My .35 Whelen Re-Bore Project

[TRexF16]

Well I would certainly make getting a new barrel the LAST thing you try. Seems to me your rebore was kind of the whole project, and I'd try all the other things before abandoning that goal.
The bedding and free float is something you can do yourself. If you don't feel confident spend some time watching instructions online - it's not too hard. A nice trigger can make a huge difference too.

Best of luck with it,
Rex

 

[JakeC]

Great to hear a thorough rundown. I agree with Rex, don't let the fouling scare you. If it was a target rifle that would be frustrating for reasons I'll detail in a minute, but if you're not trying to shoot 50 rounds in a sitting there's nothing inherently wrong with a rough barrel. I don't know anyone who would sit down and shoot 50 35 Whelen rounds but you never know. It's going to be fine, enjoy doing the other parts of the build. Rough and damaged are not the same thing.

I had a Savage barrel I considered to be very heavy fouling. It shot great when it was in equilibrium but it took lots of shots to build the barrel back up after I stripped it and then I only had about 50-70 before the copper would start causing pressure or inaccuracy. I could put a pot roast on, go to the basement and start swabbing and I'd still be getting blue when dinner was ready. So I eventually just decided that I wasn't going to take all the copper out since I was wasting shots to put it back. Unless the barrel is polished it's going to need some copper laid in to function correctly.

I don't think the fouling is going to interfere with break in necessarily, except that you could hypothetically run into pressure spikes before things smooth out. Pressure spikes can result in bad bolt lift, but I doubt that the hard bolt was from too much copper buildup and pressure (it is possible, I've experienced it.) Probably just new barrel dynamics with the variation that comes with factory ammo. It could literally have been some micro-crud from the smithing. WHat I'd see when I got to too much copper was a sudden shift in point of impact or drastic increase in the severity of fliers. Then some general crankiness in the breech. At any rate, whatever system you use, what break in is really doing is knocking down imperfections using heat and pressure. The imperfections in the throat have a big effect on the copper in the entire barrel, according to people I trust. As that area gets tamed the rest of the barrel gets down closer to building up whatever copper is deposited there physically, with less vaporized copper from a rough throat being available to deposit as condensation. Or so I understand it. Essentially it'll get better.

So, having said all that about it not really mattering I personally would 100% do a DIY lap of some sort. You're going to have this thing a while, might as well not worry about it. I know there's a lot of guys out there who clutch their pearls and pass out at the idea of abrasives but bore treatment has attracted more myths and false rumors than a middle school prom. Like the guy who sings louder at church to prove how great he is, a lot of people just repeat sanctimonious garbage to sound knowledgeable. Tubb's fire lapping kits are a fantastic idea, I bet you could find another whelen fan on here to load a kit up for you if you sent him the kit and your empties. Another method I got from knowledgeable people on both sides of the world is to physically scrub the barrel with fine scotch pads. It needs to be done systematically, and you don't want to leave the end of the barrel, but it's not hard. You take a pad, cut a thin strip, cut that in half, and stretch it over a brush. That's basically it. I have not shot a barrel I did this to but I've tested the method on a takeoff and I would absolutely do it if I needed to, or I will when the throat on my current barrels need to have crackling cleaned up. Even if you only did the first six inches for 20 strokes, then the first three inches for 20 I bet you'd cut the copper deposits by a lot. My buddy who used to compete at a grand actually went so far as to do this to a new (fully lapped) barrel: get a hardwood dowel sanded to the size of your bore, hammer the dowel with green or red rouge paste, chuck the dowel in a drill and use it to wear down/polish out the throat. He'd literally ruin his lands (or actually extend them a thousandfold) to get longer life and less fouling. I'm not recommending that, it's just an example to illustrate that there's a lot you can do and that it's a lot harder to ruin barrels than people say it is. Within reason. I mean, keep out of the crown and don't bend the thing or rust it, for hunting and fun out to 300 you should be good. It's not a custom reamed carbon bartlein you need for sheep at 700y right?

Anyway, it's jsut a thought, it sounds like the fouling is chapping you a fair bit and that's understandable. If you don't want to sand the barrel that's understandable too. I appreciate the write up/review. Like I said before I've got some antique rifles that could really benefit from this and it's nice to know it's an option.

 

[6017mag]

Based on feedback from my posts this summer (https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/best-path-to-an-accurate-35-whelen.303548/ and https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/re-boring-30-06-to-35-whelen.305900/) (thank you everyone), I set out to have my old Howa 1500 30-06 re-bored by JES to .35 Whelen. The desire for the Whelen arose from hunting caliber requirements where I am going to hunt deer.

