Revolver vs auto

[Deleted member 107796]

If you can't hit your target any handgun is useless at 460 is a handful

Excellent info from all, especially the ones about having both flavors!

I just wanted to add something about accuracy. It's common knowledge that semiautos were primarily designed to be light and cheap to manufacture, as military weapons. That lightness does play into accuracy and having done my first serious handgun training over the last few years, I've concluded that it takes much more training to be good at 25 yards with a semiauto than it does with a revolver of the same barrel length, and I can extent that to almost all of the shooters at my range making the same comparison. In my opinion, it's the added heft of a revolver that makes it more accurate and my Taurus model 44 ported 8.4" 44rm is easily the most accurate handgun I own. I had my friend's 95lb 18 year old daughter shooting it and she loved it, due the weight and balance of this gun. I also put the Hogue Monogrip on everything from my Ruger Single 6 to this Taurus and it is a huge improvement over the stock grips.
That being said, my Beretta PX4 Storm in 45acp is a strong second due to its' rotating barrel, making it very smooth to shoot.

 

[josip89]

I know that i need more practise with gun for sure.

And for short rifle and shootguns I dont see myself to use them much,because I have 375HH and 300grains pills for tracking wounded dangerous animal (or any animals) and I dont see myself either to going to the hunt with two rifles and revolver.
When I go in the woods for anything I have ruger on me,when I go hunting I have one rifle and revolver and I dont se myself to put in backpack another rifle.

 

[HRM Johnny]

I have a short barreled AR in 458 Socom that would probably be my first choice if a grizzly was charging but for an easy to carry lighter option I would have to go with my compensated Coonan 1911 in 357 mag. Its never jammed and shoots great. Some years ago I had a S&W Alaskan guide 44 mag revolver that I wish I would have kept but it really wasn't that fun to shoot being so light and having such a short barrel. I'm not sure I could put 3 rounds on target fast enough with that kind of recoil.

I appreciate your post. I have thought for sometime that one of the best choices for defense against the bear (not hunting them; but defense against attach) would be an AR in 458 SOCOM. I've never posted because I live on the East Coast and have never encountered a grizzly. That having been said, I think you'd have a hard time finding anything better than an AR in 458 SOCOM.
-Johnny

 

[MZmoose]

I have been in a gun fight with the big fury once with a glock 23 and involved in another in which the guy getting chewed on had my 357!
I grabbed a huge stick and hit that bear as hard as I could on top of its head as it chewed on his foot! It let go of the guys leg looked at me and he put two rounds into it as it was grabbing his other leg!
I went to town and bought a 5" 460s&w. I carried it for that fall and went back to and religiously pack my 5" 44 mag.

My biggest issue with a semi auto pistol is if you get into it with something that intends to hurt you, when you push that gun into that threat it unlocks your slide and you now have a short club.
When the crap hits the fan keep it simple and be proficient with what you have!

You can't beat a revolver for hand to bear combat. Hope your buddy was ok. The two close calls I got into with black bears were unintentionally getting between a sow and her cub while packing in some deer bait to my stand without any gun. Had to use a stick and poked her in the face with it to keep her at bay so I could back away. Not a fun scenario and never go into the woods unarmed again. The other was a 200lb black bear hit too far back with a 300 win mag. When I found him in the brush he charged and took 2 more rounds, the last one was at 15 feet as I was backing away. The 300 mag hits were in the chest and destroyed his heart lungs but his adrenaline was up and he was mad. So when it comes to handguns I want something big that penetrates and even then it may not save your hide from getting chewed on. A problem I see with semiautomatics is the shape of the bullet nose. It has be tapered to feed and function through the gun. This makes your meplat small and keeps your wound channel more narrow than a wide flat nose design. Revolvers are more versatile and you can shoot whatever bullet design fits in the cylinder.

 

[MZmoose]

I appreciate your post. I have thought for sometime that one of the best choices for defense against the bear (not hunting them; but defense against attach) would be an AR in 458 SOCOM. I've never posted because I live on the East Coast and have never encountered a grizzly. That having been said, I think you'd have a hard time finding anything better than an AR in 458 SOCOM.
-Johnny

I would agree with you. My buddies and I take a trip to south Texas every spring to hunt pigs. We used AR-15s in 5.56 and 6.8mm for a couple years but ended up getting 458 Socom uppers last year after consistently loosing big pigs. This spring every pig we shot we recovered. We even doubled up on pass thru shots. It's a real power house on game within it reasonable range. I call it my semiauto 45/70.

 

[osok-1k]

I think we have diverged from the original post and set of conditions applicable to the post. I respect and agree that more than two weapons on a hunting trip is a lot to carry and not necessary. Having done some giude work in the Rockies where bears are prevalent we all carried large caliber revolvers, mostly 44mag but that was before the advent of 10mm, 454 Casul and big S&W revolver cartridges like 460 and 500. A number of bear country guides now carry 10mm hard cast in Glocks, it penetrates well and has enough velocity / weight to be effective plus a bunch of rounds as compared to a revolver. I would not bet my life on a .357 against a large bear, he will likely die from the wounds but it will be some time after you do from his disassembling you. Ever watch a 1200 lb grizzly pull the shoulder from a bull Elk like it was nothing? I have and we thin skinned folk are no where near as tough as an Elk. Look at the article about dangerous encounters on the Buffalo Bore website. Real world experience vs. opinions from people who have likely never been in those encounters.

