Looking for help on prairie dog hunting rifles

[Reelamin]

A while ago I posted about the overpopulated, and protected, and later dearth, of dogs in S Utah. Got to thinking, if anyone knows a good area within 150 miles or so of Cedar City, please let me know or post where it is! I have a Winchester 70, post 64, with a heavy 243 barrel that really needs to get out.. A real SWAT rifle, believe it or not. I worked LAPD and after probation we were rotated to various non-patrol assignments. I got to work the jail. One day I noticed an ad for this rifle posted on a board. Bought it and was talking to the seller (this was in 1976). He was a SWAT officer and when SWAT started, in LA, they used their own rifles. In the mid-70s, the Department wanted uniformity, so purchased .308s. No longer needing the .243 he sold it. Used it at the SLA shootout, he did. I know, buy the gun, not the story, but I know he worked SWAT, so there it is. these early varmint rifles were set up with a twit's rate for lightweight bullets, so a prairie dog would be an ideal target…but I need a place to shoot!

You might get a PM and even then I would be surprised. PD shooting locations are like good big game hunting spots, and anymore we would rather give up the wife. My suggestion would be call the game biologists or farm borough in that area and ask. Then you need to get over there and start looking and asking permission yesterday. Do not....DO NOT....ignore the small run down farm/ranch looking areas. Get your toe in one location absolutely make no mistakes and soon you have a ladder to climb. They all know each other and we have been told "oh George lets you on his place huh", reply immediately "we understand you may want to check with him can we call or come back by later or another day". Another tip...don't pull in with three trucks and six shooters at dinner time.....yes people still eat dinner at specific times with their family.

 

[436]

Ok, let me give you some background on what we are doing. My son and 3 of his buddies and dads are taking our kids on a Dakota prairie dog shoot next spring for their HS senior trip.
This will be everyone's 1st trip to shooting dogs
I'm a waterfowl hunter and and a deer hunter but I do have a few rifles I can use for this trip but am looking at buying 2 more rifles dedicated for this hunt.
Here is what I have already

1. Ruger Min 14 in 223 with a 6-24-50 mid level scope. Figure its good for short range dogs
2. Ruger AR15 in 223 with a vortex strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope for medium range
3. Ruger 77 VT laminate stock, heavy barrel 223, wide forend with a 8.5-32x50 Pentax light seeker II for medium to long range. Its a tack driver

I'm looking to buy is this rifle for sure
1. Savage B Mag with laminate stock (model 96970) heavy fluted barrel in 17 WSM with same strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope.

This is where it gets tricky and I so am out of my league. with these calibers Here are my choices in a AR platform (Scopes are TBD on these guns)
1. Savage MSR RECON LRP in 224 Valkyrie, 18" barrel, 1/7 twist
2. Savage MSR Long Range in 224 Valkyrie, 22' barrel, 1/7 twist

Here are my choices in a Bolt action rifle (right hand bolt, left hand load). So its a single shot. Scopes on these guns are TBD
1. Savage 12 LRVP in 22-250, 26" barrel, 1/9 twist
2. Savage 12 LRVP in 204 Ruger, 26" barrel, 1/12 twist

Lastly, if it still exits
1. Mossberg MMR in 224 Valyrie with 1/7 twist. But I can't find it on anybodys website anymore

As I stated, I plan on taking a couple 223 that I already own and buying 2 new rifles with me. The B Mag is pretty much a done deal in 17 WSM.
Where I'm struggling is, do I buy one of new 224 Valkyrie in the Savage or other Brand AR platform or buy a Savage model 12 in either 22-250 or 204 Ruger?
This is probably a once in a lifetime hunt. Do I worry about blowing a barrel out of the 22-250? Some say you'll get 1000 -2000 rounds out before the barrel is toast.
Do I step up to the 224 Valkyrie and hope i can find ammo? They claim its supersonic out to 1300 yards. I obviously want to start shooting ASAP and figure out what each of these guns like from a ammo standpoint.
NOTE: I will be shooting factory ammo. One of the other dads is a big reloader, but not sure I'll have the time do deal with all that complexity.

In summary, I'm taking 3 .223 that I already have. And I'm pretty much sold on the 17 WSM savage BMAG, I just need something that will fill the long range gap of the 17 and 223. That will be a .224 Valkyrie, 22-250, or the 204 ruger.

