Shooting long range help

[xsn10s]

Using a sturdy bench and shooting off competition rests.

I'd check to see if you're hitting the sling swivel stud on the front rest. I had that throw some rounds of the bench on a Eagle front rest.

 

[StumpGrinder]

I have been a long time member here but honestly not a long time long range shooter. My local range for many years only allowed 300 yards shooting and it was often crowded. Well My wife and I moved to our own property a few years back and I finally cleared out a 600 yard range. How do you know when working up loads if it is you, the weather (wind and such) or the load if your groups are not the greatest? My shooting range is not too effected by wind (most of it is a clear cut path through woods) so I think I can eliminate that from the equation. I would say maybe 100-200 yards of it is slightly open to winds. So for example, I recently worked up a load for my 28Nosler. At 100 yards it shoots between .6- .75MOA at 100 yards. I had 3 rounds left and said screw it im shooting 600 lol. at 600 I shot an 8 inch group with those 3 remaining loads. 2 of the hits were within 4 inches of each other and strung vertically for the most part but the other hit was in between the two height wise but was about 8 inches left. So for an in-experienced long range shooter, how would I know if I pulled that shot, or maybe the wind caught it or maybe there is an issue with my rifle system (bedding issue) or a problem with my load? I understand to truly know I likely need to shoot many more rounds, but im just trying to limit the rounds thrown down the tube to hopefully preserve the barrel. I do not intend to shoot this rifle a ton so would like to keep the tube as long as possible. I will never be hunting to 600 (400 yard max where I hunt) so really it is not too much of an issue but I do want to try to improve myself. I am pretty consistent when reloading so I don't think it is an issue with my loading process itself but could be an issue with my load. Thoughts?

FYI, I do not have people near me to shoot with to confirm if it is me or the load or the rifle etc or to have someone help in person.

I'm new to the forum however I've been shooting for 30 fears. You first have to eliminate human error, a lead sled or similar product will help. Once that is done you can experiment with different loads. If you hand load there are lots of fine tuning you can do, distance off the lands, charge weight, bullet selection, etc, etc, etc. Some shooter tune their rifles to the first shot from a cold barrel, some tune shot strings which can move as the barrel heats. I shoot a free floated Rigger M77 so barrel heating does not effect me much. If the stock is touching the barrel unevenly the shot string will walk as the barrel heats. I always free float my rifles and reduce trigger pull to as little as is safe. 1.5 lbs or less is good for my 308. This will eliminate flinch to a large degree. Every rifle has a particular load combination it likes best, some have more than one. I find one that will give .5 inch groups at 100 yds and stick with it. First thing is to remove human error then go from there.

 

[StumpGrinder]

I'm new to the forum however I've been shooting for 30 fears. You first have to eliminate human error, a lead sled or similar product will help. Once that is done you can experiment with different loads. If you hand load there are lots of fine tuning you can do, distance off the lands, charge weight, bullet selection, etc, etc, etc. Some shooter tune their rifles to the first shot from a cold barrel, some tune shot strings which can move as the barrel heats. I shoot a free floated Rigger M77 so barrel heating does not effect me much. If the stock is touching the barrel unevenly the shot string will walk as the barrel heats. I always free float my rifles and reduce trigger pull to as little as is safe. 1.5 lbs or less is good for my 308. This will eliminate flinch to a large degree. Every rifle has a particular load combination it likes best, some have more than one. I find one that will give .5 inch groups at 100 yds and stick with it. First thing is to remove human error then go from there.

Now as a new member to this forum I have a question. I see people comparing diffrent caliber rifles to each other but the always seem to load the results towards their favorite. For example I saw a utube video comparing 6.5 creedmore, 140 gr bullet at I think 2400 or 2500 fps to 308, 155 gr bullet at 2700. No mention of bc or sd, the creedmore appeared to out perform the 308 past 500 yds. Hear is my question if the sd and bc and velocities were the same shouldn't the bullets have the same flight path regardless of caliber?

 

[Laguna Freak]

I have been a long time member here but honestly not a long time long range shooter. My local range for many years only allowed 300 yards shooting and it was often crowded. Well My wife and I moved to our own property a few years back and I finally cleared out a 600 yard range. How do you know when working up loads if it is you, the weather (wind and such) or the load if your groups are not the greatest? My shooting range is not too effected by wind (most of it is a clear cut path through woods) so I think I can eliminate that from the equation. I would say maybe 100-200 yards of it is slightly open to winds. So for example, I recently worked up a load for my 28Nosler. At 100 yards it shoots between .6- .75MOA at 100 yards. I had 3 rounds left and said screw it im shooting 600 lol. at 600 I shot an 8 inch group with those 3 remaining loads. 2 of the hits were within 4 inches of each other and strung vertically for the most part but the other hit was in between the two height wise but was about 8 inches left. So for an in-experienced long range shooter, how would I know if I pulled that shot, or maybe the wind caught it or maybe there is an issue with my rifle system (bedding issue) or a problem with my load? I understand to truly know I likely need to shoot many more rounds, but im just trying to limit the rounds thrown down the tube to hopefully preserve the barrel. I do not intend to shoot this rifle a ton so would like to keep the tube as long as possible. I will never be hunting to 600 (400 yard max where I hunt) so really it is not too much of an issue but I do want to try to improve myself. I am pretty consistent when reloading so I don't think it is an issue with my loading process itself but could be an issue with my load. Thoughts?

