Sierra matchking performance on game

[xsn10s]

The lead has to be alloyed (tin) to make it harder.
It would melt the lead core to lay level with gravity in the jacket. The jacket needs to be visually red (700-900°F) when heating, way above lead melt temps. Delicate dance with heating with eyes governing the "red" hot color of copper unless it is controlled better. Seems like a pain to do cup and core bullets this way.

Hey Bob this sounds like a comparison test for a guy we know! A gel test for Petey308. I wonder if he has ballistic gel?

 

[John Klingenberg]

I've shot a lot of hogs with the SMK, probably in the hundreds. I dont think it's a game getter, especially at distance. The old gamekings were even a bit soft. The new Gameking will deliver good accuracy and tough enough construction.

 

[Rogue]

My buddy took this Antelope at 200 yards with a .308 pushing a 168gr SMK. He was facing to our right. The pic shows the exit wound from the first shot which we thought was a miss as he did not even flinch!! I called it just high until he turned and started moving to our left. Seeing the wound I called the hit and had him shoot again. Second round struck him high in the neck. He dropped. Inspection showed a massive wound getting the top of both lungs and a 3" exit hole thru the rib cage.

 

[Parkerized]

Though I hesitate to tell anyone what and how to hunt, with the tremendous selection of quality hunting bullets available today it seems silly to willingly use "target" bullets to shoot big game. Clearly, they are not designed for it. Having shot thousands in NRA high power competition I can attest to their accuracy and many a prairie dog has fallen to 75gr Hornady match bullets out to truly long ranges.

However, I also lost a very nice Kudu in E. Africa due to a poor shot at 200yds with a very accurate 160g Accubond from a 280AI I believe if I had used my 160g Nosler partition my ill-advised sternum shot would have made this solid hit successful.

An eland at 125 yards rolled right over from a single 250g partition from my .358 Norma Magnum. This 1800# animal was running away, the bullet entering just at the rear hip and found in the skin behind shoulder opposite side.

Many deer are killed every year with primitive 12ga. slugs and bow and arrow while millions are killed with centerfire .22's in states where such are legal. All this proves that making "bullet laws" is a silly practice at best and unenforceable at any rate.

Game laws that allow for the confiscation of personal property without due process are clearly unconstitutional and those who sight them, or endorse them are neither good sportsmen nor particularly bright.

There is a place for copper bullets but with Kalifornia making them mandatory one has to hesitate since all "gun" laws in Kalifornia are designed to hinder, hamper and unquestionably end all hunting and gun ownership by constant harassment, misinformation and disingenuous "education" of the otherwise rational outdoorsman. There is nothing a copper bullet can do that the right lead/copper bullet can't do better.

 

[greenejc]

Though I hesitate to tell anyone what and how to hunt, with the tremendous selection of quality hunting bullets available today it seems silly to willingly use "target" bullets to shoot big game. Clearly, they are not designed for it. Having shot thousands in NRA high power competition I can attest to their accuracy and many a prairie dog has fallen to 75gr Hornady match bullets out to truly long ranges.

However, I also lost a very nice Kudu in E. Africa due to a poor shot at 200yds with a very accurate 160g Accubond from a 280AI I believe if I had used my 160g Nosler partition my ill-advised sternum shot would have made this solid hit successful.

An eland at 125 yards rolled right over from a single 250g partition from my .358 Norma Magnum. This 1800# animal was running away, the bullet entering just at the rear hip and found in the skin behind shoulder opposite side.

Many deer are killed every year with primitive 12ga. slugs and bow and arrow while millions are killed with centerfire .22's in states where such are legal. All this proves that making "bullet laws" is a silly practice at best and unenforceable at any rate.

Game laws that allow for the confiscation of personal property without due process are clearly unconstitutional and those who sight them, or endorse them are neither good sportsmen nor particularly bright.

There is a place for copper bullets but with Kalifornia making them mandatory one has to hesitate since all "gun" laws in Kalifornia are designed to hinder, hamper and unquestionably end all hunting and gun ownership by constant harassment, misinformation and disingenuous "education" of the otherwise rational outdoorsman. There is nothing a copper bullet can do that the right lead/copper bullet can't do better.