Thanks for your help and understanding

If there are other guns / calibers you recommend, that's great and I'll entertain any of them, but the guns i listed above are all in stock near me and available for immediate purchase (except the Mossberg MMR PRO).
Ammo on the other hand, I'll have to buy off the net as most of the VMAX rounds are not in stock at my local stores
Thanks
Todd

3

I'm kinda thinking if you have, which you do a .223 Rem with something like a 1-12 twist for the closer Dirt Dogs, then pick up or build a .223 Rem with a 1-8 twist and 24 plus inch barrel (I'd go 26") and use 80gr bullets from Sierra or Berger for the longer ranges you'd be golden. This keeps things simple, and cross usable in some respects. My second pick would be the .17 Remington (25gr) and the .220 Swift (55gr) after that it's... 6mm time!

Side note: the .223 Rem with an 80gr bullet can reach them with accuracy out to 1k if you can hold the waterline, with that said; the wind is always going to be a problem on the plains at long range... that's when the 6mm starts looking good, but... you might want something not too hard on the barrel like the .243 Win which would be very hard on it. Good luck. Cheers
Oh yeah, don't forget to take a .22 LR

 

[Hal The Slayer]

Always loved the 221Fireball for PD"s

 

[rewiltshire]

I have two friend that I go "dog" shooting about once a month for a week each trip from spring to fall. We all all ROF's (Retired Old Farts) and I think the wives are happy to have us out of their hair. We shoot along the NE-SD border on private land. Sometimes we head over to a friend ranch in WY. Have been doing this for a long time, so over the years I have picked up / built a few rifles/pistols. We all have rimfires - 17 HMR, 17 WSM, 22 LR and 22 Mags. I have a: 17 Mark IV, 17 Remington, 204 Ruger, 223 Remington, 22-250 Remington, 6 PPC, 6mm Remington and a 260 Remington. I shoot Savages and Remingtons. My partners are shooting with similar 'collections'. We normally pick two or three for that days shooting. Most of the centerfires have sound suppressors. Also have a couple contenders pistols in 221 Fireball and 223 Remington (now that's fun shooting) that I use out to 200-250 yards. As the old saying goes "the best glass you can afford". Good scopes make life a lot easier. Scopes with serrations of some type (BCD, Mill dot) are very helpful once you learn how to use them. I reload so ammo is not my problem, but the more the merrier. I normally take about 1500 rounds for each rifle. We all belong to a rifle club with a nice range, and by spring we have our loads worked up and rifles dialed in. Early spring when the pups come out (we call them hot dogs because that's what they look like) the shooting is fast and furious. They are dumb that time of the year. As the season wears on they become a lot smarter and shots sometimes become longer. I shoot bolt action rifles, my preference, but I have friends that do just fine with AR style rifles. One rancher that lets us on his property carries one rifle, a Ruger 10-22 and he shoots dogs daily.
Best advice - take rifles that you are comfortable with and can shoot accurately. Practice before you go. Over time you will learn how to adjust to the wind. And I can pretty much guarantee it will be windy. As old John Wayne said "windage and elevation".

 

[Blueman]

Don't waste money on a B-mag. I personally don't care for AR's. I'd get a good 223 or 22-250 and go have fun, definitely won't shoot the barrel out in 1 trip (much less 10 trips)

 

[beaueel]

204 Ruger 32 gr for the dogs.
I use 40 gr for the yokes !!
Good hunting !

 

[davidu]

Ok, let me give you some background on what we are doing. My son and 3 of his buddies and dads are taking our kids on a Dakota prairie dog shoot next spring for their HS senior trip.
This will be everyone's 1st trip to shooting dogs
I'm a waterfowl hunter and and a deer hunter but I do have a few rifles I can use for this trip but am looking at buying 2 more rifles dedicated for this hunt.
Here is what I have already

1. Ruger Min 14 in 223 with a 6-24-50 mid level scope. Figure its good for short range dogs
2. Ruger AR15 in 223 with a vortex strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope for medium range
3. Ruger 77 VT laminate stock, heavy barrel 223, wide forend with a 8.5-32x50 Pentax light seeker II for medium to long range. Its a tack driver

I'm looking to buy is this rifle for sure
1. Savage B Mag with laminate stock (model 96970) heavy fluted barrel in 17 WSM with same strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope.

