Re-Boring 30-06 to 35 Whelen

[sable tireur]

I did go with a 4 groins barrel,

I had a barrel rebored by JES. Maybe my standards are different than some, but I would never do it again. I wasn't expecting perfect, but the bore was really really rough. The finish on my barrel was scrapped off where a wrench or vise slipped. I started cutting it down myself trying to cut off the worst of the barrel, but there was no fixing it. The rifle now is at a barrel maker waiting to get rebarreled.

There is more to this than what we are being told, I'm sure. Especially since the member joined just to post this complaint about JES.

More attention should be placed on the discussion between the barrel owner and company doing the work and on the metal quality of the barrels being re-bored. Not all barrels and the steel they are made from lend themselves to be re-bored. Modern barrel steel (where quality has been considered) usually re-bore nicely. Even some of the older, shot out antique barrels were made from quality steel and are good candidates for re-bores. The problem is some were made from a type of steel which does not lend itself to being re-bored.

Be sure to ask your expert on re-bores about this, it is paramount to be sure you will be happy with what you receive.

There are a very few shops which can handle re-bores properly. As a result some are pretty backed up just like the rest of the industry.

 

[sable tireur]

.

 

[436]

Based on the advice I received in my other thread (thank you), I've decided to have my Howa 1500 30-06 re-bored to .35 Whelen by JES. Any advice on how I should have this done? Twist rate, etc.? I spoke briefly to Jesse a while back and it sounded like he was planning to use a slower twist rate than what some folks on here were suggesting.

Absolutely nothing wrong with the .35 Whelen or perhaps another thought might be the 9.3x62mm Mauser both would serve you well in the field. Cheers.

 

[8x68s]

Referencing twist in a "large medium" bore, I am building a 9.3x64 Brenneke. Historically a 1:12, or more typically 1:14, I have chosen 1:10... we'll see what happens!!??

 

[ORTW1]

Based on the advice I received in my other thread (thank you), I've decided to have my Howa 1500 30-06 re-bored to .35 Whelen by JES. Any advice on how I should have this done? Twist rate, etc.? I spoke briefly to Jesse a while back and it sounded like he was planning to use a slower twist rate than what some folks on here were suggesting.

I have some experience with building the 35. My suggestion is to chamber it to Improved. Reason being the shoulder not improved and it being so short tends to push its way into the neck causing misfires. The improved remedy's this. I actually went with the 338-06 and found it to be faster with better accuracy. Just a thought.

 

[MoreSalsa]

You would inly need 12 twist for silly-heavy bullets, like 300 and up. The 35 isnt optimal at these weights. That said, my rem is 16 twist and shoots 310 cast ok; they are stable.

I don't think I'll be shooting bullets that heavy. I'm not an expert on 35 Whelen loads but I've been looking for a while and have not seen any bullets that I would use that are that heavy. If 1 in 14'' is going to give me the best chance of shooting the commonly available factory ammo good enough for deer at 300 yards and will also stabilize 225 or 250 grain bullets, that is probably what I want. It looks like Core Lokts (maybe the newer tipped Core Lokts going forward) are by far the most available factory ammo in 35 Whelen and the fancier stuff seems to be very hard to come by (and very expensive). So the best outcome is probably that I get the barrel back, it shoots Core Lokts accurately enough for deer hunting and I stock up on that and call it a day.

 

[coueskiller43]

I have a 358 rebore done by JES. It is lights out accurate. Rivals my high end customs to the point you question everything. I wouldn't hesitate to do it. I bet you will be happy. As far as twist I'd go with whatever JES recommends since you don't shoot copper.

 

[JakeC]

I've done a fair bit of reviewing of threads on the matter and the re-boring idea seems like something that a lot of folks are wary of in theory but the folks who actually do it tend to report very good results ... at least when they use JES.

JakeC, you know you made me think of something I hadn't thought of. There is an old M1917 in the family. It's a sporterized version with a chopped down barrel (guessing 20'') and shoots not well. I have assumed that the bore is in rough shape, perhaps among other things. I used it attempting to hunt as a youth and hated its sights and lack of accuracy, so I never really gave it much thought. But you have me wondering if a re-bore could transform it into an accurate rifle. My money is no, as I'm guessing there are issues beyond the bore and I know that there are a lot of M1917s with QA issues, but I'd love to hear any thoughts you have if you know about those fugly rifles.

I don't think it's necessarily the gun system, though there could be bad ones. The one I hunted with, also chopped to 20 or so, was fantastically accurate despite the condition of the barrel. I happened to really like mine and I loved the sigts personally. But yours could be moving in the stock, have a loose bore or sights, ragged muzzle, who knows. The stocks are 100 percent immune to cheek weld and they're really difficult to put optics on but the actions are notoriously strong and they are often highly accurate. Back in the day they were really popular to turn into dangerous game rifles and wildcats and whelens because they were so overbuilt. But they have quirks like square threads that make them a pain to work on for today's smiths. Basically it's okay to not be a fan, and they're ex wife ugly, but the quirks wind up making fans like me. Iraqveteran8888 has a bunch of videos where they take an original GI condition one amd shoot it at 600y. They're cackling the whole time because it's stupidly accurate. Not to say they all are. Now that I live in a western state most of the ones I see have been scoped so that's one big issue solved. I don't think I'll do anything to my grandfather's moose poaching stick but when I see someone dumping one for short money I start carving a modern stock in my head and thinking about blowing the pipe out to .358.

But again, it's okay to not be a fan.