All true. However, cautioning about different states' laws is just passing information and requirements which we have to live with at this time. That doesn't mean it won't hopefully change in the future, though. I think most of us who have mentioned the difference in state laws just don't want to see someone's life ruined due to an unknowing violation. As to Gamekings, they are constructed to be as accurate as match bullets. The original Gamekings would sometimes fragment at close range, and acted like a varmint grenade on a large scale, giving one as many as 5 exit wounds in a deer. They've since thickened the jacket a little, and with the .308 Gamekings, you get a golfball to hardball size exit wound, depending on bullet weight. I especially like their ProHunter series, too. They're very accurate and well constructed. At higher altitudes, above 7,000 ft. where I usually hunt elk, they have the same drop profile as the Matchking does at sea level. That means I can use a less expensive but highly accurate bullet effectively at distance. I'm retired Army, so I'm cheap. I also get Sierra factory seconds from Midway and use them for practice and if they're shooting within an inch in my rifles, for hunting, too. I also like the Speer HotCor bullets, which are not advertised as a bonded bullet, but have some of their characteristics due to their construction methods. They have high B.C.'s for a flat-base bullet, with the 200 grain .308 between .48 and .5 B.C., giving it a flat trajectory from my rifles. The 250 grain .358 HotCor has a BC of .422 or maybe .442, depending on older or newer data, but it makes a 35 Whelen good for 800 yards or better at sea level with RL2000 or CFE 223, both of which will give velocities above 2650 in a 24" barrel. I also use RL15 and the older data for the Whelen, but I won't mention the charge weights with either the Sierra 225 grain or the Speer 250 grain, as they have 'lawyered down' their charge weights in this powder since 2019. But my velocities with the Speer run between 2670 and 2690 over my Crony at 10 feet, and 2720 to 2745 over the Chrony with the Sierra Gameking. The Sierra will mostly produce ragged holes with this powder, fireformed military brass, and Remington LR primers, while the Speer goes into about 0.8 5 shot groups. These are from standard barrels (one is a factory Remington CDL and the other is an E.R. Shaw26" 1 in 14 twist barrel on a Remington action, which gets an average of about 90fps more velocity over the 24" Whelen). Bottom line is I do all my hunting with either Speer, Nosler, or Sierra bullets, and I use match bullets for some of my varmint or long range practice. The 200 grain .308's (Sierra and Speer) perform about the same. The Sierras have a slight edge in accuracy at 100 yards which disappears at around 400 yards (possibly the Speers just need more distance to stabilize-that does happen) and in a Ruger M77MKII, I get 1" or less with the Speer at about 2570 to 2600, with around 0.7 or 0.8 5 shot groups at 100 yards. The 03A3 gets 0.7" groups and an increase in velocity of about 70 fps with both bullets. It likes Speers about as much as Sierras.

 

[Parkerized]

I agree. You should write a book...no wait, you just did. .

P.S. 125g 30 cal. Pro Hunter are awesome from my 30-30A.I. 10" contender to the 24" 30-06 mountain rifle.

I have yet to see SGKs in any competition but SMKs certainly make good practice for the former.

 

[greenejc]

I agree. You should write a book...no wait, you just did. .

P.S. 125g 30 cal. Pro Hunter are awesome from my 30-30A.I. 10" contender to the 24" 30-06 mountain rifle.

I have yet to see SGKs in any competition but SMKs certainly make good practice for the former.

Try the ProHunter 165 grain in your mountain rifle sometime. With your AI, you should be able to get about 3,000fps with it and a really flat trajectory. I did write a book. sorry. And some of the old time guys did use the 200 grain gameking because of the .55 or so B. C. and excellent accuracy. But mostly they stayed with the Matchkings because they're designed for matches. I like the 175 grain ones because I also load for a Remington 700 Varmint weight .308 with a 26" barrel and they give it good reach, velocity and accuracy. And they work good in 3006's and 300 win mags. I really miss the Hornaday 178 grain Amaxes, though.

 

[Parkerized]

Try the ProHunter 165 grain in your mountain rifle sometime. With your AI, you should be able to get about 3,000fps with it and a really flat trajectory. I did write a book. sorry. And some of the old time guys did use the 200 grain gameking because of the .55 or so B. C. and excellent accuracy. But mostly they stayed with the Matchkings because they're designed for matches. I like the 175 grain ones because I also load for a Remington 700 Varmint weight .308 with a 26" barrel and they give it good reach, velocity and accuracy. And they work good in 3006's and 300 win mags. I really miss the Hornaday 178 grain Amaxes, though.

I have a handful 178g Amax left from dad who swore by the 165 for elk. Just loaded 165 partitions for my next hunt, not yet booked.

We hunted Colorado many years of my youth.

 

[greenejc]

I have a handful 178g Amax left from dad who swore by the 165 for elk. Just loaded 165 partitions for my next hunt, not yet booked.

