUM having the advantages?
I've always been under the impression that the whole reason for the 338 Edge was the added powder capacity of the 300RUM case as compared to the 338RUM case.

As I look at the two dummy cartridges I keep for the two, I am reminded as to how very little difference there is between them. I need to actually measure the powder capacity of the 300 & 338 Ultras (I load for both). If 2800fps is all the Edge is good for, I would seriously consider whether or not the 20fps advantage is worth it. I'm running 300SMK's out of my RUM @ 2780 & that is from AI mags. I guess you can call it an "edge" in performance, but a nominal one at best. the +P on the other hand is quite a bit different & well worth the extra step in reloading.

Only a few advantages to the RUM. One less step in the reloading process, Shorter OAL (pretty important if you're running a mag fed setup), Less powder consumption for near identical performance.

t

 

[Broz]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

I'm running 300SMK's out of my RUM @ 2780 & that is from AI mags.

That is better than most I load for. What powder charge and what chronograph if I may ask?

Thanks

Jeff

 

[Outlaw6.0]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

That is better than most I load for. What powder charge and what chronograph if I may ask?

Thanks

Jeff

Of course you can ask Jeff, we are here to cuss & discuss...

I was perty surprised to boot but this barrel has proven to be faster than most, a healthy dose of 7828 averaged 2812 with the SMK but brass only lasted 3 go-rounds.... No doubt the longer barrel has something to do with it as well. If I had it do do over again, I wouldn't have set it up to run through the AI mags as it is VERY short.

Compressed load- 90.0 grns of Retumbo (92.5 popped primers)
Strings averaged over Beta Master-Shooting Chrony
Drops confirmed to 1100yds so far.

Hope that helps,

 

[Broz]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

OK Thanks, Yep that is fast for a 338 RUM with a 300 SMK. I would say to be honest and fair an EDGE loaded to the same max load would be closer to 2840 or 2850 and I have seen some with 30" tubes go into the 2860 range. This is what I see all the time with the rifles I load work up for over my Oehler 35. The EDGE with the same or close to the same level of pressure will give 80 to 100 fps more velocity. That seems to be the norm for others too. I see Idaho Sawyer posted the info from his 1058 yard goat kill.

"338 EDGE
#7 Hart 1 in 10 twist 30" w/ a med Pain Killer
89 gr Retumbo (was 90 until I got this new lot of powder) lit by a 215M
300 gr Berger .005 into the lands, going 2825 fps"

This to me is a good representation of what an EDGE will do loaded just under max. A 338 RUM loaded the to the same level would be 2750.

Thanks
Jeff

 

[Outlaw6.0]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

Interesting info & thanks for sharing, I appreciate an honest conversation w/o any ego stroking. I forgot to add in there, i'm only running a 27" bbl. 30 might have gotten me over 2800

Isn't Norma now offering 300RUM brass? That might be a + for the Edge shooters.

Either way, a 300 grainer from either makes for a BIG can of whoop-***.

t

 

[B23]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

I thought at first you were loading 90gr of 7828 then noticed that was actually your Retumbo load.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

Don't AI mags hold you to a 3.6 COAL???

If you're stuffing 90grains of IMR7828 in a 338RUM case with a 300SMK loaded to a COAL of 3.6, I would bet your FPS is coming from the excessively high pressures your running and not so much from a faster than average barrel. I'm shocked your getting even 3 reloads out of your brass.

At 90grains of 7828 in a 338RUM case at 3.600 your at 110% case capacity and nearly 90,000 PSI

With your 92.5grain load you were at 113% case capacity and almost 100,000PSI chamber pressure.

That's beyond crazy pressure levels and you're entering the insane zone!!!

Yes they are ~3.600 OAL but!

NO SIR!! I'm running 90.0 of RETUMBO not 7828. I apologize if I lead to any confusion there. I'm pretty dern careful when it comes to that type of stuff.

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

Re: What is the best .33 caliber precision long range hunting round??? Remington 700

SBruce, The case capacity is slightly larger but most of the accuracy loads are identical and so is the performance of the two cartridges. These two are about as identical as you can get with the only advantage of one over the other is cheap over the counter dies for the 338 RUM. Over the counter brass with no fireforming. And the primary difference being Remington designed the 338 RUM to fit standard magnum actions better without as much need for aftermarket parts however the aftermarket helps both. Bottom line either will do anything the other will. Just the 338 RUM is much easier to work with.

The beauty of the 338-300 RUM and why I worked so hard on it from 1998-2001 is it offered 125 fps advantage over the 340 wby and was the most powerful 338 with soon to be (1999) easily available brass that would fit on a standard magnum action. Not much advantage and the 340 wby will kill anything at any reasonable range the RUM case will. But for a wildcatter like me who has wildcatted everything available since the 70's I couldn't resist jumping on this new case. I hyped it big on the internet and built quite a few of them from 1998-2001 and it began to get a little popularity. Then remington introduced the 338 RUM in 2001 and I discussed with them at length why they shorttened it slightly. They said so it would fit the 700 action better with long, heavy 338 caliber bullets. Performance wise there was no difference with what each cartridge could do as far as application of the two. They tested them extensively while making their decision.

So I began testing the 338 RUM upon it's release in 2001 side by side with the 338-300 RUM I had been working on so hard for about three years. What Remington said was correct. Performance wise they were the same thing however the 338 RUM was easier to work with on the standard magnum action. They even shot many of the same accuracy loads. One of the best loads I had developed at the time for the 338-300 RUM of 93 grains H-1000 with the 300 grain SMK was soon listed in the Sierra loading manual as their best load for the 338 RUM. With the old H-1000 powder 91-93 grains H-1000 and 93-94 grains Retumbo with the 300 grain bullets were the best accuracy loads for both.

So me being a senior/scientist engineer and the clientelle for my little hobby shop were mostly the same where many people in the area can say "by the way I am a rocket scientist" we are very logical. Like the popular saying from the old dragnet show of the 60"s "just the facts mam". We tested both side by side extensively and logically there was no need or reason to wildcat the 338-300 RUM after 2001. A guy could get the same thing over the counter in a 338 RUM without all the extra trouble and fuss plus a better fit for the actions. So we quit fooling with the 338-300 RUM and went with the 338 RUM in 2001.

I have taken animals long range with about every 338 cartridge discussed on this forum. To the ranges I hunt which is around 1100 yards which is about the limit where a pretty good shooter in a hunting situation can guarantee one shot, one kill on an animal, every cartridge I have used has performed to that range. From the 338 winchester 1104 yard moose to the 338-378 wby 1130 yard caribou they all make the shots and kill. Slightly different elevation and windage but they all work.

Now for the guys thinking there is a performance difference between the 338 RUM and the 338-300 RUM. The 340 wby uses about 8 grains more powder than the 338 winchester to get 125 or so fps more velocity. The 338-300 RUM uses about 10 more grains powder than the 340 wby to get 125 fps more velocity. The 338-378 wby uses about 15 grains more powder to get about 200 fps more velocity than the 338-300 RUM.

Now how much velocity difference do you think there is between the 338 RUM and the 338-300 RUM which use virtually the same loads? Is the 338 RUM closer to the 340 wby using about 10 grains more powder or is it closer to the 338-300 RUM using virtually the same loads. There is only 125 fps difference between the 340 wby and 338-300 RUM. How much difference? I know because I tested them extensively like remington at the trun of the century. More difference between individual barrels than these two. Both are just as accurate and either will do anything the other will but the 338 RUM is easier to work with. If velocity matters then a guy needs to get a 338-378 wby or lapua improved and quit beating these two virtually identical cartridges to death.