 

[josip89]

I have idea of a best revolver for selfdefense in the woods but I dont know how to make Ruger to produce it.


Idea is make version of GP100 4.2" and SP101 3" in DAO (double action only) like in LCR.
My idea is that selfdefense gun dont need single action and it is better for owner ,because You as owner are forced to train in DA.
I would like to see enclosed hammer(so nothing can snag or something) on GP100 and SP101 with smoth and lighter trigger (like 7is pounds) for more speed and precision.
I think better rear and front sight from factory is nice (like adjustable day/night sights ,fiber and tritium)
I personally shoot handload ammo and it was hot so good long and strong cylinder is must.

That is for 357 mag
But i like very much idea of 5 shoot 44 mag in GP 100

And it would be nice to have option of porting (mag na port or something)

How many of You think something like that is good idea?

 

[sea2summit]

I have idea of a best revolver for selfdefense in the woods but I dont know how to make Ruger to produce it.


Idea is make version of GP100 4.2" and SP101 3" in DAO (double action only) like in LCR.
My idea is that selfdefense gun dont need single action and it is better for owner ,because You as owner are forced to train in DA.
I would like to see enclosed hammer(so nothing can snag or something) on GP100 and SP101 with smoth and lighter trigger (like 7is pounds) for more speed and precision.
I think better rear and front sight from factory is nice (like adjustable day/night sights ,fiber and tritium)
I personally shoot handload ammo and it was hot so good long and strong cylinder is must.

That is for 357 mag
But i like very much idea of 5 shoot 44 mag in GP 100

And it would be nice to have option of porting (mag na port or something)

How many of You think something like that is good idea?

I think the idea is fair but the actual market for a DAO .44 would be pretty small. A short .44 is probably about the worst possible way to learn DAO so it's going to have to be folks that have another "trainer" gun that has double action. Honestly, if the people I know personally not over the internet there's only one who is competent that I know of and he's retired LEO and carted a wheel gun for his career.

 

[josip89]

I think the idea is fair but the actual market for a DAO .44 would be pretty small. A short .44 is probably about the worst possible way to learn DAO so it's going to have to be folks that have another "trainer" gun that has double action. Honestly, if the people I know personally not over the internet there's only one who is competent that I know of and he's retired LEO and carted a wheel gun for his career.

Agree ,but 44 mag would be option.
357 mag would be first option.

 

[freddiej]

I have idea of a best revolver for selfdefense in the woods but I dont know how to make Ruger to produce it.


Idea is make version of GP100 4.2" and SP101 3" in DAO (double action only) like in LCR.
My idea is that selfdefense gun dont need single action and it is better for owner ,because You as owner are forced to train in DA.
I would like to see enclosed hammer(so nothing can snag or something) on GP100 and SP101 with smoth and lighter trigger (like 7is pounds) for more speed and precision.
I think better rear and front sight from factory is nice (like adjustable day/night sights ,fiber and tritium)
I personally shoot handload ammo and it was hot so good long and strong cylinder is must.

That is for 357 mag
But i like very much idea of 5 shoot 44 mag in GP 100

And it would be nice to have option of porting (mag na port or something)

How many of You think something like that is good idea?

Josip89,
yes, I think it is a good idea. I used to make them for people in Grizz country. I used non-Ruger platforms but I used to make them.
I have a suggestion.. look at the L-frame Smith and Wesson's. First the newest model in 44 SPL/Mag; the new-ish Model 69. it is a 5 shot 44 special/magnum. wonderful gun. you can find them for between $750 and $900 dollars on many websites. You could go for the 29/629 N-frame. Everything the 69 and 686 can have done to it the 29/629 can have done to it. Next you could look at the 686 and 686+ for 38/375 Mag (L-frame as well). the 686 + is a 7 shot 357 Mag with a very easily smoothed out D/A. The reason I know, I am primarily a pistolsmith that does such things. the hammer can be easily bobbed for a no snag look. I would also suggest finding a model 25/625 in 45 Colt where you can put a serious hurt on a bear with juiced up 45 Colt 300/350 grain slugs. Another suggestion is the X-frames, 460 S&W and 500 S&W, both can be better than any other caliber on the market. the 460 can shoot 45 Colt, 454 Cassull, and 460 hand loaded. none of those hand loads can be beat. The 500 might be more of a close up (75 yards to 0 yards) but it can deliver one hell of a punch on bears or other toothy disagreeable things. All adjustable sights will snag; however, there is a less likely snag on the rear sight than the hammer. S&W can be outfitted with a set of night sights for low light and dark encounters. the Tritium filled sights are offered for around $200.00 per set and they are adjustable. there is a cross over sight that fits the adjustable sight screw pattern and cut out with illuminated dots that is virtually no snag as well. They are just not adjustable.