This is where it gets tricky and I so am out of my league. with these calibers Here are my choices in a AR platform (Scopes are TBD on these guns)
1. Savage MSR RECON LRP in 224 Valkyrie, 18" barrel, 1/7 twist
2. Savage MSR Long Range in 224 Valkyrie, 22' barrel, 1/7 twist

Here are my choices in a Bolt action rifle (right hand bolt, left hand load). So its a single shot. Scopes on these guns are TBD
1. Savage 12 LRVP in 22-250, 26" barrel, 1/9 twist
2. Savage 12 LRVP in 204 Ruger, 26" barrel, 1/12 twist

Lastly, if it still exits
1. Mossberg MMR in 224 Valyrie with 1/7 twist. But I can't find it on anybodys website anymore

As I stated, I plan on taking a couple 223 that I already own and buying 2 new rifles with me. The B Mag is pretty much a done deal in 17 WSM.
Where I'm struggling is, do I buy one of new 224 Valkyrie in the Savage or other Brand AR platform or buy a Savage model 12 in either 22-250 or 204 Ruger?
This is probably a once in a lifetime hunt. Do I worry about blowing a barrel out of the 22-250? Some say you'll get 1000 -2000 rounds out before the barrel is toast.
Do I step up to the 224 Valkyrie and hope i can find ammo? They claim its supersonic out to 1300 yards. I obviously want to start shooting ASAP and figure out what each of these guns like from a ammo standpoint.
NOTE: I will be shooting factory ammo. One of the other dads is a big reloader, but not sure I'll have the time do deal with all that complexity.

In summary, I'm taking 3 .223 that I already have. And I'm pretty much sold on the 17 WSM savage BMAG, I just need something that will fill the long range gap of the 17 and 223. That will be a .224 Valkyrie, 22-250, or the 204 ruger.

Thanks for your help and understanding

If there are other guns / calibers you recommend, that's great and I'll entertain any of them, but the guns i listed above are all in stock near me and available for immediate purchase (except the Mossberg MMR PRO).
Ammo on the other hand, I'll have to buy off the net as most of the VMAX rounds are not in stock at my local stores
Thanks
Todd

3

You all will have a blast. Many here have given good advice on rifle calibers. The .223 is the universal best all around caliber. Varmint barrels don't heat up as fast. Sounds like you don't reload so 55gr vmax is a good choice in a 8 twist barrel. After having so much fun you may decide to go every year like the rest of us. Then you will start reloading. Get a .223 with a 7 twist so you can shoot PD's to 600-700 yds using either SMK 77gr at mag length or 80.5 Berger's off the lands sweet spot.
Another poster already gave good advice on what gear to bring, but I would like to reiterate. A good swivel bench (DOA is the best), good binoculars because looking through a scope all day strains the eyes, and shooting mat if shooting prone with a bipod (your field of view will be restricted). A large umbrella with weighted stand and sand bags. A well constructed pop up tent with tie downs and more sand bags or that wind will sail them far away. Hats and sunscreen are a must, but aren't a substitute for shade. Water, water, water. Bug spray because like already said those flies bite through long pants and long sleeves. Hopefully some factory ammo will become available before you leave

 

[orkan]

10,000 prairie dogs a year. That is an average of 27 dogs a day. Do you have a day job LOL or just an obsession for killing prairie dogs?

Shooting is my day job.


The days when I pop 300 before lunch really help the numbers.

 

[davidu]

Shooting is my day job.


The days when I pop 300 before lunch really help the numbers.

Guess you hunt private or tribal. I hunted west of Chamberlain and near Kadoka this summer where there's a lot of hunting pressure. PD's stay below after a few suppressed shots. Do a lot of +900 yds shooting with 6CM to stay busy.

 

[Ward Thurman]

We used a 6mmx284 wildcat on a MD77 action with a long, heavy barrel. 100 gr bullets at about 3300 fps would vaporize dogs at 400 yards. Kinda costly shooting though. I think we were burning 48 grs of 4350 every time we touched the trigger. We sold the rifle years ago due to cost and changing priorities and I really wished we hadn't. Most accurate outfit we have ever owned.

