Masters of Reloading......my 300WM is not shooting good.

[Moman]

I have a 300 WM with a factory 24" Rem bbl that absolutely drove me crazy. It took a long time to get it to shoot good but eventually it came around and is pretty close to a one hole gun now. So, you will figure this out and learn a lot in the process.

Here are a few more suggestions:

Get the bbl clean as you normally do. Then swab it with the Hoppe's, gently place it muzzle down on a clean white sock for about 6 hours. Push a patch on a jag through it and see what the patch tells you. There are faster bore cleaners, but Hoppes will clean it, it just takes longer. Other good choices are: Wipeout, TM solutions, Butchs, Sweets. I have them all but can thoroughly clean a gun with Hoppes.

Find a way to check your brass lot. I use a Sinclair neck concentricity gauge. I have had bad lots of brass and have seen improvement when trying something else.
Case Gauges & Headspace Tools - Sinclair Case Neck Sorting Tool w/ Indicator

RL-22 powder is excellent in this caliber but mine wouldn't shoot it. I switched to H-4831 SC and had better results. Every gun is different. Others that did well were H-4350 and H-1000. All with Fed 215's. Start low and work up to see what yours likes.

I like stretching every bit of velocity out of my loads but in this one I kept it pretty mild. The gun only weighs 6-3/4 lbs and is used for packing. My loads only run 2950 with the 180 AB. I lose a little velocity but recoil is manageable and the accuracy is much better.

Your bases and rings are fine for now. All you are trying to do is get a good group at 100 yds. Try that bbl break in procedure, at least you'll be able to get an idea of what your bbl is doing. Fouling etc. Keep it cool when you do it.

Good post, your getting a lot of solid advice and all of us will learn from this one.

 

[Augustus]

Well Ill throw in my .02. I just finished solving an accuracy problem involving three rifles. The targets looked like clones to yours. Two of the rifles had shot very good for a long time then just went crazy. The other one is a brand new 338 Edge. All of them are customs. I wont bore you with a lot of detail but the bottom line is the brass was getting tight and my FL sizing dies would not bump the shoulders back. All three of these rifles hate tight brass. I fixed the problem by honing down the shell holders .002, this bumped the shoulders back and relieved the hated pressure. The Edge went from a 2 min. rifle to sub-half immediately. The other two are 308s and went from 1 1/2 min to shooting bugholes. You may not have fired your brass enough to be seeing this problem unless you are using a few pieces over and over. As most folks here know there are a multitude of gremlins that causes inaccuracy and somtimes can be very difficult to find. I was amused when viewing your targets because of their similarities to the ones I have been dealing with, anyway if you are using a few pcs of brass over and over and they are tight you may want to fix the problem.

 

[AtownBcat]

Well Ill throw in my .02. I just finished solving an accuracy problem involving three rifles. The targets looked like clones to yours. Two of the rifles had shot very good for a long time then just went crazy. The other one is a brand new 338 Edge. All of them are customs. I wont bore you with a lot of detail but the bottom line is the brass was getting tight and my FL sizing dies would not bump the shoulders back. All three of these rifles hate tight brass. I fixed the problem by honing down the shell holders .002, this bumped the shoulders back and relieved the hated pressure. The Edge went from a 2 min. rifle to sub-half immediately. The other two are 308s and went from 1 1/2 min to shooting bugholes. You may not have fired your brass enough to be seeing this problem unless you are using a few pieces over and over. As most folks here know there are a multitude of gremlins that causes inaccuracy and somtimes can be very difficult to find. I was amused when viewing your targets because of their similarities to the ones I have been dealing with, anyway if you are using a few pcs of brass over and over and they are tight you may want to fix the problem.

Thanks for the input..but i have not fired any of my brass twice yet. I had 100 rounds of never fired Win brass. I FL sized them(standard rcbs dies) and have not loaded anything for the 2nd time.

For WRG:
Also(i have no idea how to quote more than one post) are you suggesting that i go throught the "bbl break in" even though i have between 50-75 shots taken? I have no problem doing that ...just figured i had missed the boat on that one.

 

[WRG]

The first thing I would do is clean that barrel totally free of copper & carbon & moly. From your post I would think this will take you a while to accomplish. I would buy 60 rounds the cheapest copper jacketed bullets you could find. Bullet weight makes no difference! I would then do a proper break-in from there. When the barrel is broken in you will notice that it will clean 100 times faster than when you first started. The key is to clean it thoroughly after each round for the first three than fire 3 rounds, then clean. Fire 5 rounds and clean than 5 more and clean. Than ten rounds & clean. Another ten and clean. keep going until the copper fouling is reduced to a minimum and the groups start to tighten up. Doing a good cleaning also allows the barrel to cool very important. I use a different target for each session of bullets or you could use the 1" Shoot N C round circles to cover the holes. But you have to make sure there is no copper visable on your patch each time you clean. It's a pain in the *** but the best thing you can do if you want that barrel to last and be accurate. You may get different people here telling you here all sorts of stuff like it's not needed, but let me say this they never did a proper break-in to their barrels and I would be willing to bet their rifle can't cut holes like all mine can or anyone else who has! I don't care what material a barrel is made out of either it still needs to be "Home Registered" some barrels just take more effort than others.

