New to reloading- help me spend some money!

[youngbuck]

Lots of good advice here. There are all kinds of reloading tools that are better at certain things than others. The old presses, balance beam scales, and manual powder throwers have been around for a long time. They still work very well. If I was in your shoes I would look at an entire used kit, only if it is in good shape though, or buy a new standard kit; including the equipment they have been making the same for years. It wont cost you an arm and a leg. After you spend some time with it you will see what you would like to do "more with" I started by draggin all my dad's old equipment out of boxes from the 80's or early 90s. It has served me well since I did that. I load for about 3 different cartridges regularly. I spend a lot of time setting up/swapping dies. For me I think a Redding T-7 press would be nice to use. I've never used one and am reading up on reports about them and researching other options. Untill I decide, if I ever do change, the old RCBS rockchucker press that's over 20 years old works really well. You could spend all kinds of money on new fancy equipment, but there is a lot to learn about reloading. I don't think any fancy powder thrower or progressive would shorten the learning curve any. All the advise about reading is great advice. I was advised to buy a couple different loading manuals to read up on before I started. I learned more reading 3 books then I had talking to my dad or reading on the internet. there is all kinds of info on the net, but a wealth of knowledge in reloading manuals. I'm certainly no expert in reloading, but I try and learn as much as I can. I'm going to pick up the book mentioned earlier in the thread.

 

[kc0pph]

When It comes to a concesus about something there are only two that will ever be associated with reloading and shooting in general.

1) Everyone else is always wrong, and your always right
2) Reading and research are your best friends.

Well there is that other one that most of us like to follow but then again how many accidents can be solved by wearing a little bit of protection.

3) safety

 

[Fitch]

Best advice i can give you, is dont go for the Lee kitchen top presses or the one where you use a hammer with the dies. (Heard about some lee loading dies that do not use a press, a sturdy block of wood and a hammer is all you need).

Step 1 of any person getting involved with Reloading.
Buy Sierra Manual
Buy Lyman Manual
Buy Hornaday Manual
Buy Speer Manual
Buy Nosler Manual

Step 2:
Read the first few and last few chapters of all of the books. Ignore the reloading data for now.

Step 3: Open all books up to caliber you want at the same time and compare bullets and powders and primers and cases.....

You should know exactly what you are going to load (each cartdrige) before you buy your press. You should also know the whole reloading story in detail before you buy any equiptment. These books are great, but each one gives a little different story.

Oh yeah! That's excellent advice. I bought a Speer #13 manual first, and studied the first 125 pages like there was going to be a test. Trust me on this, there is a "test" every time you pull the trigger on ammo you reloaded.

The Precision Reloading book is awesome, definitely get it, and read it, before making major purchases, but you will do better with it after studying the first 125 pages of the Speer manual to get a rough overall framework of the reloading process on which to hang the much more detailed information from that totally excellent book.

OK, my answer to the OP's original question:

Press:

You are talking about low volume reloading of big cases which are exactly the ammo that gives the quickest payback on the reloading investment (both in money saved and improved accuracy). The issues with those cartridges that control what press is used are resizing effort for that big brass, and ease of getting it into and out of the press. While any of the cast iron O-frame presses will work, they will be tight on size for the big cases. I don't own them, but I've used both the Forester Co-Ax and the Redding UltraMag and especially on big brass they are just plain awesome. Especially the UltraMag. I like the design of the UltraMag better, but that's just a personal preference. I use a Redding Boss for my rifles where the biggest cartridges are .30-06 Spr. and 7mm Rem. Mag. If I were going to load anything bigger (longer), I'd get an UltraMag.

Priming:

I've primed thousands of rounds using the priming tool built into my Redding Boss press. Some folks like a seperate tool. Either way works.

Powder Measurement:

You won't be doing volume reloading so I'd get a good trickler (heavy is better than light), good balance beam scale (they are pretty much all made by Ohaus and relabeled for the varius companies - I use a Ohaus 10-10 which is now sold as an RCBS 10-10 but there are other good ones out there - a good balance beam is as reliable as gravity), and a set of Lee powder scoops. Use the scoop(s) to get close, trickel to exact weight. Setting up a powder dispenser takes longer than the time it will save for low volume reloading, and you will want to weigh each charge anyway.

