trouble with case stretch

[diriel]

Tricky,

H1000 is slower than 4350 and 4831. For the under 115gr bullets it is pretty much a So So yawner, and the other two powders really shine. The H4831 for intermediate bullets, and the H4350 for the light bullets is how I would stack them up.

I personally have a 6.5 Swede, and a 6.5 Swede BJAI. I have used the MagPro, it gives great to awesome velocity, but it is temperature sensitive. In the summer it can go from "A little warmish" To *Holy ***** real fast when the temps climb up about 105 F. or more. On top of that I never could get better than 3/4 MOA, the BJAI will do .2 / .3 on average. Actually it did for about the first 2500 rounds or so, now days it does 1/2 to 3/4 MOA on average. Time to rebarrel the old Savage A lot of hard fast rounds down the pipe. My buddy John, guy with the (2) 25's has that pound of MagPro sitting on his bench, and he had the exact same problems I had. Of course he did not use any light or middle weight bullets either. Nor did I, so maybe it would shine in that respect. I know I am done with it. I would be interested in your results, Mine as I say were purposely on *HOT* days with heavy bullets in both My Swede, and John's 25's.

RL22 and RL25 are both good. RL25 seemed maybe a little slow for us, our SD / ES was a bit higher than we liked to see, even with the heavy bullets. Accuracy at shorter ranges was real good though, so it does seem to show promise. We ran out of the pound we were trying, and went back to H1000, which runs a little bit slower, but has real nice accuracy and temp stability. RL22 also worked Really Really nice in the 25, but once again Temp sensitivity started to rear it's head a bit. Don't get me wrong, its not bad, just not up to H1000 for temp stability, nor is it up to H4831sc really. Though accuracy between the RL22 and H4831sc were real close on average for us, the Temp Swing tests we did throughout the year showed the H4831sc pulling ahead. Hey, I still have several pounds of RL22 and I Definitely will continue to use it! That being said, I also have a few pounds of H4831sc, and H4350. Man I wish Hodgdon could do an SC or SSC in 4350!!


Good Shooting,
Gary

 

[tomestone]

Tricky,

H1000 is slower than 4350 and 4831. For the under 115gr bullets it is pretty much a So So yawner, and the other two powders really shine. The H4831 for intermediate bullets, and the H4350 for the light bullets is how I would stack them up.

I personally have a 6.5 Swede, and a 6.5 Swede BJAI. I have used the MagPro, it gives great to awesome velocity, but it is temperature sensitive. In the summer it can go from "A little warmish" To *Holy ***** real fast when the temps climb up about 105 F. or more. On top of that I never could get better than 3/4 MOA, the BJAI will do .2 / .3 on average. Actually it did for about the first 2500 rounds or so, now days it does 1/2 to 3/4 MOA on average. Time to rebarrel the old Savage A lot of hard fast rounds down the pipe. My buddy John, guy with the (2) 25's has that pound of MagPro sitting on his bench, and he had the exact same problems I had. Of course he did not use any light or middle weight bullets either. Nor did I, so maybe it would shine in that respect. I know I am done with it. I would be interested in your results, Mine as I say were purposely on *HOT* days with heavy bullets in both My Swede, and John's 25's.

RL22 and RL25 are both good. RL25 seemed maybe a little slow for us, our SD / ES was a bit higher than we liked to see, even with the heavy bullets. Accuracy at shorter ranges was real good though, so it does seem to show promise. We ran out of the pound we were trying, and went back to H1000, which runs a little bit slower, but has real nice accuracy and temp stability. RL22 also worked Really Really nice in the 25, but once again Temp sensitivity started to rear it's head a bit. Don't get me wrong, its not bad, just not up to H1000 for temp stability, nor is it up to H4831sc really. Though accuracy between the RL22 and H4831sc were real close on average for us, the Temp Swing tests we did throughout the year showed the H4831sc pulling ahead. Hey, I still have several pounds of RL22 and I Definitely will continue to use it! That being said, I also have a few pounds of H4831sc, and H4350. Man I wish Hodgdon could do an SC or SSC in 4350!!