 

[beardedbowhunter]

Really nothing is better for long range dog shootin than the 17 bmg or the 17 incinerator improved - Mach 5.5

 

[Ward Thurman]

Ok, let me give you some background on what we are doing. My son and 3 of his buddies and dads are taking our kids on a Dakota prairie dog shoot next spring for their HS senior trip.
This will be everyone's 1st trip to shooting dogs
I'm a waterfowl hunter and and a deer hunter but I do have a few rifles I can use for this trip but am looking at buying 2 more rifles dedicated for this hunt.
Here is what I have already

1. Ruger Min 14 in 223 with a 6-24-50 mid level scope. Figure its good for short range dogs
2. Ruger AR15 in 223 with a vortex strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope for medium range
3. Ruger 77 VT laminate stock, heavy barrel 223, wide forend with a 8.5-32x50 Pentax light seeker II for medium to long range. Its a tack driver

I'm looking to buy is this rifle for sure
1. Savage B Mag with laminate stock (model 96970) heavy fluted barrel in 17 WSM with same strikeforce 5-25x56 MRAD scope.

This is where it gets tricky and I so am out of my league. with these calibers Here are my choices in a AR platform (Scopes are TBD on these guns)
1. Savage MSR RECON LRP in 224 Valkyrie, 18" barrel, 1/7 twist
2. Savage MSR Long Range in 224 Valkyrie, 22' barrel, 1/7 twist

Here are my choices in a Bolt action rifle (right hand bolt, left hand load). So its a single shot. Scopes on these guns are TBD
1. Savage 12 LRVP in 22-250, 26" barrel, 1/9 twist
2. Savage 12 LRVP in 204 Ruger, 26" barrel, 1/12 twist

Lastly, if it still exits
1. Mossberg MMR in 224 Valyrie with 1/7 twist. But I can't find it on anybodys website anymore

As I stated, I plan on taking a couple 223 that I already own and buying 2 new rifles with me. The B Mag is pretty much a done deal in 17 WSM.
Where I'm struggling is, do I buy one of new 224 Valkyrie in the Savage or other Brand AR platform or buy a Savage model 12 in either 22-250 or 204 Ruger?
This is probably a once in a lifetime hunt. Do I worry about blowing a barrel out of the 22-250? Some say you'll get 1000 -2000 rounds out before the barrel is toast.
Do I step up to the 224 Valkyrie and hope i can find ammo? They claim its supersonic out to 1300 yards. I obviously want to start shooting ASAP and figure out what each of these guns like from a ammo standpoint.
NOTE: I will be shooting factory ammo. One of the other dads is a big reloader, but not sure I'll have the time do deal with all that complexity.

In summary, I'm taking 3 .223 that I already have. And I'm pretty much sold on the 17 WSM savage BMAG, I just need something that will fill the long range gap of the 17 and 223. That will be a .224 Valkyrie, 22-250, or the 204 ruger.

Thanks for your help and understanding

If there are other guns / calibers you recommend, that's great and I'll entertain any of them, but the guns i listed above are all in stock near me and available for immediate purchase (except the Mossberg MMR PRO).
Ammo on the other hand, I'll have to buy off the net as most of the VMAX rounds are not in stock at my local stores
Thanks
Todd

3

Good advice below. If you want to go past 300 yds, I recommend going above 22 cal. As the guy below says, the 22's are affected by wind a lot more than the larger calibers & heavier bullets. We have used a 243 effectively at times with 95 gr bullets. We usually load up 60 gr HP in it for the PD, but we have trouble w/ hits at the long ranges with the 60 gr HP's. Wind will be an issue if you are going to western SD. Central MT has the same challenges.

 

[cvixx]

You might get a PM and even then I would be surprised. PD shooting locations are like good big game hunting spots, and anymore we would rather give up the wife. My suggestion would be call the game biologists or farm borough in that area and ask. Then you need to get over there and start looking and asking permission yesterday. Do not....DO NOT....ignore the small run down farm/ranch looking areas. Get your toe in one location absolutely make no mistakes and soon you have a ladder to climb. They all know each other and we have been told "oh George lets you on his place huh", reply immediately "we understand you may want to check with him can we call or come back by later or another day". Another tip...don't pull in with three trucks and six shooters at dinner time.....yes people still eat dinner at specific times with their family.

I should have said a general area where it is legal. Or where C Parvidens, aka Utah prairie dog, is legal. The Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance really did us in on this matter, as they have in others.

 

[Tidus56]

I should have said a general area where it is legal. Or where C Parvidens, aka Utah prairie dog, is legal. The Southern Utah Wilderness Alliance really did us in on this matter, as they have in others.

You must live in cedar/st George area. You guys got hammered on the dogs. I assume they can still be shot on agricultural spots but I don't know.