Sendero Advice

[brentc]

Depending on barrel lengths, throats, powders etc., I would say close to 3000 fps would be expected on the high end for both the 180's in the 7RM and 210-215's in the 300 WM. 3000 fps is a typical max velocity for 160's out of 24" 7 RM and maybe another 50 fps for a 26". With the right combo of barrel and powder 3000 would be possible for 180's but 2800 fps would be more common.

I have shot 210's @ 2935 out of my 24" 300 WSM over RL17.

When comparing apples to apples, a 300 WM is going to shoot a 210-215 bullet about the same velocity that a 7RM is going to shoot a 180.

EDIT: My 300 RUM shoots 210's @ 3130 over Retumbo

I have both a 7mm RM and a 300 WM pushing the very combos discussed here. The 300 WM is a factory chambered 26" 5r. I push the 215s with extreme consistency at 2840 fps.

You won't get 3000 with a 300 WM with 215s in a factory Sendero chamber with any sort of consistency. Truthfully, anything over 2900 fps is pushing the snot out of it. Especially if you are limited to a 26" tube. 2800-2850 is the comfort zone.

The 7mm RM will easily reach 2950 with a factory chambered 26" Sendero with a 180. 3000 might be a touch much, but 2950 is a very realistic expectation.

 

[cohunter14]

I have both a 7mm RM and a 300 WM pushing the very combos discussed here. The 300 WM is a factory chambered 26" 5r. I push the 215s with extreme consistency at 2840 fps.

You won't get 3000 with a 300 WM with 215s in a factory Sendero chamber with any sort of consistency. Truthfully, anything over 2900 fps is pushing the snot out of it. Especially if you are limited to a 26" tube. 2800-2850 is the comfort zone.

The 7mm RM will easily reach 2950 with a factory chambered 26" Sendero with a 180. 3000 might be a touch much, but 2950 is a very realistic expectation.

Those are the numbers that I have seen, but as I was saying, that is for factory chamberings. If you get a custom, I am sure you can get closer to the numbers Montana is talking about. I think it would be very difficult to push the 210s or 215s to 3,000fps in a factory 300 win.

 

[brentc]

The thing I did fail to mention is the capability of the 7mm RM with a 168 vs. the 180. When comparing the velocities capable with a factory chamber, they are darn close to being ballistic twins. The 168 at 3025-3050 and the 180 at 2925- 2950 are nearly identical.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

I have both a 7mm RM and a 300 WM pushing the very combos discussed here. The 300 WM is a factory chambered 26" 5r. I push the 215s with extreme consistency at 2840 fps.

You won't get 3000 with a 300 WM with 215s in a factory Sendero chamber with any sort of consistency. Truthfully, anything over 2900 fps is pushing the snot out of it. Especially if you are limited to a 26" tube. 2800-2850 is the comfort zone.

The 7mm RM will easily reach 2950 with a factory chambered 26" Sendero with a 180. 3000 might be a touch much, but 2950 is a very realistic expectation.

I originally said "close to 3000 fps". This member is getting 3035 or so in a 28" Lazzaroni.

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/comparing-berger-210-vld-215-hybrid-88657/index9.html

Consistency of load will vary rifle to rifle. Some rifles like max loads and some don't.

As I mentioned, I have shot 210's out of a 24" 300 WSM @ 2935 fps over RL17. I would think it would be possible for a 300 WM to do a little better in a 26" barrel.

A quick search of the internet showed the 7 RM pushing 180's in the range of 2800-3000. Pretty much the same range you will see for the 300 WM pushing 210-215 bullets.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

Those are the numbers that I have seen, but as I was saying, that is for factory chamberings. If you get a custom, I am sure you can get closer to the numbers Montana is talking about. I think it would be very difficult to push the 210s or 215s to 3,000fps in a factory 300 win.

Sendero's are long throated which will facilitate higher velocities. Yes, it may be quite difficult to see 3000 fps from a 300 WM shooting 210-215 bullets. That would certainly be the upper end. RL22 and RL17 would probably be the best candidates for higher velocities in the WM.

I'll also mention, that I once shot another guy's 300 WM through my chrony once because he wanted to know what velocity he was getting. The load was RL22 pushing 180's @ 3200 fps which is exactly the same velocity my 300 WSM was pushing 180's over RL19.

 

[brentc]

I originally said "close to 3000 fps". This member is getting 3035 or so in a 28" Lazzaroni.

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/comparing-berger-210-vld-215-hybrid-88657/index9.html

Consistency of load will vary rifle to rifle. Some rifles like max loads and some don't.

As I mentioned, I have shot 210's out of a 24" 300 WSM @ 2935 fps over RL17. I would think it would be possible for a 300 WM to do a little better in a 26" barrel.

A quick search of the internet showed the 7 RM pushing 180's in the range of 2800-3000. Pretty much the same range you will see for the 300 WM pushing 210-215 bullets.

Yeah, I know the post very well. However, that is a custom rifle with a custom chamber in a broughton 5c not a Lazzaroni. It's not wise for someone to go out with their factory rifle and expect this type of performance.

I'm just calling it like I've seen it. I too have pushed the 300 WSM hard with RL17 and seen amazing velocities.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

The rifle was a Lazzaroni and he did have a custom chamber and throat.

My point is simply, that when comparing apples to apples the 7 RM is going to push 180's about the same velocity range as a 300 WM can push 210-215's. The 7 might have a slight velocity edge but not much.

The advantages of the 300 are longer barrel life and better terminal performance.

 

[brentc]

Surely, you're not referring to Broz's rifle as being a Lazzaroni. I'm 99% sure it's not. Maybe he can shed some light here.

I see all the points you're making here and I don't disagree with your conclusion. I just felt that objectivity was starting to slip.

 

[tinytree]

one thing i will add, especially for handloaders, is the extreme versatility of the 7RM.

i actually went through this whole exact decision-making process about 15 years ago. i was determined to get a sendero in 300WM, but got a good buy on a 7RM, and bought it. it never fails to amaze me! i initially shot a bunch of different factory stuff, then started working up 175g handloads. my barrel is a 24, so i am not getting the speeds that you guys are generating with the 26in tubes, but it has really shot some fantastic groups.

then, a few years ago, i got a book on longrange hunting for Christmas, and it had a lot of info on the 7RM, and i realized i hadn't even scratched the surface of its potential. i went through a bunch of factory 160, 140 and 139 stuff, and started working up handloads again. one of my favorites is the combined tech 140 gr ballistic tip. another plus has been the recoil! the difference in a 140g and a 175g barnes is VERY noticeable!

it has been very easy to find loads that my gun is happy with across a very wide range of speeds and bullet weights.

i will at least say that the 7RM is a very interesting cartridge, especially for handloaders, and my sendero has been very accurate with a wide range of stuff.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

Surely, you're not referring to Broz's rifle as being a Lazzaroni. I'm 99% sure it's not. Maybe he can shed some light here.

I see all the points you're making here and I don't disagree with your conclusion. I just felt that objectivity was starting to slip.

My bad, the stock is a Lazz, the action a Defiance and a Krieger 5r barrel.

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/my-new-300-win-build-55269/

I was definitely trying to be objective. I have shot more rounds through 7 RM's than any other cartridge. It's a great cartridge but it isn't a 300 WM.

A lot of guys love their 7's and sometimes I think they start to loose their objectivity. I have seen some very eyebrow raising claims about 7's in these forums. A good round. It is what is.