125' basement? Where'd you grow-up...Buckingham Palace??
What is long range hunting and what is hunted?
- Thread starter M118LR
- Start date
Help Support Long Range Hunting Forum
Maybe it's the shooter with the cold bore issue. i.e. your shooting form and procedure are warmed up after a shot or 2.
I've documented every Cold/ Clean bore shot from my ELR rifle. (which in fairness is only 20) but on average they are .2 low and 14fps faster.
jeep351
Member
I understand that this is totally anecdotal, but i have a factory FN SPR a3g (.308) that I've put over 2,000rds through. It's a super heavy rifle that a child can shoot .5 MOA @ 100yds all day long off a bench. After 100 or so rounds, it starts to open up to about 1.5 MOA. Once it's been thoroughly cleaned, it groups around 4 MOA for the first 7-8 shots, every single time it's cleaned. Like a light switch, on round 8 or 9, it goes back to the bullseye and is back to it's normal .5 MOA. It's been doing it for years, it happens so consistently I bring my cleaning kit to the range and do it in front of friends/shooters that have doubts. Hell, I even let them take the shots themselves to watch it happen.
I also have a few customs that love shooting clean, cold bore... so I'm definitely not saying it's one way or the other. I just assumed that every gun had it's own way. Am I wrong, is there something wrong with my FN? I'd love to hear suggestions on why it acts this way.
That is an astounding swing in accuracy and also a very short accuracy window for that round. I honestly feel like something else is going on there.
PNWdude67
Well-Known Member
How is a clean bore more accurate than a dirty bore? IMO it is not. You get one clean bore round. Cold bore is something to note especially when suppressed. By my bores are all dirty and nasty accurate and I would NEVER trust a clean bore for any shot on game.That's some pretty good shooting. It takes a lot of practice to place a round into the 8 inch vital zone of a deer at 1K yards. Are you using the clean cold bore? Or the less accurate fouled bore three shots average Zero to base your shooting solution on?
Unionsparky46
Well-Known Member
With my new hunting rifle, optic and hand loads I am confident I could down an elk at 1k and a deer at 1200. I shoot a 300WM with a 185 VLD hunter @ 2936fps avg. This would be dependent on the situation meaning weather conditions, terrain and ease of getting the animal out. At this time, I would not take a critter past 600 until I shoot my rifle at those yards though.
My local range has 600 and I am grateful to have had the chance to shoot it on that range. My old hunting rifle I have had a chance to shoot it to 1350 and was comfortable with taking a shot at the distances mentioned above. Not that I'm not comfortable with my new one, just haven't proven to myself I can shoot it consistently at those distances.
That being said, my definition of long range hunting is being able to engage a target (soft or hard) at a distance being confident in your weapon, equipment and yourself. This would include being able to get that critter packed out and to the truck. My body isn't what it used to be so I like to hunt areas that I can get a game cart to decently easy. The buddy system is great too but not always available. Thank you OP for posting the question. Always curious to learn from others experiences!
Oh! Last thing! Always foul my barrel. Haven't really experienced a shift in impact from clean/ fouled cold bore but I don't chance it.
My local range has 600 and I am grateful to have had the chance to shoot it on that range. My old hunting rifle I have had a chance to shoot it to 1350 and was comfortable with taking a shot at the distances mentioned above. Not that I'm not comfortable with my new one, just haven't proven to myself I can shoot it consistently at those distances.
That being said, my definition of long range hunting is being able to engage a target (soft or hard) at a distance being confident in your weapon, equipment and yourself. This would include being able to get that critter packed out and to the truck. My body isn't what it used to be so I like to hunt areas that I can get a game cart to decently easy. The buddy system is great too but not always available. Thank you OP for posting the question. Always curious to learn from others experiences!
Oh! Last thing! Always foul my barrel. Haven't really experienced a shift in impact from clean/ fouled cold bore but I don't chance it.