You can do the same exact thing with the new/newer Colt Pythons, Cobras and King Cobras in 38/357. if you can find one of the 1997 through 2008 Anacondas they can be done up the same way as the S&W's This time in 44 SPL/MAG or 45 Colt.

I have tried really hard to smooth out a Sturm/Ruger, but nothing I have ever tried has ever made one lick of good in my opinion. My customers on the other hand loved what I did. They never came out to my satisfaction. I might have dropped the trigger to a reasonable 6 pounds, I might have had success smoothing it out a bit. but nothing like what I can do with the Colts and S&W's.

the last last one I know how to and have smoothed out is the Raging Bull series from Braz-Tech International.. better known as Taurus. these guns have come up in quality over the years, but I am still hesitant to have confidence in them.

My advice is to find something you are comfortable shooting then make it your own. there are some very good quality chest rigs that will accommodate the big framed revolvers. Alien gear, Hunter, and many more make great chest rigs. I happen to have a few from my grizz country days for a few 1911's in 10MM (Delta Elite), 45 Super (Para-Ord), S&W 29 & 25; 44 mag/45 Colt.
I hope this helps with either finding or building your dream bear gun.

 

[memtb]

If you are hunting, either will do the job....provided it's of adequate velocity, bullet weight, bullet construction, and bore diameter. In a defense situation......an entirely different scenario, with different recommendations! memtb

 

[josip89]

Josip89,
yes, I think it is a good idea. I used to make them for people in Grizz country. I used non-Ruger platforms but I used to make them.
I have a suggestion.. look at the L-frame Smith and Wesson's. First the newest model in 44 SPL/Mag; the new-ish Model 69. it is a 5 shot 44 special/magnum. wonderful gun. you can find them for between $750 and $900 dollars on many websites. You could go for the 29/629 N-frame. Everything the 69 and 686 can have done to it the 29/629 can have done to it. Next you could look at the 686 and 686+ for 38/375 Mag (L-frame as well). the 686 + is a 7 shot 357 Mag with a very easily smoothed out D/A. The reason I know, I am primarily a pistolsmith that does such things. the hammer can be easily bobbed for a no snag look. I would also suggest finding a model 25/625 in 45 Colt where you can put a serious hurt on a bear with juiced up 45 Colt 300/350 grain slugs. Another suggestion is the X-frames, 460 S&W and 500 S&W, both can be better than any other caliber on the market. the 460 can shoot 45 Colt, 454 Cassull, and 460 hand loaded. none of those hand loads can be beat. The 500 might be more of a close up (75 yards to 0 yards) but it can deliver one hell of a punch on bears or other toothy disagreeable things. All adjustable sights will snag; however, there is a less likely snag on the rear sight than the hammer. S&W can be outfitted with a set of night sights for low light and dark encounters. the Tritium filled sights are offered for around $200.00 per set and they are adjustable. there is a cross over sight that fits the adjustable sight screw pattern and cut out with illuminated dots that is virtually no snag as well. They are just not adjustable.

You can do the same exact thing with the new/newer Colt Pythons, Cobras and King Cobras in 38/357. if you can find one of the 1997 through 2008 Anacondas they can be done up the same way as the S&W's This time in 44 SPL/MAG or 45 Colt.

I have tried really hard to smooth out a Sturm/Ruger, but nothing I have ever tried has ever made one lick of good in my opinion. My customers on the other hand loved what I did. They never came out to my satisfaction. I might have dropped the trigger to a reasonable 6 pounds, I might have had success smoothing it out a bit. but nothing like what I can do with the Colts and S&W's.

the last last one I know how to and have smoothed out is the Raging Bull series from Braz-Tech International.. better known as Taurus. these guns have come up in quality over the years, but I am still hesitant to have confidence in them.

My advice is to find something you are comfortable shooting then make it your own. there are some very good quality chest rigs that will accommodate the big framed revolvers. Alien gear, Hunter, and many more make great chest rigs. I happen to have a few from my grizz country days for a few 1911's in 10MM (Delta Elite), 45 Super (Para-Ord), S&W 29 & 25; 44 mag/45 Colt.
I hope this helps with either finding or building your dream bear gun.

I mention Ruger on the first place because I have expirience and trust with them.

My idea is not to have bobed hammer like Gemini customs or anybody else ,but all closed hammer like Kimber K6S and Ruger LCR.
For the trigger, I am reading that LCR have much lighter DA than SP101 and GP100.
And I would like to see Ruger (or anybody else) made factory revolver with all that features.

My question is how to force Ruger to make revolver like that.

 

[xsn10s]

Get whichever you shoot the best. I shot PPC with a revolver, IDPA with both, 3 gun with both, Steel Challenge, blah blah blah lol. Each will have it's pros and cons but all that matters is which you shoot better.

 

[sea2summit]

My question is how to force Ruger to make revolver like that.

At a time when most manufacturers are getting stuff out the door as fast as they can make it? Good luck.