Opinions wanted......

[Fiftydriver]

Freebore,

Yep thats the class of performance I want, just have alot of 223 cases so I prefer the 6-223. Both are nearly identical in performance.

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[Fiftydriver]

Jumpalot,

Yep, they are pretty much the same exact thing for all practical purposes.

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[Fiftydriver]

Catshooter,

Please do not tell me you feel that it is impossible to make a 55 gr 6mm bullet with a higher BC then a 55 gr 22 cal bullet???

Simple Physics 101 tells you that a bullets length and ogive and boattail have MUCH More to do with BC then actual bullet weight.

There are many ways to build a larger caliber bullet that is longer then a smaller one and still weigh the same to allow a higher BC for the larger diameter same weight bullet.

Ever wonder why a 105 gr A-Max has a higher BC then a 105 gr Speer SP flat base.

Think outside the box my friend. All things in bullets and ballistics are not as rigid and fixed as you make them out to be, have a little imagination and some fun!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Every set of published BC are to some degree pretty optomistic. Sierras are about the closest I have seen but even they are dependant on the situations they are used in.

If I remember correctly, the 22-250 was used with great success as a BR round and even set many records for its time as a wildcat. Do you see it much on the BR line anymore??? Does that make it an obsolete design? hardly.

I am not BR shooting, I could care less what the latest fad is on the BR line. Your numbers are not right for what is possible with modern rifles, bullets and powders. Need to catch up and see whats possible today, the 6-223 will smoke a 223 in every aspect with the new modern lightweight, good BC bullets in that caliber.

Again, not wanting to flame things here but your comments are not correct in any way.

Kirby Allen(50)
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[Fiftydriver]

Coyboy,

I agree it would be great performance but I want more pop on target then what a 69 gr match bullet would offer, no red mist if you will. The 60 gr V-Max is pretty heavy for the 222 Rem.

3600 fps may not be practical but I know 3530 fps is as I have tested rifles to this level with this class round in 27" length Lilja barrels.

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[Fiftydriver]

BillR and Buffalobob,

The 223 Rem is a great round, I have several of them and use them alot. Still, I feel the 6mm bore on that case offers enough advantage to make it a more viable choice. I will roll all my own, no factory loads so that is not a concern to me.

Thanks for the replies.

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[Tom Brush]

Many years ago I shot benchrest with a 6 X 47 with 70 gr. bulets. This is the .222 Magnum necked up to 6mm. I won several IBS matches with this rifle. It would agg. in the .150's in perfect conditions with Detsch benchrest bullets. We shot fairly hot loads then from a 20" barrel. I believe that velocity was around 2950 fps. Brass was made by running .222 Mag. brass thru a 6 X 47 die. Very easy to make. The longest match range shot was 300 yds. You should easily be able to get 400 yds. from the 6 X 45. It will hold its own in the wind too. I won a 200 yd. event in wind that was so strong you could not rely on any wind flags. I used the large American flag over the clubhouse to determine the speed of the gusts. My 6 X 47 could run with the best of the PPC's. Jim Stekyl from Remington R & D shot next to me at the Nationals one year. He had the only 6 X 45 I had ever seen. The point I am trying to make is that the 6 X 45 would make an excellent, accurate and cheap to shoot 400 yd. varmint gun.

 

[Fiftydriver]

UncleB,

I have looked at the numbers for the 65 gr V-Max and they look very impressive. Should be able to be drive to the same velocities as a 22 cal 55 gr tipped bullet. May be a better choice yet. I have not looked at the 70 gr bullets, did not want to go that heavy in bullet weight to be honest but the 70 gr Ballistic TIp may be a good choice.

If I get that reamer I will let you know!! I love XPs!!

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[Fiftydriver]

Don't need something quite as big as the 244 Rem(6mm Rem)!!! For deer hunting though that would be hard to beat!!

Kirby Allen(50)

 

[MachV]

My first thought was 221 Fireball but you have the 218 bee.#2 thought was 17MachIV but you dont want to mess with the forming.
6-223 BTDT didnt gain enough to mess with the extra cost of bullets and reamer.Put that 55NOS in a 243 and you got a red mist machine!!!but it heats up fast and is a little hard on barrels.
If it where me and I am by the way the TAC20 shootin the 39Blitz is quit a little round if you have to have something different than the plain old 223.
There must be a good reason there are 5 223s in the gun cabnet..................Ya I remember it just plain works /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif Thier cheap to shoot and last a looong time. Get a couple of them and swap out when one gets hot.Better yet build yourself a heatsink-barrel block and keep it out of the sun and you can shoot it all day without getting hot!
Your one of them rich smiths fer christ sakes shoot what you want and rebarrel as nessisary /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[CatShooter]

[ QUOTE ]
Sounds like you are resurrecting the old Remington 224 with the 12 twist for your hankerin. Just so happens I have one, and guess what, it's got a $ on it like everything else I have. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Later Tim

[/ QUOTE ]

No need to resurrect the .244, it never died - it has been called the 6mm Rem for about 40 years.