We hunted Colorado many years of my youth.

I currently live there, when I'm home. If you can get them, the 180 grain ProHunter bullets give you flat trajectories at high altitudes and a solid construction in a .308 bullet. But I think sierra has discontinued them. Speer still makes both the 180 grain HotCor and the 200 grain HotCor, which are very good bullets, and quite accurate, though. 1" or better groups in a 30-06 at MV's ranging from 2750-2800 for the 180 and 2600 to 2650 in the 200 grain bullet. And while Speer doesn't call them a bonded bullet, because the lead is heated and poured into the jacket, it is somewhat bonded into the jacket with these bullets, so the almost never separate. The 358 250gr Speer bullet is actually a little too tough for deer. For deer with the Whelen, I use the Sierra 225gr Gameking, which is mostly a DRT bullet out to 500+ yards. 500 yards with this cartridge is about the equivalent of a .44 Mag at the muzzle. At a thousand yards it has more penetration and energy than a .357 mag at the muzzle.

 

[Idaho Lefty]

I've shot a lot of hogs with the SMK, probably in the hundreds. I dont think it's a game getter, especially at distance. The old gamekings were even a bit soft. The new Gameking will deliver good accuracy and tough enough construction.

Have you or, any of your Friend's tried, the 6.5 cal. 140 grain, BTSP,.. GK's, in a 6.5 Creed on, Hogs or, Deer ??
Asking for a friend, who just bought,.. a Tikka T-3, "Lefty" in,.. 6.5 Creedmoor,..
Will they "Hold", together ??? Thanks, in advance !

 

[Idaho Lefty]

From past experience with match kings for hunting. If your willing to gamble on witch one will expand, fragment, explode our pencil punch. Tracking from under hoof to miles never to be found. Than please continue to do so. They do shoot extremely well!!

60 Years of Big Game Hunting, using MANY different Bullets and Calibers of Rifles, and I can conclude that,.. I AGREE with, THIS ^^^
We HAVE, the BERGERS in, Elite and Classic Hunters, PLUS H-VLD'S that,.. DO an AMAZING Job of, "putting down", Big Game & usually, DRT !
There's, NO need to, shoot Sierra MK's and take,.. a "CHANCE" on, it's,.. "Performance" !

 

[Parkerized]

Have you or, any of your Friend's tried, the 6.5 cal. 140 grain, BTSP,.. GK's, in a 6.5 Creed on, Hogs or, Deer ??
Asking for a friend, who just bought,.. a Tikka T-3, "Lefty" in,.. 6.5 Creedmoor,..
Will they "Hold", together ??? Thanks, in advance !

What could be better? Accurate and deadly to 400yds. Shot placement.

 

[lancetkenyon]

Well just another example of placing a bullet, doesn't matter what size in into the boiler room of an animal does what it is supposed to do, wreak havoc with the organs that sustain life. A .22 long rifle could have done the same thing given a reasonable range and shot. Bullets kill by disrupting the function of major organs, doesn't matter if that happened with a .22 long rifle (which many poachers can attest to) or .458 Winchester magnum. The only difference is how much of the target animal is desecrated by the impact of the bullet. Here in Wisconsin it is verbotten to shoot at any game with either FMJ or Match hollow points. If a warden had checked and found that you had shot the deer with an illegal bullet you could have lost the deer, your rifle and anything else connected with your illegal hunt to include your car or truck that transported you to your field destination. Your ability to hunt for many years could have been taken away with the same speed your bullet traveled to the target . While I congratulate you for your harvest, I also chastise you for shooting illegally . Good hunting ammo costs somewhere between $30 an $70 these days. Cheap compared to what it could have cost you. Also keep in mind that your words here stating that you most likely broke the law where you were hunting can come back and bite you in your behind when a warden or police officer reads it. All for the want of a good hunting bullet.

Wisconsin regs state "It is illegal to:
• Hunt a deer, bear, or elk with any ammunition
other than an arrow, bolt, or bullet that is a
single projectile of an expanding design"

Match hollow point bullets are DEFINITELY of the "expanding design".

 

[xsn10s]

I was going to go over the history of Berger match bullets then leading to hunting bullets but it's not worth it. I'll clear tips and use them and other match bullets when appropriate for hunting. I've had limited use for hunting with them but plenty of very knowledgeable people have taken a lot of game with them. And when in a lab I've done, and seen others do, gel and other media tests on them. All pointing to similar results as seen in the field.