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What are "sage rats?"
Recoil
- Thread starter Alex Wheeler
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Gophers- Praire dogs
Mike Matteson
Well-Known Member
My first M.B. was placed on a 338 Win Mag. I did the test firing of that rifle several years ago without the M.B. I manage 5 shot groups under a 1/2" at 100 yds, but it kick the hell out of me them. A few years later I was able to purchase the rifle. Later on I had M.B. placed on the rifle. What a difference it made. I don't loose the sight picture when shooting that rifle. It sold me on M.B. I will not put another rifle together without one again. On the range hearing protection at any time, in the field you really won't use it. You need to hear along with seeing to hunt so hearing protection doesn't work their and all rifles are loud.
Deputy Sheriff
Well-Known Member
Suppressors are really terrible at reducing recoil compared to a good brake. IMO if your not using the suppressor to try and not scare the game as bad buy a good brake and a really good set of electronic hearing aids/ear protectors. It saves you 12 month on the tax stamp wait and a good deal of money. I have a 20" 300wsm with a TBA Ultra 9 that weighs almost the same as my 27" carbon barreled titanium braked 300wm and I have zero chance of spotting shots despite the 10oz hanging on the business end with the 300wsm. The 300wsm uses 7.5grs less powder and shoots 250fps slower too. I can spot shots with the 300wm unless I'm in a awkward position.
Sage rat is just that...a rat..usually in cultivated fields...
Prairie dogs are larger critters..and definitely not a gopher....
Gophers(like Caddyshacks gopher) look like rockchucks....bigger targets...some sized to house cats....
Prairie dogs are larger critters..and definitely not a gopher....
Gophers(like Caddyshacks gopher) look like rockchucks....bigger targets...some sized to house cats....
I have a 338 NM with a brake on it and its great to shoot. Can spot shoots very well. When prone on bipod, the animal never leaves my sight picture. Its very important to be centered on the gun to avoid sideways movement. That's a shooting skill for sure.
After hunting with that rifle for a few years, I've noticed that having a brake on it and stalking an animal that may require a quick shot is difficult. I use the type of pear plugs that are plastic and look like barbs as they get an instant seal vs. foam ones. However, I still have to futz around with getting them in and then swinging a 12 lb gun up. I don't like it. I'm looking to get a 338 suppressor for it so i don't have to don't have to worry about destroying me ears in a situation like that. A long range gun is great in a long range situation, but hunting often requires a more close up a approach. Although as one pointed out, a set of electronic ear plugs are cheaper than a suppressor.
Pros and cons I guess.
After hunting with that rifle for a few years, I've noticed that having a brake on it and stalking an animal that may require a quick shot is difficult. I use the type of pear plugs that are plastic and look like barbs as they get an instant seal vs. foam ones. However, I still have to futz around with getting them in and then swinging a 12 lb gun up. I don't like it. I'm looking to get a 338 suppressor for it so i don't have to don't have to worry about destroying me ears in a situation like that. A long range gun is great in a long range situation, but hunting often requires a more close up a approach. Although as one pointed out, a set of electronic ear plugs are cheaper than a suppressor.
Pros and cons I guess.
antelopedundee
Well-Known Member
Without reading the whole thread is a suppressor the same thing that takes forever and a day to get BATF approval to own?
I have a 6 dasher in a 5.5 lb rifle (scope is another 18 oz) and I can spot my shoots at 100 yards without any recoil compensation. Its super sweet.
Interesting discussion thanks for kicking it off.
I've been hunting elk for 42 years, over that time I've take enough to fill up an ark and have been in on many more (up in the triple digits). So naturally I have a few thoughts. First off not all elk hunts are equal. We have true DIY on public land, guided on public land, guided on private, border bulls (where one haunts the borders or big ranches waiting for one to cross), mountain and wilderness hunts, hay field farm hunts, black timber, open big country and so on.
Point being we have a ton load different ways to go about elk hunting. I've always been a DIY on public ground kind of guy allow with some public dark timber in late November. As such, we have many ways of toting our rifles around. Being as I'm always the mule (or at least so says my wife
I'm the one carrying anything that goes up or down the mountain. As such weight is important to me!
My elk rifles need to be sub 9 lbs "all up" meaning sling, rounds, scope, bipod. I refuse to carry anymore and the most of them go without the bipod and go sub 8 "all up". Now I've found I can go too light and it won't be able to settle down when it's time to go. And anymore it's getting more and more rare for me to carry a bipod, for the ranges I go to I can get it done via laying over a pack frame just fine.
Speaking of time to go, depending on what kind of elk hunt you're doing the term time to go can and does have a lot off variances to it. That said, I've generally found I just don't have time to muck around much if at all. So, for me taking the time to put on shooting muffs/ plugs etc just isn't in the cards. That said, I refuse to use a braked rifle, my hearing isn't what it used to be but the brakes I've been around have been horrendous when it comes to shooting them without protection. Plus the one's I've been around have been bad to sitting to the side of as an observer as well. Perhaps though they like most things have gotten better with time and research.
One thing I should point out is that I'm not what one would call a true long range shooter. I practice to 700 and that's it for me. I've taken and have seen a ton load of elk taken in the 400-700 range. I want a rifle that is user friendly, makes my weight requirements and does it sub braked.
