Long range all around western rifle

[Tidus56]

If this is what this forum has been reduced to I need to find another venue. Elk aren't that tough - people that make ----poor shots on elk and see them run off start telling people they are bullet proof. You stick a berger behind the shoulder of an elk and he is dead. It doesnt matter if it is a .257 115gr or a 140gr .264 or a 140gr .277 or a 168 .284. Elk are easy to kill if you don't suck. Know your gun and your limits and shoot the right shot for the bullet you choose and they die.

I am wondering the same thing man, when did these elk get bullet proof vests? I assume most are not from the western states. It takes good shot placement, the right bullet, proper energy and it's over.
Last big bull I saw shot scored 394 and was shot at 550 with a 6.5-284 with a 140 bullet. One shot and it was over. For those who don't know that's a big elk.
Pick a round that you can handle the recoil and make great shots.

 

[Don A Parsons]

Are you saying the 338 Lazzeroni is inherently more accurate than any other round?

Yes and No. Ha

The Lazzeroni in 338 is very consistant,,, much like other cartridges,,, there's something about those heavy boolitz that seem to stay consistant...

I'm probably wrong as normal since I like to fiddle around with different grains of boolitz in the smaller cases...

What I've noticed over the years let's say...

When I shoot 165/68's the over all ft-per seconds between 10 shots is ruffly 35 ft-per seconds,,, this over all spread becomes less when I get into the 175/180 gr leads,,, 20 to 25 ft-per seconds...

It shrinks even more when I run the 200/08 gr boolitz,,, 15 to 20 ft-per seconds...

Purhaps it has something to do with the weight of the boolitz to powder charge...

Again,,, this is only my guess on what I see on the magospeed,,, I seen the same results from my magnum days,,, 300,,, 338,,, 375,,, I'm sure that this applies to small calibers that can all so shoot there maximum lead to...

The big chunks of lead if a shooter can handle the recoil,,, Heavy rifle fore sure,""" seems to get things out there with some nice consistanty,,, lots of retained energy on top of that...

The 285 VDL's are still packing about 2400 ish ft-lbs energy at the 1000 yard mark,,, the nice thing about this is the door way is still open past that 1000 yard mark incase a critter is beyond those reaches. LOL... Like I said,,, way beyond my shooting skills. Ha...

http://www.lazzeroni.com/ct_lacart.htm

My friend has had great success with this cartridge since he's harvested 2 Provincial record book Elk with it... Its not a go to pack rifle,,, but it sure makes up for its weight in accuracy...

We've been shooting it for fun at 1700 metres on a 16" gong... The smaller cartridges can tag the gong as well,,, but I'll admit that the heavy gr boolitz tag it with authority... LOL...

Its one of those cartrages that gives the operator the feeling of pure power...

This imbraces the consistency thing I guess...
About 100 MOA for the 1700 mark... It stays very constant with this dial up every time we take it out... What a fantastic shooter.

PS: And my bad since I quoted the wrong gr of boolit,,, not the 350,,, the 285 VDL that has been up graded to the 300 grain'ers

 

[simo hayha]

7rem mag. You can find ammo for it at a western hardware store.


280ai not so much
28 nosler not so much
7 wby mag not so much

 

[Humanmack]

Interesting thread. I spent a lot of time looking at all sorts of rifles at all price points just as OP probably did. Browning Hells Canyon was nice, pricey, but nice. Other Brownings were also good, with a good trigger feel. If I had gone new, .28 Nosler was where I was going and likely in Browning. Good performance across the spectrum.

Ultimately I ended up with a hand me down 7mm Rem Mag. Has good all around ballistics and is a fun build. Add to that some "heritage" and I can't go wrong. When I am finally done, it will have everything I need and likely more. Looking at most every chart and bullet combo, I am good to 800 yards "on paper" (some more, some less). No doubt I could push it farther, but my skills become the limiter.

Having said all that, 1,000 yard for elk is the way outer limits in my humble opinion. Think about what it is going to take to check your shot at 1,000 yards cross canyon (just because they run-off doesn't mean it isn't fatal..). Even 800 yards is a long way in most elk country. It also is long way for other game. Find something you shoot well and work on the "hunting" skills. If you can't stalk closer, are you really going to be able to verify whether your shot was "on target"? I have seen elk do so some amazing things after being shot at much closer distances with all sorts of bullets and calibers.

 

[.300 Dakota]

Hey everybody. So I'm looking to buy a rifle that is a good all around long range hunting rifle. Something that can reach out 1000 yards and kill am elk with confidence. But also a gun I would mind taking a pronghorn with. I'm looking to buy one stock, not build. Right now I'm looking at the browning x bolt max long range in 7mm mag. I'm looking to spend around 1100 on rifle, not including scope. I'm just looking for input on what you guys think about the browning and caliber I'm looking at, or what gun and caliber choice youd search. Also I'm thinking about a savage 110 high country in 280 Ackley. Thanks guys