Some of the posters in that thread wanted to hear how it turned out, so I thought I'd share, and also hear any thoughts anyone would like to offer. Not out of the woods yet, but had my first day at the range today.

I had Jesse do his typical re-bore, which I believe is a 1:14'' twist. I explained that I am not a hand loader and therefore wanted to go with whatever would give me the best chance at shooting most ammo okay (and I'm not planning on shooting any exceptionally heavy bullets out of it that would require the faster twist rates). The goal was to be able to reliably shoot deer out to 300 yards.

After I bolted the barreled action back into the stock and got the scope on (levelling the rifle was a pain with basically no useable flat surface on the gun), I gave it a good clean as part of a barrel break-in process, using mostly the same equipment I used with my 30-06 (same jag, rod, and bore guide, but I used a .357 pistol brush). I wasn't sure if Jesse had test fired it but looked like he had as a LOT of blue/green came out. I was surprised at how much.

Took it to the 100 yard range today and started with the heavier of the two factory ammo loads that I have (250 grain Core Lokt - I also have 200 grain), with the idea that these would be slower and not dump as much fouling in the barrel. I put three down the pipe and then cleaned again. Extremely dirty (both carbon and copper that did not seem to want to go away). I gave it a good cleaning but with there still being green when I stopped.

By this time I had the scope pretty well sighted in, with my third almost exactly where I wanted it (1.5'' high at 100y).

Shot two more three-shot groups, a bit rushed since I wanted to get as far along in the barrel break-in as possible and didn't have the full day. First one was 2 3/8'' mostly do to a flier. Second was a bit under 1.5'' with two touching.

Did a quick cleaning and only had time for two more shots ... hit right next to each other, a little more than half an inch.

Only other thing to note is that one round stuck in the chamber pretty well. Had to use some elbow grease to open the bolt. Other than that no issues. If that raises any alarm bells, please let me know.

Recoil is definitely more than the 6.5 Creedmoor I have been shooting of late, and I certainly noticed it when I had forgotten to put the limbsaver back on the stock for the first two shots. But if I situate the butt well on my body it doesn't punch too hard.

Anyway, so far happy with the accuracy from the old Core Lokt ammo. I haven't tried the 200 grain rounds yet but hoping they are as accurate, as I prefer their ballistics and maybe they will recoil less.

I am a bit miffed by how dirty the bore gets ... and stays. It is so dirty that I wonder whether barrel break in is going to do much. The green is so persistent that I'm going to try to check to make sure there is no copper in the jag or brush. I thought they were both aluminum, and they look like aluminum. I also wonder if the use of a .30 caliber rod and jag might play into it ... not scrubbing the copper as well as a caliber-correct rod and jag? Maybe it's something that I should not worry about. Anyone have any thoughts there?

I just had a Browning BAR .30-06 bored out by JES Reboring, I am getting pretty good accuracy as well, with most factory ammo that I've tried. Also it gets dirty really quick going through lots of KG12 keeping it clean, I hope it slicks off and starts fouling less

 

[Monteria]

My JES rebore also coppered up, but no more than most factory barrels. It is more accurate than most factory barrels though, and fouling got better with time.

 

[Frank in the Laurels]

...seems like an awful lot of everything for very little if any rewards... a 180-200 bullet in that old fashion 30/06 can't be much less than the same in the .35 whalen...unless you just needed a new project.

 

[VinceMule]

Well, we have not heard from the OP in over a year. I am with you, Frank.

 

[Monteria]

Well, we have not heard from the OP in over a year. I am with you, Frank.

Missed that.

 

[Leaf Litter]

...seems like an awful lot of everything for very little if any rewards... a 180-200 bullet in that old fashion 30/06 can't be much less than the same in the .35 whalen...unless you just needed a new project.

OP lives in a state that mandates 35 cal or larger for rifles. His 30-06 would, clearly, not satisfy that requirement.

So the reward is actually quite significant

 

[6017mag]

...seems like an awful lot of everything for very little if any rewards... a 180-200 bullet in that old fashion 30/06 can't be much less than the same in the .35 whalen...unless you just needed a new project.

I can't speak for everyone else's rifles but 200 grain factory loads in my re-bore are pushing just a mite over 2800 fps, about the same speed as 165 grain .30-06's before the rebore