I just spoke with Jesse at Bore Tech yesterday and he and I both agree that moly bullets should be avoided! The chemicals that are need to properly clean moly are just to harmful to the barrel. Also, how moly bullets work best is to let it build up on the rifling until the accuracy drops off than you have a heck of a time cleaning. That can be after 20 or after 200 rounds. I went down that ugly road and it's no fun! I will always stick to copper jacketed bullets.


WRG

 

[Fiftydriver]

From a gunsmith stand point, looking at the groups you posted, I would say the horizontal stringing is a bedding issue or uneven contact with the barrel, likely one side or the other.

If this is the problem, a proper bedding job should solve that problem.

Also, I see your shooting basically one type of bullet, the Accubond. Factory rifles can be very finicky and I have found that if a rifle is finicky, it will on average shoot best with a thinner jacketed bullet. This is because the thin jacketed bullets will "Bump Up" under pressure and seal the bore better then a hard or semi hard bullet. The base of the Accubond is solid Guilding metal so it can nut bump up much at all under pressure. Combine this with a slightly oversized bore and you could see consistancy issues.

I would try a SMK or a berger VLD bullet. If these do not shoot then I would say there is something mechanical wrong with the rifle.

Sadly, Remington considers anything 2 moa or better as just fine!!!

 

[AtownBcat]

From a gunsmith stand point, looking at the groups you posted, I would say the horizontal stringing is a bedding issue or uneven contact with the barrel, likely one side or the other.

If this is the problem, a proper bedding job should solve that problem.

Also, I see your shooting basically one type of bullet, the Accubond. Factory rifles can be very finicky and I have found that if a rifle is finicky, it will on average shoot best with a thinner jacketed bullet. This is because the thin jacketed bullets will "Bump Up" under pressure and seal the bore better then a hard or semi hard bullet. The base of the Accubond is solid Guilding metal so it can nut bump up much at all under pressure. Combine this with a slightly oversized bore and you could see consistancy issues.

I would try a SMK or a berger VLD bullet. If these do not shoot then I would say there is something mechanical wrong with the rifle.


or
Sadly, Remington considers anything 2 moa or better as just fine!!!

Is the Hornady A-max in the same boat as the Accubond or is it like the SMK's VLD's?

 

[woods]

but i have not fired any of my brass twice yet. I had 100 rounds of never fired Win brass. I FL sized them(standard rcbs dies) and have not loaded anything for the 2nd time.

There's part of your problem. The first firing for me is just a case forming exercise and I always get smaller groups by shooting cases formed to my chamber without all that new case clearance around the case in the chamber.

 

[Fiftydriver]

The A-Max jacket is right between the Berger and SMK so it would be in the same class and would be a good one to test as well.

 

[WRG]

I would have thought that the SPS would have came aluminum bedded from the factory as my M700P did. Though it may have been a poor job but highly doubt it. Nevertheless, you said you had this done. Who did the work and was he/she reputable?

However, I still feel strongly that thoroughly cleaning the rifle of all fouling is the first step to solving this mystery. Eliminate fouling from equation can only leave the remaining variables to attack. Bullet selection, case prep, headspacing, load work-up, seating depth, bedding and all others follow after that. If you eliminate these one at a time you will eventually find the culprit! Just trying to go at this willy-nilly will only complicate matters and leave you frustrated to say the least. Just one gunsmith's opinion!

 

[Fiftydriver]

The SPS is the economy line of rifle. That does not mean low quality, not no fluff. Most of them have the plain synthetic factory stock that has no bedding block. They also do not accept permanent bedding very well because of the compound of the stock.

Even an aluminum bedding block does not insure consistancy. Remember the Rem 700s are hand finished so their finish is uneven and not true, torque that onto an aluminum bedding block and the receiver will conform until its supported by the block which often imposes stesses into the receiver and bedding contact.

I have yet to see an HS precision shot not shoot better with a good skim bedding. Just because the stock has an aluminum bedding block, that does not mean it does not need to be bedded or will not have consistancy issues.

 

[AtownBcat]

I did have the action bedded...The smith is a good friend of mine and does great work...although he doesn't specialize(sp) in custom rifles he does a good job. I will say that due to the stocks construction he did most of the bedding work around the recoil lug. what do you think about this way of doing it?

I will going to a couple shops to get a better cleaner and then follow the break in as you described.(WRG)

I hope that Montana Rifleman is not correct and i just don't have a "shooter"

There have been alot of good suggestions so i'm printing these off and will try them one at a time and if i still can't get it to shoot better then.........

i'll buy some of the other bullets you suggested(fifty driver)