Oh my surely not

[BrentM]

Nah, I'm not against the Creedmoor at all. It's going to be my next rifle purchase in fact. True, I'm still pretty new at everything, but numbers don't generally lie. I guess all I want to hear is objectivity, maybe a little humor, and some good stories; that's what Ron gives me.

Numbers? Totally depends on what you want the numbers to tell you. People get hung up on all sorts of things and don't understand ballistics at all. Internal, external, and terminal ballistics are often ignored by people who want to promote one caliber or cartridge over another. For example they quote crap like knock down power. There is no such measurement on the planet that monitors that but people go this route all the time. People will also say a target bullet is not a hunting bullet..... In the end guys like Spomer will bag on the creed and compare it to a entirely different cartridge. 6.5 creedmoor vs a 270 win for example. To the average person walking up to a counter at cabelas this is a real debate. That person is likely buying factory ammo, a 3x10 scope, and hunting inside of 300. They don't even know what ballistics means, don't know what BC means, never heard of sectional density, and will likely sight their rifle in at 100 using a lead sled. In the end the decision to make the purchase was based off of what?

If you like the guy, good on you, but I don't think less of you for it. If I don't like the guy, I'd personally like the same from you. That is why I responded.

 

[ButterBean]

Agreed. This article isn't a debate on which cartridge you can shoot better though. It's a "what can this cartridge do that others can't" article. When you take the shooter out of the equation, numbers serve a pretty good indicator of overall cartridge performance.

All I'm gonna say is I see a lot of "World Class" Needmoor shooters on here that don't have a name in a record book anywhere and IMO taking the shooter out of the equation is useless

 

[ButterBean]

Numbers? Totally depends on what you want the numbers to tell you. People get hung up on all sorts of things and don't understand ballistics at all. Internal, external, and terminal ballistics are often ignored by people who want to promote one caliber or cartridge over another. For example they quote crap like knock down power. There is no such measurement on the planet that monitors that but people go this route all the time. People will also say a target bullet is not a hunting bullet..... In the end guys like Spomer will bag on the creed and compare it to a entirely different cartridge. 6.5 creedmoor vs a 270 win for example. To the average person walking up to a counter at cabelas this is a real debate. That person is likely buying factory ammo, a 3x10 scope, and hunting inside of 300. They don't even know what ballistics means, don't know what BC means, never heard of sectional density, and will likely sight their rifle in at 100 using a lead sled. In the end the decision to make the purchase was based off of what?

If you like the guy, good on you, but I don't think less of you for it. If I don't like the guy, I'd personally like the same from you. That is why I responded.

X-2

 

[ntsqd]

Data, if shown to have been scientifically gathered I'll go with, but the only Statistics that I believe are those that I made up myself.

Built myself a 6.5 CM upper, never shot it. Not likely ever going to and am going to sell it to fund a .243AI bolt build.

 

[1Mtnman]

X3

 

[Radman]

My 54 Sharps is all I need, everything else is new fangled high-tech garbage.
Smokeless powder is a fad.
Real men use 30-30s with buckhorns.
30-40 Krag is fine, we don't need the Kaiser's Mauser or the Swede's 6.5.
The 270 is for women who can't handle the 30-06.
The 308 only exists because America can't produce real men who can handle the 30-06 like their Nazi-punching dads.
All these scopes are a fad, they're just a crutch for poor shooters.
The 223 kills with hydrostatic shock, if you hit something in the foot its brain explodes.
Only cartridges at least 100 years old matter.
Everything new makes me mad.


Covered it? Good to go. Curmudgeons be curmudgeons in every decade.

You nailed it!
If a bear gets shot in the woods.....oh, never mind!

 

[ButterBean]

Data, if shown to have been scientifically gathered I'll go with, but the only Statistics that I believe are those that I made up myself.

Built myself a 6.5 CM upper, never shot it. Not likely ever going to and am going to sell it to fund a .243AI bolt build.

Good Move IMPO

 

[Mach1Morgan]

the 6.5 PRC was what the Creed should have been...the 270 does what the other 2 do just as well with better availability.

This is the most intelligent thing said in this entire post!

 

[tomsd]

My 54 Sharps is all I need, everything else is new fangled high-tech garbage.
Smokeless powder is a fad.
Real men use 30-30s with buckhorns.
30-40 Krag is fine, we don't need the Kaiser's Mauser or the Swede's 6.5.
The 270 is for women who can't handle the 30-06.
The 308 only exists because America can't produce real men who can handle the 30-06 like their Nazi-punching dads.
All these scopes are a fad, they're just a crutch for poor shooters.
The 223 kills with hydrostatic shock, if you hit something in the foot its brain explodes.
Only cartridges at least 100 years old matter.
Everything new makes me mad.


Covered it? Good to go. Curmudgeons be curmudgeons in every decade.

LOL - if one had young eyes again - maybe. Only had a fixed 4x Weaver on the .32 Winchester Special - Model 94 - and it worked fine. I do like "smokeless" shells tho - but once in a while - seeing a cloud of gunpowder is purty. Hey - the Kaiser's Mauser begat our revered 30.06.

 

[tomsd]

I go back abs forth between old and boring and née and fancy. It mostly depends on the ho I'm reading. If someone says the 6.5 is the be all end all, I spend the next month with the 30-06. If someone says the 6.5 is a worthless fad, I spend time with the 6.5s.

I just like to be contrary . So it'll be a lot of 30-06 this week.

Hard to go wrong with all the choices for old .06.

 

[Lenny Foffa]

Thank you for making me laugh!!! After the last 48 hours of Fox news I thought I would never laugh again. Wait,....... I shoot a 270..Damm

 

[ButterBean]

This is the most intelligent thing said in this entire post!

"the 6.5 PRC was what the Creed should have been...the 270 does what the other 2 do just as well with better availability."

I agree

 

[Equalizer]

Old cartridges don't sell new rifles.
Mic drop

 

[warboar21]

Had I not bought my CZ 550 in 6.5x55 I may have bought a Creed. The Swede on a modern action is a great cartridge and is right there with the 260, Creed, and 6x47.
with the 20.5" barrel on my rifle I get approximately the velocity as my friends creed shooting the eldx. His rifle is a little more accurate though. His barrel is fully floated while mine sits in a Manlicher style stock. I can shoot slightly under an inch while he can consistently shoot half in groups.
I have no ill towards the caliber. It's the people who believe it's the end all be all caliber that make me scratch my head. Same for those who believe you need to have something with Magnum behind its name in order to shoot an animal that weighs 150-300 pounds.