FYI, I do not have people near me to shoot with to confirm if it is me or the load or the rifle etc or to have someone help in person.

How hot was your barrel when you shot the 600? Did you let it cool adequately before the last 3?

 

[Bigeclipse]

How hot was your barrel when you shot the 600? Did you let it cool adequately before the last 3?

Right now I've been using a chamber chiller with 2 minutes between shots which gets the barrel Luke warm to the touch before the next shot.

 

[Laguna Freak]

I agree with xsn10s advice. If ES is high it will definitely effect vertical at long range. You might need to find a different node. Before I did that, I would try different seating depths to see if a longer or shorter jump tames the ES and tightens the group at long range. Its been known to happen...

 

[david g ranes]

Stay away from lead sled shot bags full of sand cheap and as solid as you can get you want free recoil not barrel jump. David

 

[Recon$$]

First thing I do every range session is shoot a 700 yard cold bore with my hunting rifles. Not exactly what your asking but good hits at what I consider my personal reasonable kill range gives me the confidence in the loads/rifle that anywhere 700 and in is a given if I can setup for the shot. I personally have yet to find a load that groups well at 100 that doesn't group well at extended ranges but I know others on here have had different experiences. So I know it can happen. I would agree the vertical stringing is most likely a velocity consistentsy issue. I would also say that if you are not accustomed to longer ranges give it some time, sometimes you just need trigger time.

 

[Laguna Freak]

Now as a new member to this forum I have a question. I see people comparing diffrent caliber rifles to each other but the always seem to load the results towards their favorite. For example I saw a utube video comparing 6.5 creedmore, 140 gr bullet at I think 2400 or 2500 fps to 308, 155 gr bullet at 2700. No mention of bc or sd, the creedmore appeared to out perform the 308 past 500 yds. Hear is my question if the sd and bc and velocities were the same shouldn't the bullets have the same flight path regardless of caliber?

If they were exactly identical velocity, bc / geometry, bullet weight, and fired from barrels that exhibited exactly identical harmonics, then you could reasonably expect the same flight paths from 2 different calibers. Someone correct me if I am mistaken.

 

[MS660Magnum]

I'm pretty new to all of this as well, but it sounds to me like you're paying attention to your reloads so I'm not thinking it's an ammo problem. Plus, if they group at 100, that accuracy should carry downrange.

Do you have to change your position significantly to shoot your longer range? For instance, where I shoot I have a flat range and bench for 100 and 200, but to make it 300-800 I have to shoot 12° uphill and a slightly different direction. That means I have to completely change my platform (the arrangement of my bags, bipod, and body) or the rounds land all over the place. It could be you've got something similar going on and just need to focus on building your natural point of aim (NPA).

Or it's hitting something under recoil, as others have mentioned.

 

[Bdubose]

Load tests at 100 are not reliable.
Load some more and shoot groups at 300

 

[Stgraves260]

I have been a long time member here but honestly not a long time long range shooter. My local range for many years only allowed 300 yards shooting and it was often crowded. Well My wife and I moved to our own property a few years back and I finally cleared out a 600 yard range. How do you know when working up loads if it is you, the weather (wind and such) or the load if your groups are not the greatest? My shooting range is not too effected by wind (most of it is a clear cut path through woods) so I think I can eliminate that from the equation. I would say maybe 100-200 yards of it is slightly open to winds. So for example, I recently worked up a load for my 28Nosler. At 100 yards it shoots between .6- .75MOA at 100 yards. I had 3 rounds left and said screw it im shooting 600 lol. at 600 I shot an 8 inch group with those 3 remaining loads. 2 of the hits were within 4 inches of each other and strung vertically for the most part but the other hit was in between the two height wise but was about 8 inches left. So for an in-experienced long range shooter, how would I know if I pulled that shot, or maybe the wind caught it or maybe there is an issue with my rifle system (bedding issue) or a problem with my load? I understand to truly know I likely need to shoot many more rounds, but im just trying to limit the rounds thrown down the tube to hopefully preserve the barrel. I do not intend to shoot this rifle a ton so would like to keep the tube as long as possible. I will never be hunting to 600 (400 yard max where I hunt) so really it is not too much of an issue but I do want to try to improve myself. I am pretty consistent when reloading so I don't think it is an issue with my loading process itself but could be an issue with my load. Thoughts?

FYI, I do not have people near me to shoot with to confirm if it is me or the load or the rifle etc or to have someone help in person.

I would try putting a muzzle break on that 28 Nosler to help tame it down. That will definitely help you out and see if your flinching. Work a load up at 300 or even 400 yards. Working a load up at 100 yards only lets you know you have a good short range load. When working a load up at 300 or 400 yards it is far enough to show you your flaws.

 

[Plinker147]

Best thing for you to do is hang some steel at 600 and just practice shooting it. Once you get your confidence up and comfortable at that distance you will know when you are the problem.

Typically if your rest is solid vertical stringing is a sign of a load issue, horizontal is shooter / wind. You need to shoot that load againto be sure

 

[Stgraves260]

This is my 100 yard zero after getting a load development at 400 yards.