Other equipment I recommend because it works well for me:

6" digital caliper
Wilson case trimmer
RCBS CaseMaster

TruTool cartridge runout straightening tool (to correct eccentricity issues identified with the CaseMaster. TT-Equipment-Index

Dillon CV-750 tumbler (I wore out a Cabela's tumbler in 4 years)
Double ended hand held Case deburring tools (one regular, one tapered for VLD bullets)
Sinclair flash hole deburring tool
Dry mica neck lubricator
Redding case lube and pad
Primer pocket cleaner
Sinclair seating depth tool. Rod with two stops on it. Works great.

Hornady or Sinclair headspace measuring tool. This is a tool used with the digital calipers for measuring from the base of the case to the shoulder which is the data needed to allow setting the sizing die to bump the case shoulders only 0.001" to 0.002" or so.

They make a similar looking tool for measuring from the base of the case to the Ogive of the bullet but you won't need that right away.

I use Redding and RCBS dies. I full length resize all my hunting ammo but set the die to bump the shoulders only .001" to 0.002". I have competition seating dies for my 7mmMAG, .243, and .22-250. The rest I just use the die that comes in the low price two die set (FL sizing die and ordinary seating die - frequently available for under $45.00).

Some other things to consider as you get into it:

A good chronograph is highly recommended. I use a CED and recommend it.

Copies of the reloading manuals from all the bullet manufacturers whose bullets you use. Very important: Different bullets of the same weight are not always safe with the same powder charges. The best resource for a bullet is the bullet manufacturer's manual, if that is available.

The manuals (frequently free) from powder companies and data from powder company web sites.

If you are computer savy and "technical", I highly recommend QuickLoad and QuickTarget Unlimited. QuickLoad in an internal ballistics program to simulate what happens between the time the primers fires and the bullet leaves the muzzle. I've been using QuickLoad for several years and at this point loading with out using it as a reference along with the other manuals would be like driving blindfolded with someone else giving me steering directions. QuickTarget Unlimited allows the use of G7 ballistic coefficient data if you have it. Nothing to worry about not, but eventually, if you get into serious long range shooting, you will consider it.

I use BulletFlight on my iPhone as a field ballistics SW tool.

Fitch

 

[Trickymissfit]

Oh yeah! That's excellent advice. I bought a Speer #13 manual first, and studied the first 125 pages like there was going to be a test. Trust me on this, there is a "test" every time you pull the trigger on ammo you reloaded.

The Precision Reloading book is awesome, definitely get it, and read it, before making major purchases, but you will do better with it after studying the first 125 pages of the Speer manual to get a rough overall framework of the reloading process on which to hang the much more detailed information from that totally excellent book.

OK, my answer to the OP's original question:

Press:

You are talking about low volume reloading of big cases which are exactly the ammo that gives the quickest payback on the reloading investment (both in money saved and improved accuracy). The issues with those cartridges that control what press is used are resizing effort for that big brass, and ease of getting it into and out of the press. While any of the cast iron O-frame presses will work, they will be tight on size for the big cases. I don't own them, but I've used both the Forester Co-Ax and the Redding UltraMag and especially on big brass they are just plain awesome. Especially the UltraMag. I like the design of the UltraMag better, but that's just a personal preference. I use a Redding Boss for my rifles where the biggest cartridges are .30-06 Spr. and 7mm Rem. Mag. If I were going to load anything bigger (longer), I'd get an UltraMag.

Priming:

I've primed thousands of rounds using the priming tool built into my Redding Boss press. Some folks like a seperate tool. Either way works.

Powder Measurement:

You won't be doing volume reloading so I'd get a good trickler (heavy is better than light), good balance beam scale (they are pretty much all made by Ohaus and relabeled for the varius companies - I use a Ohaus 10-10 which is now sold as an RCBS 10-10 but there are other good ones out there - a good balance beam is as reliable as gravity), and a set of Lee powder scoops. Use the scoop(s) to get close, trickel to exact weight. Setting up a powder dispenser takes longer than the time it will save for low volume reloading, and you will want to weigh each charge anyway.

Other equipment I recommend because it works well for me:

6" digital caliper
Wilson case trimmer
RCBS CaseMaster

TruTool cartridge runout straightening tool (to correct eccentricity issues identified with the CaseMaster. TT-Equipment-Index

Dillon CV-750 tumbler (I wore out a Cabela's tumbler in 4 years)
Double ended hand held Case deburring tools (one regular, one tapered for VLD bullets)
Sinclair flash hole deburring tool
Dry mica neck lubricator
Redding case lube and pad
Primer pocket cleaner
Sinclair seating depth tool. Rod with two stops on it. Works great.

Hornady or Sinclair headspace measuring tool. This is a tool used with the digital calipers for measuring from the base of the case to the shoulder which is the data needed to allow setting the sizing die to bump the case shoulders only 0.001" to 0.002" or so.

