Recent grizzly attacks on Montana elk hunters

[bigngreen]

I'd rather have a 22lr than nothing but when making a decision up front different story.

 

[TangoOscarMike]

bear country = buddy system LOL

I would think that two guys with guns almost always ends up with a dead bear in the event of a charge. The bear can only go after one of you, the other should be free to shoot.

 

[nmbarta]

Looking at the power class of a 10mm on average your going to have to run three rounds into a bear to equal one 454 Casual in energy, it's not going to have the penetration capability either.

I don't think anyone is trying to argue that there are more powerful handguns than a 10mm, you can run about 800 ft-lbs in a 10mm with stout ammo, and close to 2000 ft-lbs with a 454 casull with stout ammo. There is no argument to be made in terms of pure killing power.....but....you have to be able hit your target. It takes way more skill to fire a handgun like that than it does a 10mm auto loader, secondly, I can probably put four or five rounds on target in the same time I can put two on target with those bigger guns.
Without tons of practice it is very difficult to accurately shoot double action revolvers using the double action trigger. I rarely see guys at the range shooting in double action, they usually cock it then shoot, so they can hit. Not saying it can't be done it's just not something most people are going to be able to do, and most don't practice near enough. Shooting more than handful of rounds out of any of the giants (500, 460,454) is more than most can handle in one sitting, so it makes it difficult to get in enough practice. I usually shoot about 150 10mm each time I take it out, not gonna happen with a casull.

There isn't a right answer here, it depends on your training and your capabilities. People tend to back up their own decision, whether to justify it, or to convince others that their decision was the "right" decision. You need a gun YOU can shoot, and afford or practice with. Close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades, you have to hit him before it matters what you hit with. Shouldn't be an reason to get offended, big wheel guns have their place, so do 50 bmg's, they just aren't for everyone. Most don't want the weight or the recoil and get acceptable results without either.

 

[MtPockets]

Didn't stay that, just pointing to the simplicity of the mechanisms!

That's why my vote is for either a large caliber revolver or a short barreled self-defense type pump shotgun. In the heat of the moment anybody would know how to operate it.

 

[West Calamus]

I'm 100% for regulated hunting but you give 2 reasons why this "leads to the same results." Absolutely nothing to do with humans encroachment and populations. "Lack of balance" seems to define humanity as I see it right now. I am having a hard time seeing your point, as eradication of any American species like the bison or the indigenous people, is one of the worst examples

I'm 100% for regulated hunting but you give 2 reasons why this "leads to the same results." Absolutely nothing to do with humans encroachment and populations. "Lack of balance" seems to define humanity as I see it right now. I am having a hard time seeing your point, as eradication of any American species like the bison or the indigenous people, is one of the worst examples of humanity and one of the most ignorant lessons of the past we can possibly learn from. Some folks say "never again" and they mean it.

Geez did not know we eradicated the Buffalo and indigenous people. Give me a break!!!

 

[Flatbow]

Bugle magazine (Sept. Oct.) Has a great story about Mark Uptian's 16 year old Daughter getting her first Elk only months after her Dad was killed by that Grizzly.
The lady (author of story) seems to be a wonderful person and a great amdasator for the future of hunting.

 

[TangoOscarMike]

Nope, he set it down with his pack and the client could not or did not know how to use it since he had no training, he simply could not pull it out and pull the trigger.

His Glock must be different than mine then. I can hand mine to someone who has no idea what to do with a gun and say, "point the end with the hole in it at your target, pull the trigger and keep pulling it until it doesn't go bang anymore" and they will have a fighting level of success LOL.

How does someone not even understand the basic principle of how a pistol works?

 

[memtb]

His Glock must be different than mine then. I can hand mine to someone who has no idea what to do with a gun and say, "point the end with the hole in it at your target, pull the trigger and keep pulling it until it doesn't go bang anymore" and they will have a fighting level of success LOL.

How does someone not even understand the basic principle of how a pistol works?

The chamber was empty...if I remember correctly! memtb

 

[Daves762]

We should band together to fight for the delisted grizzly to have a tagged, regulated hunting season. The grizzlys will learn real quick to respect and fear humans.

 

[gator378]

I don't think anyone is trying to argue that there are more powerful handguns than a 10mm, you can run about 800 ft-lbs in a 10mm with stout ammo, and close to 2000 ft-lbs with a 454 casull with stout ammo. There is no argument to be made in terms of pure killing power.....but....you have to be able hit your target. It takes way more skill to fire a handgun like that than it does a 10mm auto loader, secondly, I can probably put four or five rounds on target in the same time I can put two on target with those bigger guns.
Without tons of practice it is very difficult to accurately shoot double action revolvers using the double action trigger. I rarely see guys at the range shooting in double action, they usually cock it then shoot, so they can hit. Not saying it can't be done it's just not something most people are going to be able to do, and most don't practice near enough. Shooting more than handful of rounds out of any of the giants (500, 460,454) is more than most can handle in one sitting, so it makes it difficult to get in enough practice. I usually shoot about 150 10mm each time I take it out, not gonna happen with a casull.

There isn't a right answer here, it depends on your training and your capabilities. People tend to back up their own decision, whether to justify it, or to convince others that their decision was the "right" decision. You need a gun YOU can shoot, and afford or practice with. Close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades, you have to hit him before it matters what you hit with. Shouldn't be an reason to get offended, big wheel guns have their place, so do 50 bmg's, they just aren't for everyone. Most don't want the weight or the recoil and get acceptable results without either.

I have a 10mm for about 15 years and handload for it. I never understood how it would be for a bear round. Do you shoot the bear with it or save the last round for yourself. I like round but if it has to absolutely has be killed the 44 MAG comes out.

 

[memtb]

Quote from gator 378 "I like round but if it has to absolutely has be killed the 44 MAG comes out".


Or larger! memtb

 

[skipglo]

bear country = buddy system LOL

I would think that two guys with guns almost always ends up with a dead bear in the event of a charge. The bear can only go after one of you, the other should be free to shoot.

Probably hard to shoot accurately over your shoulder....while running away!

 

[beveridgek]

I have never been charged by a grizzly, but I have encountered them on several trips into the Yellowstone back country.
I cannot believe that some at the beginning of this thread were talking about a 9mm!!
A 10MM with hot loads is the minimum, guys, unless you want to end up bear kibble.
The only reason to use a 10MM is due to the gun, not the suitability of the round. Hopefully, circumstances will allow you to get off multiple shots.
If an angry grizzly jumps you from timber at 30-40 yards, you got 4-5 seconds...
Hope you're a lucky guy.

 

[TangoOscarMike]

Probably hard to shoot accurately over your shoulder....while running away!

LOL.

You will not outrun the bear.

You are much better off standing your ground and trying to focus on getting as many bullets into the bear as possible.

I don't remember where I read this, maybe Outdoor Life or another magazine back in the day? When an animal is charging straight in on you, your shot angle can get messed up in a hurry. You're trying to shoot down at an angle to hit them. They are moving forward at full speed. You can actually miss the animal altogether pretty easily. The article said that it was better to drop down to one knee and shoot level with the charging animal. You increased your chances of hitting them by a lot.