I don't worry near as much about seeing the bullet hit the critter as I do being able to hit the turf and get 3 onto a pie plate in sub 10 seconds out to 700. . If I get to hear the bullet hit the critter that's a plus. But spotting the hit generally doesn't happen. Perhaps if I was shooting at longer ranges or would work with a brake it would happen.
Now what I do like is to see the reaction to the hit, that's where certain rounds come in handy on elk. But that's different from seeing the spot where the bullet hit the elk. This also why I like the big 7's so much. They can be shot from most all positions with no fear of wearing the scope and they take down large big game like elk very well. I'm aware of the love for the RUM's on tis forum but I can't say I've ever seen one in the mountains or elk camps that I attend. I had a real thing for the 300 RUM for some time, some of the fella's I guided toted them and when I was around them at the range they were incredibly accurate. If one can handle them uffda what elk killing machines they are!
The big 30's and the big 33's are wonderful elk killing machines, but for the weight I like my elk rigs to be they just aren't in the cards anymore (I did wear out two Scheider 340 barrels on guns that weight a bit over 8).
Long and the short or this long winded post....I just want to encourage all to get in shape and hit the hills for elk no matter what you carry. We never get the time back!
I've been hunting elk for 42 years, over that time I've take enough to fill up an ark and have been in on many more (up in the triple digits). So naturally I have a few thoughts. First off not all elk hunts are equal. We have true DIY on public land, guided on public land, guided on private, border bulls (where one haunts the borders or big ranches waiting for one to cross), mountain and wilderness hunts, hay field farm hunts, black timber, open big country and so on.
Point being we have a ton load different ways to go about elk hunting. I've always been a DIY on public ground kind of guy allow with some public dark timber in late November. As such, we have many ways of toting our rifles around. Being as I'm always the mule (or at least so says my wife
I'm the one carrying anything that goes up or down the mountain. As such weight is important to me!My elk rifles need to be sub 9 lbs "all up" meaning sling, rounds, scope, bipod. I refuse to carry anymore and the most of them go without the bipod and go sub 8 "all up". Now I've found I can go too light and it won't be able to settle down when it's time to go. And anymore it's getting more and more rare for me to carry a bipod, for the ranges I go to I can get it done via laying over a pack frame just fine.
Speaking of time to go, depending on what kind of elk hunt you're doing the term time to go can and does have a lot off variances to it. That said, I've generally found I just don't have time to muck around much if at all. So, for me taking the time to put on shooting muffs/ plugs etc just isn't in the cards. That said, I refuse to use a braked rifle, my hearing isn't what it used to be but the brakes I've been around have been horrendous when it comes to shooting them without protection. Plus the one's I've been around have been bad to sitting to the side of as an observer as well. Perhaps though they like most things have gotten better with time and research.
One thing I should point out is that I'm not what one would call a true long range shooter. I practice to 700 and that's it for me. I've taken and have seen a ton load of elk taken in the 400-700 range. I want a rifle that is user friendly, makes my weight requirements and does it sub braked.
I don't worry near as much about seeing the bullet hit the critter as I do being able to hit the turf and get 3 onto a pie plate in sub 10 seconds out to 700. . If I get to hear the bullet hit the critter that's a plus. But spotting the hit generally doesn't happen. Perhaps if I was shooting at longer ranges or would work with a brake it would happen.
Now what I do like is to see the reaction to the hit, that's where certain rounds come in handy on elk. But that's different from seeing the spot where the bullet hit the elk. This also why I like the big 7's so much. They can be shot from most all positions with no fear of wearing the scope and they take down large big game like elk very well. I'm aware of the love for the RUM's on tis forum but I can't say I've ever seen one in the mountains or elk camps that I attend. I had a real thing for the 300 RUM for some time, some of the fella's I guided toted them and when I was around them at the range they were incredibly accurate. If one can handle them uffda what elk killing machines they are!
The big 30's and the big 33's are wonderful elk killing machines, but for the weight I like my elk rigs to be they just aren't in the cards anymore (I did wear out two Scheider 340 barrels on guns that weight a bit over 8).
Long and the short or this long winded post....I just want to encourage all to get in shape and hit the hills for elk no matter what you carry. We never get the time back!
DocDoc
Well-Known Member
tony d willIiams
Well-Known Member
Nice post, well thought out and written with style.
I had never considered recoil as my dad taught me if you pull it in firmly you will never be hurt. Works great until you get tired.
My 338LM has a MB. I have learned to shoot with both eyes open and I can see the target with either eye so I can pin point where the POI is. It seems that when shooting with friends the concussion gives them pause so they close their eye, or loose track of being a spotter.
I had never considered recoil as my dad taught me if you pull it in firmly you will never be hurt. Works great until you get tired.
My 338LM has a MB. I have learned to shoot with both eyes open and I can see the target with either eye so I can pin point where the POI is. It seems that when shooting with friends the concussion gives them pause so they close their eye, or loose track of being a spotter.
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
It seems like there are a lot of Democrats here. Conservatives have enough sense to use modern electronic hearing protection and stay out of the way of the blast while they are spotting. You get behind the shooter and watch.