They make a similar looking tool for measuring from the base of the case to the Ogive of the bullet but you won't need that right away.

I use Redding and RCBS dies. I full length resize all my hunting ammo but set the die to bump the shoulders only .001" to 0.002". I have competition seating dies for my 7mmMAG, .243, and .22-250. The rest I just use the die that comes in the low price two die set (FL sizing die and ordinary seating die - frequently available for under $45.00).

Some other things to consider as you get into it:

A good chronograph is highly recommended. I use a CED and recommend it.

Copies of the reloading manuals from all the bullet manufacturers whose bullets you use. Very important: Different bullets of the same weight are not always safe with the same powder charges. The best resource for a bullet is the bullet manufacturer's manual, if that is available.

The manuals (frequently free) from powder companies and data from powder company web sites.

If you are computer savy and "technical", I highly recommend QuickLoad and QuickTarget Unlimited. QuickLoad in an internal ballistics program to simulate what happens between the time the primers fires and the bullet leaves the muzzle. I've been using QuickLoad for several years and at this point loading with out using it as a reference along with the other manuals would be like driving blindfolded with someone else giving me steering directions. QuickTarget Unlimited allows the use of G7 ballistic coefficient data if you have it. Nothing to worry about not, but eventually, if you get into serious long range shooting, you will consider it.

I use BulletFlight on my iPhone as a field ballistics SW tool.

Fitch

aside from the idea that I like the Forster press better; we're in line with each other. One thing I would consider is getting my hands on one of the sonic cleaners (or whatever they call them). Never thought much about them till I was over at my brother inlaws (the gadgit king of this planet). He has one from Harbor Frieght, and it's identical to the Lyman for about 2/3rds the money.

The priming tool on the Co-Ax is very accurate, but lacks the feel that so many of us want. Mine will consistently seat primers at .004"-.005" under the face of the case. If you have good hands, then the Sinclair priming tool is the best. I use a K&M. Works very well, but the Sinclair seems to have a slightly better feel when seating the primer for a crush.

If you have access to a drill press, I recommend you build some loading blocks out of hard maple or even birch. I must have two dozen of them for different rounds. Mine are all setup for 20 rounds. Have made them out of everything from wood to green glass, and wood is by far the best to use.

For a powder thrower I have yet to ever find anything that is worth the price difference between a generic Lyman #55 and the others! You'll still have to trickle powder (long grain) with all the others. And you can buy the bottle adapter kit and drop tubes and still be money ahead.

for a case runout gauge I think everybody has a valid opinion. Lately I've been using a NECO, and just love it (well not quite as much as I love the Devine Ms G). I highly recommend this unit. Buy good indicators and never look back. I'd look for an indicator that has a resolution of about 100th of a millimeter, or about .0005". With a little practice you can learn to split the lines and be fairly close to the .00025" figure. The Interrapid out of Switzerland is the absolute best, and should last you a couple lifetimes. But a good 25mm micrometer (I don't know what they sell in Europe), but get one that reads in .0001" increments. I use one often that my Dad gave me, and he was a tool maker during WWII

Buy good equipment and you only pay once
gary

 

[flashhole]

I'll put in a second vote on the Ultramag over the Forster. I had a Co-Ax, nice press, but it is not well suited to big long cases. I got tired of pinching my fingers loading 300 WM and sold it. The Ultramag has much better ergonomics for loading large cases. I also recommend the Lee Classic Cast (single stage or turret) both are excellent and have more than adequate room for the big boomers.

 

[Trickymissfit]

I'll put in a second vote on the Ultramag over the Forster. I had a Co-Ax, nice press, but it is not well suited to big long cases. I got tired of pinching my fingers loading 300 WM and sold it. The Ultramag has much better ergonomics for loading large cases. I also recommend the Lee Classic Cast (single stage or turret) both are excellent and have more than adequate room for the big boomers.

have yet to ever pinch my fingers on any round, but something like a 22 hornet was pretty tight. To be exact I don't know of anybody that loads anything bigger than the 17's having a problem. But with something like a .380 or 9mm I can see a problem, but I do stuff like that on my RCBS Partner. I do a lot of heavy case forming and also long strait walled cases, and the others just won't cut it. The longest cases ever sized in my press were probably 50-110's. The come in at about 3.350" loaded. Just never had a problem with anything under 3.6" OAL loaded.

Forster sells a handle with a larger opening if you need it, but I still use the original one with the smaller opening sold to me in 1978. Have never had a need for the other with any die set I own.
gary