Good Shooting,
Gary

hello Gary It was -25F wind chill here again today spent most of the day in the cattle yard trying to water the herd. We have about 18in. of snow on the flat with 6.5in. of powder on top if it starts to blow its going to be a real good day .I;am going to load tonight some nosler brass,federal 210 primers IMR 4350 powder 51gr. Sierra 117gr.spitzer boat tail 3.170 c.o.l. I have a range at the farm I will do a 100yd and 200yd group. I will post the results tomorrow. Brad

 

[Trickymissfit]

hello Gary It was -25F wind chill here again today spent most of the day in the cattle yard trying to water the herd. We have about 18in. of snow on the flat with 6.5in. of powder on top if it starts to blow its going to be a real good day .I;am going to load tonight some nosler brass,federal 210 primers IMR 4350 powder 51gr. Sierra 117gr.spitzer boat tail 3.170 c.o.l. I have a range at the farm I will do a 100yd and 200yd group. I will post the results tomorrow. Brad

-25 below! I've seen a -50+ windchill factor down here a few times (think -65 is about as bad as it's gotten). The coldest temp in the state ever was a -34 degrees actual, and that was about a quarter mile from my front door. Anyway we're having a heat wave over here as it's in the low thirties and raining! If it wasn't wet I'd go dog busting down at my brothers, as I'm finally begining to shake this danged viral infection my girl friends gave me for Christmass. I can deal with very cold weather just fine as long as I get to see a little bit of sunshine and the wind is low. But that don't mean I'm into ice fishing!!! But think nothing of standing in a stream with snow on the ground (I have ex wives that will affirm the fact that I'm rather certifiable)

Seriously, your a better man than I am to be out there in a minus twenty something degrees and shooting. I'd be shivering so bad that I could hit the broadside of a red barn! (I did shoot the 22 rimfire challange for Big Macs with ice on the barrel a couple times)

My big project right now is to reseat several hundred primers! If it wasn't rainning, I'd set up a press outside and get it done (I just never was that interested in the grand scheme of reloading in the rain!). I'm kinda leary about doing some of it in doors.
gary

 

[tomestone]

-25 below! I've seen a -50+ windchill factor down here a few times (think -65 is about as bad as it's gotten). The coldest temp in the state ever was a -34 degrees actual, and that was about a quarter mile from my front door. Anyway we're having a heat wave over here as it's in the low thirties and raining! If it wasn't wet I'd go dog busting down at my brothers, as I'm finally begining to shake this danged viral infection my girl friends gave me for Christmass. I can deal with very cold weather just fine as long as I get to see a little bit of sunshine and the wind is low. But that don't mean I'm into ice fishing!!! But think nothing of standing in a stream with snow on the ground (I have ex wives that will affirm the fact that I'm rather certifiable)

Seriously, your a better man than I am to be out there in a minus twenty something degrees and shooting. I'd be shivering so bad that I could hit the broadside of a red barn! (I did shoot the 22 rimfire challange for Big Macs with ice on the barrel a couple times)

My big project right now is to reseat several hundred primers! If it wasn't rainning, I'd set up a press outside and get it done (I just never was that interested in the grand scheme of reloading in the rain!). I'm kinda leary about doing some of it in doors.
gary

Gary Sounds like you been up the creek a few times, stay away from the poision bait. As for this cold weather, If you can:t walk ,urinate,and carry a rifle,at the same time don"t drink beer. Alcohol and firearms don:t mix.....Brad

 

[tomestone]

hello Gary It was -25F wind chill here again today spent most of the day in the cattle yard trying to water the herd. We have about 18in. of snow on the flat with 6.5in. of powder on top if it starts to blow its going to be a real good day .I;am going to load tonight some nosler brass,federal 210 primers IMR 4350 powder 51gr. Sierra 117gr.spitzer boat tail 3.170 c.o.l. I have a range at the farm I will do a 100yd and 200yd group. I will post the results tomorrow. Brad

Hello Gary I;am here to let you know how it went. I started with a press prep, lite stoneing on ram top,clean shell holder top and bottom,measure ram play in bushing with dial gauge, .005 side play, measured 22 new Nosler brass and used 2.476 and 2.477 lenghts,primed cases with Federal 210 primers,weighted out 22 Sierra Spitzer B.T. at 117.1 grs , set powder measure lite, so I could hand trickle to 51 grs.of IMR 4350 powder,set all my c.o.l. at 3.170 mic.all, range results: 100 yds, Temp -16F, hum. 60%, lite breeze. Off hood of truck 5 shot group 2 ins. high, 2 in. horizontal string directly above target. 2 shots same hole. Brass check 2.475 to 2.476 brass shorten .001. when I measured new brass I measured with vernier caliper to besure no ingraving on case head was being measured. Case shoulder clean and brite full lenght, case mouth no carbon residue, no high pressure signs. My over all veiw on load, power charge dead on, bullet group, strait horizonal line extra effort payed off. Size of group,cold shooting, lead tip bullets, off hood of truck. Would I use this load again? Yes I would be great on white tail,I prefer polymer tip bullets for long range coyote hunting. Thanks for encourageing me, the little extra effort really paid off. Brad

 

[Trickymissfit]