Stay away from the Savage. I was already heading to this thread to tell you about the Browning X-Bolt Hell's Canyon Long Range in 28 Nosler after reading just the title in my email and before reading your post. Go with your initial thoughts, but if you're looking for a 1000yd elk, the 28 is better than the 7 Mag (and .338 Edge with 300gr Elite Hunter .814 BC is better than that!). The Long Range comes with a 1:8 twist. Nosler ABLR (I'm sure you can find some loaded by Nosler as a Custom offering) will serve you well, in the heaviest version you can find. Make sure to get the Long Range version. It is a little heavier, but still only 7 1/2 lbs or so. You can spend bank if you like and go for the McMillan version, but not necessary. Someone else recommended a 300 Ultra, and I will throw in the 300 PRC available in the Christensen Mesa or Mesa Long Range if you want to go $300 - $400 more, are better choices for elk at any range, BUT not necessary if you are confident in your 28! I'm sorry, I left out the .300 Wby. Yes, it is just as capable as the other 2. I could sit here and try to convince you why I believe the .300 Dakota may be the most consistently accurate of the lot, but I won't even try to sell this crowd on that idea. (More brass for ME!) Besides, you'd fork out $4000 to get one from Dakota if you didn't want to have one built...although I can put you with a guy who can do it in a HURRY and it be RIGHT! Ex-SOCOM officer / Army Ranger instructor turned rifle builder and civilian shooting instructor. I've had him the pieces for my latest build all of 2 weeks and he called me 3 times today (and 2 previously + emails) to go over details...how many times has anyone ever done that? This would be the .338 Edge I mentioned. I'm not going to hijack your thread, but it's not as difficult, time consuming, or expensive to build exactly what you want if you know the right people... I've done it 20 times at least, so it's much easier now than my first time for sure. Gunsmiths retire, die, quit, get arrested, etc. so you always need to know more than 1 good one. It can take years to find and cultivate the level of trust and feel for one another once that's lost. I've had all of the above ends come to gunsmiths I've used, so I know that gut-wrenching feeling when your man is no longer there. I still digress.

Think about this, but buy that darn Browning Hell's Canyon Long Range in the 28 Nosler 1:8 before it goes up again (actually, I'd locate one on the sly and wait until Browning offers the next rebate promotion. They are $ in the bank on getting you your rebate money! UNLIKE SAVAGE which won't honor theirs! Browning just ended one for 8% rebate, but I suspect they will have a summer or even Father's Day event and offer $75 - $100 or 10%, which would be better on what you're looking at! I've received 4 rebate checks from Browning in 4 tries. Zero for 1 on Savage after submitting everything they asked for, just like Browning!) This very gun we're discussing is on auction now for $1059. You get a $100 or more back on that, and you've got this thing for UNDER a G!!!

 

[FIGJAM]

Why are so many people hating on the savage? They are awesome rifles and crazy accurate, especially their new line of 110's.

 

[FIGJAM]

The OP was started talking about a 1000 yard elk gun and cartridge. Your analogies have nothing to even come close the the original post. A 32-20 under the ear will take the legs out from under them at close range. The cocktails must be tasting better than those backstraps.

Those same fundamentals apply at 1000 yards bro and it was in response to these guys claiming you have to shoot a cannon to kill an elk - most of these guys have never lived in elk country.

 

[wv270wsm]

I'm truly shocked no one mentioned the 30-378 weatherby. It's got all the get up and go you could want or need for a whoop... out west do all rifle. You can load 150 gr bullets all the way up to those monstrous 230 Berger's.

I did see mentioned one of my other favorites though the 7mm stw . If I were hell bent on shooting the .284 bullet that would be my pick for possible long range critters . It carries a little more energy.

As previously mentioned though by multiple people 1000 yards on any animal is s very long poke. And yes I know this is THE LONG RANGE HUNTING FORUM. But we as hunters should do everything in our abilities and power to give our quarry a fast and sure death if we choose to go flinging lead towards it. That is my opinion and I'm sure everyone will agree. At least with that part of it

 

[gdenys]

I've re chambered both my 700's in 28 Nosler from 7mm mag. Very happy.

 

[Don A Parsons]

Yuppers, lots of different irons to choose from to get a furry critter at distance,,, I've been lucky over the years to harvest a few at half-ish that distance with a 300,,, but it was more luck then anything...

I'm glad those days are past,,, lots of closing the gap now days...

Koodoos to those with the irons and skills beyond mine... A world of choices it seems.

 

[Bro Dave]

In your initial post you asked about a rifle / cartridge choice that "can" take an elk at 1000' not that you would and you have received mostly excellent advice. Think hard about what others have said about range and ethics the last post from WV 270 WSM and others are right on. What a 1000' yard shooter is trying to do is put a first shot, cold bore round on a 11" plate. I have shot and Range Officered (RO) several LRS and NARA events watching some of the best shooters in the west and I will confirm that kind of performance is a rare event, especially under field conditions. Practice in the range of a 1000 rounds incrementally increasing the range finding the maximum range you can keep every round in an 11' circle (cold bore) will determine your personal range limitation. Have fun.

 

[CVCOBRA1]

Having a spotter tell you your first shot is three feet left and two feet low should never be an option when you are shooting at a game animal. That first shot, cold barrel is a great example.

 

[MudRunner2005]

If you're looking for a true western hunting round, the 7mm STW (Shooting Times Westerner) is the cartridge for you.

The .28 Nosler has identical ballistics, so it would be another good choice.

 

[corsair4360]

Why are so many people hating on the savage? They are awesome rifles and crazy accurate, especially their new line of 110's.

Savage makes many changes regularly on their rifles with the "same" model that many parts are a challenge to find after you determine what you really have. Triggers are the worst. Experience speaking.