Edit: that's a long way of saying I do bet a rebore, if the metal is amenable, would solve your accuracy. The qc was pretty good. And I think someone is making stocks, boyds maybe. Anyway it's a solid chance at turning trash into fun.

 

[JakeC]

This is a chicken or egg issue for me since I will be using factory ammo and the round I use will be dictated by which round(s) the re-bored rifle likes. The bad news is that there are not many factory options. The good news is that accuracy out of the gun is really the only consideration that will matter, as I'm not using it in a lead free zone and I'm not too concerned about terminal ballistics when it's drilling a .35 caliber hole. So, as long as it shoots good enough for 300 yard deer hunting, I'll be good to go.

Based on that, I would say that I'd like versatility in the rounds I can use ... if for nothing else than upping my chances of finding a factory round that will shoot well in the rifle. I have picked up some 200 and 250 grain Core Locts and might be picking up some Federal Fusion 200 grains. The Nosler ammo with 225 grain AccuBonds would be a great round for anything I'd ever hunt with the rifle if I can ever get a hold of any.

I hope the lighter bullets shoot well since they are plenty large for what I'll use them for and fly flatter with less recoil. But if the heavier bullets shoot better, I'll go with them.

If I can't find a factory load that shoots okay, I'll probably send it in to a place for customized ammo to be made, since I don't currently hand load. Sounds like some heavy Hammer bullets would be an option in that case. But I'd be tickled pink if I find a factory round that shoots good enough for the intended purpose.

So, not sure if that means I should go with a fast twist rate or what ...

If you can get ahold of kiwinate on here, that's Nathan Foster and he's an enormous fan of the Whelen, he and his wife. I could plagiarize his book but he works super hard on his research so I'll leave it to you to ask him. Super thoughtful and friendly to chat with, he'd probably love to hear about a whelen being born. He doesn't check in here often anymore but it's worth a try. Actually some of the advice regarding twist rate and bullets might be available on his website, ballisticstudies.com.

Edit: the whelen isn't actually in his book to copy if I wanted to. Here's the link, and I'd still advise reaching out to him. https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.35+Whelen.html

 

[MoreSalsa]

I have a 358 rebore done by JES. It is lights out accurate. Rivals my high end customs to the point you question everything. I wouldn't hesitate to do it. I bet you will be happy. As far as twist I'd go with whatever JES recommends since you don't shoot copper.

To be clear I don't need to shoot copper in this rifle, but I also have nothing against copper. I need to post some pics of the last two bullets I sent down a bore, my 6.5 CR. They were Nosler E-Tips. They look like something out of an ad, after going through the boiler room of a 185 pound boar at 205 yards. I wouldn't hesitate to use them again on any deer, antelope, or reasonably-sized hog, other than at longer ranges ... let's say 250 to 400 yards ... I'd have reservations about the expansion I'd get. But with a .35 caliber bullet on deer, I don't think expansion is all that necessary.

 

[Alibiiv]

I'd listen to JES. Jesse knows his stuff. 14 twist is great. My factory CVA scout is a 14 twist and it shoots everything I've put through it. You're gonna find all the advice on this forum is going to be fast twist for heavies or mono bullets for "long range" … after all, this is a long range forum. However, 35 Whelen isn't a long range round. 14 twist is what all the factory ammo you're going to find is optimized for.

I have three rebores that I had Jesse do. All three rifles started out as Ruger 77s in 30-06, and they were rebored to 35 Whelens, and...they all shoot. It old Jesse that I intended to shoot 225 grain bullets and what twist would be up to him and these rifles are 1:14 twist and they do shoot well; MOA all day and they are not fussy. I did choose a 4 groove barrel for the rebores, I "think" he also offers a 3 groove barrel as well???

 

[Alibiiv]

There is more to this than what we are being told, I'm sure. Especially since the member joined just to post this complaint about JES.

More attention should be placed on the discussion between the barrel owner and company doing the work and on the metal quality of the barrels being re-bored. Not all barrels and the steel they are made from lend themselves to be re-bored. Modern barrel steel (where quality has been considered) usually re-bore nicely. Even some of the older, shot out antique barrels were made from quality steel and are good candidates for re-bores. The problem is some were made from a type of steel which does not lend itself to being re-bored.

Be sure to ask your expert on re-bores about this, it is paramount to be sure you will be happy with what you receive.

There are a very few shops which can handle re-bores properly. As a result some are pretty backed up just like the rest of the industry.

"I did go with a 4 groins barrel," I had to laugh at this one!!!! This is what tapping on a iPhone and spell check did for me when this happened!!! I was going to type that I will have to teach my iPhone the difference between "groin" and "groove" ; however find that I'm probably going to get myself in deeper!!!

 

[sable tireur]

Yep, deeper in technology can bring about somewhat awful consequences sometimes... It was worth a great giggle!

 

[JustAnOldCooter]

This is just food for thought. My dad was a Tool and Die Maker his whole life, and did Internal Thread Milling work , where working down to .00001 was important on many jobs. He taught me long ago when you cut, or mill , or reshape steel, it moves. If I under stand your plan , you are considering reboring the barrel, then re cutting the Land and Grooves , back into the barrel. If I got it wrong I apologize. I would suggest you go get a new barrel, chambered for the cartridge you want, with the Chamber Dimensions you want ,in the twist you want. Just my Humble opinion. Again, If I misunderstood the project, I am Sorry

Agree - McGowan custom barrel lead times (12 weeks for full custom to your request) are pretty darn short all things considered, and my local Smith says McGowan's are fantastic barrels, when waiting for a "premium" barrel is out of the question. https://mcgowenbarrel.com/shop/full-custom-barrel/