Hello Gary I;am here to let you know how it went. I started with a press prep, lite stoneing on ram top,clean shell holder top and bottom,measure ram play in bushing with dial gauge, .005 side play, measured 22 new Nosler brass and used 2.476 and 2.477 lenghts,primed cases with Federal 210 primers,weighted out 22 Sierra Spitzer B.T. at 117.1 grs , set powder measure lite, so I could hand trickle to 51 grs.of IMR 4350 powder,set all my c.o.l. at 3.170 mic.all, range results: 100 yds, Temp -16F, hum. 60%, lite breeze. Off hood of truck 5 shot group 2 ins. high, 2 in. horizontal string directly above target. 2 shots same hole. Brass check 2.475 to 2.476 brass shorten .001. when I measured new brass I measured with vernier caliper to besure no ingraving on case head was being measured. Case shoulder clean and brite full lenght, case mouth no carbon residue, no high pressure signs. My over all veiw on load, power charge dead on, bullet group, strait horizonal line extra effort payed off. Size of group,cold shooting, lead tip bullets, off hood of truck. Would I use this load again? Yes I would be great on white tail,I prefer polymer tip bullets for long range coyote hunting. Thanks for encourageing me, the little extra effort really paid off. Brad

the problem with the .005" slop in the press is that the bore is worn eleptical. No real easy way to fix that (well there actually is, but it's a pain).

The vertical stringing may come from the wind being at your back, or your shooting into the wind. It won't take much to change point of impact. Another thing is that as the barrel heats up the point of impact will slightly change (how could it heat up in -16 degree weather?). I think I'd ask aroud to see if any of your buddies has a few Federal 210 mag primers they can give you. In that cold you may want a slightly hotter primer for better ignition. And surprisingly a tenth or two of grain here or there maybe all you need to really dial it in. I remember a guy that had a .270 Savage, and he just kept tweeking and tweeking here and there till he was shooting groups as small as .32" (I said I didn't believe it till he showed me the targets)
gary

 

[diriel]

Hey guys,

Just an FYI, Winchester LR primers are one of the hottest NON-Magnum primers. They are a step up in "heat" from the likes of Fed 210, CCI, Rem ect. I find that in normal capacity cases with a powder like 4350 a Win primer will most times do what you are looking for. This is the main reason I have the better part of a 5000 pack of win lr in my reloading safe. Wolf are real good, but they too are relatively mild, like a Fed 210 and company, so between the Win and the Wolf, I cover a LOT of ground. When I need a Mag, I usually go for the CCI #34 mil spec. Not that they are uber or super awesome, but unless you find a fed 215 mag match primer they seem to mostly be as good as any thing else. The only other Mag primer I keep on hand right now is the Remington LR Mag, it seems to be a bit milder, but still a step up from the Win. I need to investigate the Wolf LR Mag primers one of these days...

Have a good one,
Gary

 

[tomestone]

the problem with the .005" slop in the press is that the bore is worn eleptical. No real easy way to fix that (well there actually is, but it's a pain).

The vertical stringing may come from the wind being at your back, or your shooting into the wind. It won't take much to change point of impact. Another thing is that as the barrel heats up the point of impact will slightly change (how could it heat up in -16 degree weather?). I think I'd ask aroud to see if any of your buddies has a few Federal 210 mag primers they can give you. In that cold you may want a slightly hotter primer for better ignition. And surprisingly a tenth or two of grain here or there maybe all you need to really dial it in. I remember a guy that had a .270 Savage, and he just kept tweeking and tweeking here and there till he was shooting groups as small as .32" (I said I didn't believe it till he showed me the targets)
gary

hello Gary I hope you are feeling better. My RCBS press is wore out its time for a up grade Iäm watching Firecat"s thread [ reloading press up grade] to see where it goes. Their was a primer shortage here a year or so ago and had to settle for Federals or nothing.I was thinking along the same line as you on a hotter spark to lite up a cold charge. Thanks Gary have a good day Brad

 

[tomestone]

Hey guys,

Just an FYI, Winchester LR primers are one of the hottest NON-Magnum primers. They are a step up in "heat" from the likes of Fed 210, CCI, Rem ect. I find that in normal capacity cases with a powder like 4350 a Win primer will most times do what you are looking for. This is the main reason I have the better part of a 5000 pack of win lr in my reloading safe. Wolf are real good, but they too are relatively mild, like a Fed 210 and company, so between the Win and the Wolf, I cover a LOT of ground. When I need a Mag, I usually go for the CCI #34 mil spec. Not that they are uber or super awesome, but unless you find a fed 215 mag match primer they seem to mostly be as good as any thing else. The only other Mag primer I keep on hand right now is the Remington LR Mag, it seems to be a bit milder, but still a step up from the Win. I need to investigate the Wolf LR Mag primers one of these days...