Greatgrandad
Well-Known Member
I and my friends and peers use the old competition, NRA and military standards of LR, and back in those days and even today, Long Range (LR) targets were 800-1,000 yards. The other targets were marked SR (short range) and were 2-300 yards and MR (medium range) 5-600 yards. Since we had no standards for ELR, some decided it was anything beyond 1,000 yards, and some used a standard of the 1/4 mile rule - "up to" 1/4 SR, 1/2 MR, 3/4 LR and beyond ELR.
Game taken at LR have been deer, elk, hogs, and numerous and various varmints.
Greatgrandad
Well-Known Member
That's some pretty good shooting. It takes a lot of practice to place a round into the 8 inch vital zone of a deer at 1K yards. Are you using the clean cold bore? Or the less accurate fouled bore three shots average Zero to base your shooting solution on?
Well, of course it takes practice, but it also takes study and dedication to truly learn ones' sport.
We've taken coyotes and prairie dogs beyond 1,000 yards, but some of us are old and a few current, 1,000 yard comp shooters and a few 1 mile and 2k shooters.
Last edited:
PNWdude67
Well-Known Member
I generally shoot 5 shot groups to with a new load or barrel. This was a new scope and after a couple shots to zero it here is a sequence from the video recording the next 6 rounds. The sun was at 10 o clock from the target board and low in the January sky. That's the glint off the copper Berger 144 LRHT. 6.5x47 2710 FPS. SD is 7 fps. I have high degree confidence in this one. 500 rounds on this proof CF barrel and it was last cleaned 250 rounds ago. For me cleaning is a few wet patches to attack carbon only and focosa on the throat area and crown is cleaned. I only trust a DIRTY Nasty fouled bore on a cold bore shot at a match or in the field. Clean bores are for the birds. I can only attach 10 photos so shot 6 and the entire video can be seen on my IG.
Attachments
PNWdude67
Well-Known Member
I call BS show us the video, I have a few videos recorded with a dirty bore. I would bet one of my ZCOs i can shoot a tighter 5 shot 100
Yard group with a bore I have not cleaned in over 200 rounds than any bore shoots 5 rounds cold after completely cleaning in between each round. The Dirty bore group will take less than 90 seconds to shoot and the clean cold bore group will take like 90 minutes? I shoot groups prone off a field bipod. No sleds or heavy bolted down gun … I think shooting a good group is on the shooter as much as the load and the rifle system. So shooting with a nice rhythm 5 shots with a few seconds between rounds verses breaking away from the gun, cleaning it and reengaging the target each shot would compromise the accuracy of a group I would shoot. Just my opinion but I don't think it is a practical endeavor to shoot a clean bore and it's been shown to be less accurate. I know BR guys clean frequently, but their bores are fouled by a few rounds to get the best groups from what I have seen. That's not my game so maybe I am wrong.
Having an Army Infantry Platoon Sergeant for an Instructor/Father does not suck. You probably knew more after his teaching you than a lot of people who have been shooting for years know. My Dad was an X Army Military Police Officer. I learned more from him than I did during basic training. You are one of the lucky ones.
Your observations and hunting style are spot on. I've hunted all over Alaska, New Zealand and Africa for 60 years and I've noted that the hunt is over when the bullet is in the air. To me, it is short-sighted to hunt at distances beyond 400 yards. There is rarely any stalking involved and the shot is the skill, not the hunting. The animal that is hunted for "sport" dies in earnest. Give him the dignity of a fair hunt.
Greatgrandad
Well-Known Member
Over my 60+ years of hunting, there have been so many times I and friends could never get within 400 yards of various game due to deep and steep canyons, ravines, across mountain side to mountain side, flat and open country with sparse and very short vegetation, game getting ready to leave the area, sudden and short presentations, etc, etc.
The past few elk I have taken only presented shots from 490 yards to over 800 yards, and there was no way I could close those distances without taking a lot of time crossing very steep and difficult terrain that would have assuredly caused or allowed the game to leave the area. And that is "IF" I could have made it. On two of those, I had to take a mile detour to get to the other ridge and make recovery.