The 6mm/223 is about 1/2 the cartridge.

.

 

[CatShooter]

[ QUOTE ]
Catshooter,

Please do not tell me you feel that it is impossible to make a 55 gr 6mm bullet with a higher BC then a 55 gr 22 cal bullet???

[/ QUOTE ]

I NEVERsaid that! I said that the same bullets, the Nosler .224-55gr and the 6mm-55gr, which are the SAME plain vanilla design... the longer thiner one will ahve a higher BC than the shorter-fater one.

I did NOT say that a better design CAN'T be done. The 308-155 Scenar is actually longer than the .308-190SMK, and has a BC that is equal to the 190... but the design is radical... the design of the Noslers is hum-drum plain vannila.

[ QUOTE ]
Simple Physics 101 tells you that a bullets length and ogive and boattail have MUCH More to do with BC then actual bullet weight.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not if both bullets are of the same design, which the noslers are.

[ QUOTE ]
There are many ways to build a larger caliber bullet that is longer then a smaller one and still weigh the same to allow a higher BC for the larger diameter same weight bullet.

Ever wonder why a 105 gr A-Max has a higher BC then a 105 gr Speer SP flat base.

[/ QUOTE ]

HA!... **** desperate try to win a "no-win" argument. The two Noslers are the same desigh - one is NOT a flat base - if you spend time wondering why the 105 A-Max has a higher BC than the 105 Speer, then I have some books I can recomend to you.

[ QUOTE ]
Think outside the box my friend. All things in bullets and ballistics are not as rigid and fixed as you make them out to be, have a little imagination and some fun!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

"Outside the box"... that is a over worn expression if there ever was one. If you want to debate something, you should NOT change the frame of the discussion to suite your position... this was aboput the BC of the Nosler .224-55 vs the 6mm-55 - not expermental bullets, or flat bassed bullets compared to VLD designs. A very lame effort at winning a poor argument with an apples and oranges approach.


[ QUOTE ]
If I remember correctly, the 22-250 was used with great success as a BR round and even set many records for its time as a wildcat. Do you see it much on the BR line anymore??? Does that make it an obsolete design? hardly.

[/ QUOTE ]

And the revelence to this BC discussion is... WHAT???

[ QUOTE ]
Your numbers are not right for what is possible with modern rifles, bullets and powders. Need to catch up and see whats possible today, the 6-223 will smoke a 223 in every aspect with the new modern lightweight, good BC bullets in that caliber.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not hardly - there is no magic about the 6mm bore size. a case with a 28 grain capacity can only generate so much energy - and your comment about "modern powders" is bogus - the powders used for this calss of cartridges have been around a long time... 748, 4895, Benchmark, ... nothing "radical" about these powders.

[ QUOTE ]
Again, not wanting to flame things here but your comments are not correct in any way.

[/ QUOTE ]

You were working hard to flame, but I think you fizzled out - no worries mate - you wanna build a 6mm-223, be my guest. But if you think you are going to get 3600 out of it with a Nosler 55 (or anyone elses 55) then you better pull the trigger very hard.

.

 

[biff's reloading]

a good used savage 110 in 243win would be my purchase! i use 10x in it and it works great for the 55's with low charges. you could burn up 3 243's for the $$ u might put into a custom gun, and 400 yards is peanuts for the 110 i used to shoot. and cheap. and easy to fiddle with.

or the 6-223 would be cool too. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif i dont think you will be able to beat the availability of brass for it. if i had my own rifle shop, and tons o dough, maybe thats the way id go too...... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[srhaggerty]

Kirby,

I remember a conversation just like this the other day.

Sean

 

[specweldtom]

I would build a 24" heavy stainless barrel AR flattop, in .223 rem, probably with a 9" twist Krieger barrel and work up a 40 to 55 grain load. The rifle will like something well enough to shoot at least 1/2 moa, will be great fun, no recoil, and a real challenge to build and tune. AR based NRA match rifles are achieving incredible accuracy with magazine length ammo and iron sights. That technology should be applicable to rifles designed for lighter bullets. I don't know how well the NRA service rifles shoot, but they must be pretty good; a lot of service rifle shooters gave up sub moa M1A's for them. Point being they are also shooting magazine length ammo with iron sights, which is a lot of fun and a challenge to boot.

I don't care for the AR's as much as it sounds like, but they are capable of fine accuracy, reliability, and might cause trouble in dogtown.

Have fun, Tom