Have a good one,
Gary

Hello Gary I have been using Winchester lr primers but ran out and my brother Darryl got me the Federals he is a hunting nut and needed some 30-06 rounds for white tail so I helped him out. When I get a chance to get to the city I:am going to pick up some lr mag primers,and some more Winchester primers to see what happens to the bullet groups.I know I:am better than a 2 in group. thanks Brad

 

[Trickymissfit]

hello Gary I hope you are feeling better. My RCBS press is wore out its time for a up grade Iäm watching Firecat"s thread [ reloading press up grade] to see where it goes. Their was a primer shortage here a year or so ago and had to settle for Federals or nothing.I was thinking along the same line as you on a hotter spark to lite up a cold charge. Thanks Gary have a good day Brad

eighty percent of the primers I use are Federals, and the only serious complaint I have with them is that they will vary from lot to lot.

Have fun shopping for a new press! I use a Forster as you already know, and it's a 1978 built one that's served me very well. But also like you have had had a want for a third press for several years now. I'll probably hunt up a good used Forster (actually I know where a brand new one is, that's part of an estate). I do recommend buying a little more press than you actually need, no matter what brand you buy.
gary

 

[tomestone]

eighty percent of the primers I use are Federals, and the only serious complaint I have with them is that they will vary from lot to lot.

Have fun shopping for a new press! I use a Forster as you already know, and it's a 1978 built one that's served me very well. But also like you have had had a want for a third press for several years now. I'll probably hunt up a good used Forster (actually I know where a brand new one is, that's part of an estate). I do recommend buying a little more press than you actually need, no matter what brand you buy.
gary

Hello Gary a Forster co-ax single stage press here is 369.99 + tax how much is the one you know about there? {our dollar is near par} Thanks Brad

 

[Trickymissfit]

Hello Gary a Forster co-ax single stage press here is 369.99 + tax how much is the one you know about there? {our dollar is near par} Thanks Brad

Midsouth or Midway (probably Midway) has them for $240 right now. I also see them on Ebay for a little less than $200 from time to time. The one I'm after was bought right after I bought mine from the same gun shop. When I bought mine I paid the gastly sum of $83, and was told I was a complete nut with too much money in my pockets. The older ones are slightly different than the new ones, but work exactly the sameway. The real difference is in the priming device and the handle. I of course like the older priming device best (I can adapt it to a new one with parts from Forster). Anyway when it came in the dealer called me at the house and asked me if I would allow him to set it up and load a few rounds, being as it was completely different than anything he'd ever seen before. The next day he ordered five more Co-Ax presses for his store, and sold all of them within a week. A guy I worked with named Bud bought one of the five, but never took the time to ever set it up! (this is 1978). He was a big time IMSHA shooter, so why I still don't know. Bud died awhile back with the press still in the box! Right now it's tied up in an estate with his kids fighting over everything but the reloading stuff. I told his daughter that I'd buy the press and a few of his dies if she ever gets to the point she can sell them.
gary

 

[tomestone]

Midsouth or Midway (probably Midway) has them for $240 right now. I also see them on Ebay for a little less than $200 from time to time. The one I'm after was bought right after I bought mine from the same gun shop. When I bought mine I paid the gastly sum of $83, and was told I was a complete nut with too much money in my pockets. The older ones are slightly different than the new ones, but work exactly the sameway. The real difference is in the priming device and the handle. I of course like the older priming device best (I can adapt it to a new one with parts from Forster). Anyway when it came in the dealer called me at the house and asked me if I would allow him to set it up and load a few rounds, being as it was completely different than anything he'd ever seen before. The next day he ordered five more Co-Ax presses for his store, and sold all of them within a week. A guy I worked with named Bud bought one of the five, but never took the time to ever set it up! (this is 1978). He was a big time IMSHA shooter, so why I still don't know. Bud died awhile back with the press still in the box! Right now it's tied up in an estate with his kids fighting over everything but the reloading stuff. I told his daughter that I'd buy the press and a few of his dies if she ever gets to the point she can sell them.
gary

Hello Gary To much stress there for me. +15F heading to the range then coyote hunting

 

[Trickymissfit]

Hello Gary To much stress there for me. +15F heading to the range then coyote hunting

fox and coyotes seem to be moving after dark right now (full moon). I seen fox foot prints right out in front of my back deck this morning when I filled the bird feeders. I know which pair it is, as their den is roughly three hundred yards west of me. I also have a pair of greys that come thru here about once every six weeks (kinda rare around here these days). Coyotes seem to stay east of me several hundred yards, but still close enough I can hear them. My brother's place has a couple pairs of fox, and a big bunch of coyotes. Seems like they breed faster than you can shoot them! Two years ago we killed seventeen of them in an area the size of a football field!

gary