Masters of Reloading......my 300WM is not shooting good.

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

Hay I dont know near as much as a few of the guys who posted but I did read through everyones post. no one asked you how long you where waiting between your shots? I work my loads up at 200 yds using the ladder meathod and I fire a round every 10 min it gets kind of boring so I bring another gun to pass the time.

 

[johnnyk]

AtownBcat,
Those BR2's are a favorite of mine. Others on here claim good results from using Federal primers. I tried them years ago, and never had any luck with them and therefore haven't bought or used any in 20 years. I'm sure I could make 'em shoot if that's all I had. Another favorite of mine is the Remington 9.5 & 9.5M.
When I first got my 700P in 7mmRM I just knew I was going to shoot the 168gn VLD Berger in to itsy bitsy groups. NOT! I have tried about a dozen different powders, a half dozen primer types and every bullet depth imaginable. I even considered turning the bullet around! Dang rifle! It does not like 168gn Bergers. I have shot a whole box trying to find a good load. It will shoot the 150gn Ballistic Tip and 140gn TSX in to sub 1/2" groups most anytime I crank it up. It's not what I had envisioned for that rifle but it is what it is. I don't even like the thought of buying a box of 160gn AccuBonds for fear they won't group. Bottom line: sometimes a rifle doesn't like a particular bullet style or weight range.
For seasoning the barrel you could probably get as many different techniques and answers as you will for pet loads or reloading techniques. For a new rifle I clean after every shot for the first 10 and then after every 3 shots for the next 20. After that, usually about every 10-15 shots, depending on the bullet type or how much accuracy falls off. It's kind of a instinctive thing with me. As for solvents; I use Montana Extreme bore cleaner and copper killer. They are fast and effective. After removing carbon/copper I run a patch with a misture of Kriol and Marvel Mystery oil down the tube. I use only Nylon brushes (2 sizes smaller than the caliber I'm cleaning) with patch wrapped around it. This method works for me. JohnnyK.

 

[WRG]

ICANHITHIMMAN makes a good point the barrel needs to cool between shots.

One thing you might want to do is make absolute sure your scope is not moving. Looking again at your targets I think I see that. Only because the groups seem to move from left to right and not verticaly. As you try different charges the velocity changes which normaly makes the point of impact change on a vertical scale not the horizontal plain.

Just one more thing to consider.


WRG

 

[AtownBcat]

I waited 2-3 minutes between shots and it was about 85 out that day.

I snuck another picture in on you guys back on page 2 of this thread...please look back at it..it is a group(5 shots...looks like 4) but there is a horizontal movement to it.....what does that kind of movement tell you about what the load needs.....i feel like im really close on this one.

 

[ICANHITHIMMAN]

You need to wait at least 10 min between shoots in that kind of heat in my opnion. I have a heat gun I use for welding that I sometimes use when I am real impataint. I keep my ammo out of the sun as well.

I would let the barrel cool a bit longer and re shoot using the advice you got from the other guys.

 

[AJ Peacock]

I waited 2-3 minutes between shots and it was about 85 out that day.

I snuck another picture in on you guys back on page 2 of this thread...please look back at it..it is a group(5 shots...looks like 4) but there is a horizontal movement to it.....what does that kind of movement tell you about what the load needs.....i feel like im really close on this one.

Might be close there. Horizontal stringing can be several things. When I shoot the group, I always blame my hold. With a lightweight rifle (9lbs and less) with significant recoil, the amount of shoulder pressure and the shoulder position can cause horizontal stringing.

I'd reshoot that load 3-4 times and see what the groups look like. Shoot them over a chrony if possible. If the groups are similar, play with seating depth a little.

AJ

 

[WRG]

I think he stated he was shooting from a lead sled but even still one really needs to concentrate on sqeezing the trigger and not pulling. I know you said you were trying to eliminate the human factor but even on a lead sled your shot can pull if your anticipating the recoil. So the question is are the shoots moving left to right or right to left and are you left handed or right handed? This is a process of elimination trying to debunk a stringing problem in order to focus on what the real problem is.

If it's not you or the scope I would work the load up from min to max. Just shooting a publizied load will alomost always have a different result!

WRG

 

[woods]

thanks for the reply...but what you said actually brings up another subject that i have had a hard time wrapping my mind around...you mentioned that first you will play with the charge and get it dialed in..then play with the seating depth. Well doesnt this change the load? I mean if you seat the bullet deeper it would increase pressure right...or am i missing something?

No, actually pressure and velocity decrease with seating the bullet deeper. IOW the further from the lands you seat the lower your pressure and velocity will be.

I reload for 9 different 300 win mags and my go to loads have always used RL22 and Fed215 primers. Federal primers have almost always given better results in the rifles I reload for (over 40), sometimes the difference is dramatic and other times more subtle

You have decent groups for a rifle with less than 100 rounds through it. IME rifles will settle down and begin to shoot better after 100 rounds or so. Perhaps that is because I am zeroing in on a load the rifle likes.

Horizontal stringing is mostly due to shooter error (canting) or wind deflection.

For cleaning I use bore foam, either Wipe Out or Outers.

 

[AtownBcat]

I think he stated he was shooting from a lead sled but even still one really needs to concentrate on sqeezing the trigger and not pulling. I know you said you were trying to eliminate the human factor but even on a lead sled your shot can pull if your anticipating the recoil. So the question is are the shoots moving left to right or right to left and are you left handed or right handed? This is a process of elimination trying to debunk a stringing problem in order to focus on what the real problem is.

WRG

I was using a lead sled..but have found that the about of pressure i apply trying to controll the muzzle jump can effect POI...so i guess you are right there is no way to eliminate the human factor 100%

Im right handed....and to the best i can remember the first 3 shots were the ones inside the square...followed by the far left hit and then the far right...

 

[AtownBcat]

ICANHITHIMMAN makes a good point the barrel needs to cool between shots.

One thing you might want to do is make absolute sure your scope is not moving. Looking again at your targets I think I see that. Only because the groups seem to move from left to right and not verticaly. As you try different charges the velocity changes which normaly makes the point of impact change on a vertical scale not the horizontal plain.

Just one more thing to consider.


WRG

I have thought about the scope..everything is tight but im using standard dove-tail leupold rings and bases and i know some guys dont like this for the heaver recoil guns....i'm thinking of upgrading to a seekens rail and rings.

 

[WRG]

I would do like others have said a re-shoot the load. I would do four or five (5 shot strings) (20 -25 rounds) and compare the differences. If there is no difference and it's not you or the scope, I would work the load up from min to max. Nothing else you can do!


WRG

 

[WRG]

I would also check (with the manufacture) to see if the bullet you are using and the twist of your rifle are compadable. That bullet may just not like your rifle and there's nothing you can do about that. Some bullets have a recommended twist listed on the box or on the website.

 

[AtownBcat]

I should have started another thread about my son's 308, its getting confusing as to which load people are talking about.

the 300WM has a 1 in 10 twist so the 180-200's should be great

the 308 has a 1 in 12 so the 155-168 should be great

I wouls also like to say that this board is great and everyone is always quick to help out....thanks to everyone!!

 

[WRG]

Ya, I was only speaking of the 300wm. I reload for both which are .308 caliber but can have different twist rates. I do reload 168 gr TTSX for my 300wm and it shoots 1/8" CTC consistantly but that's my rifle and it's a Begara barrel on a T/C Encore frame a whole different beast!