Is the .308 Win 7.62 X 51 still a Long Range Hunting Cartridge?

[FEENIX]

If the "long range" hunting game is anything deer size. According to all the folks commenting on this forum. 600 yards is "long range" and a 308 will do it.

Flame on...

LOL! For some, 200 yards is a long range. This reminds me of an Airman I took out hunting a few years ago here in MT. He was from Georgia and had only hunted on a stand and had not shot past 50 yards.

 

[LDHunter]

The 308 Winchester has killed everything from grizzly bears to the taliban. If a 308 is in the woods, anything worth a marinade is living on borrowed time.

I must agree. I've been a dyed in the wool 308 fan for 40 plus years and it's never let me down however for elk and larger game I prefer, but don't truly need, something with a bit more oomph.

As some on here have coined the expression, it's the easy button, with mountains of great ammo and bullets available pretty cheaply.

Life can be simple as a hunter or very complicated as a tinkerer when it comes to rifles and shooting.

In my world simpler is better because I prefer hunting and shooting to endless experimentation just like I prefer driving my vehicles to working on them. I leave that to the mechanics....

Just one man's opinion.

 

[Stonyman88]

And Did well!

except for when he dumped 12/13 don't remember in little stream as they crossed it, with his M1-A and star light scope

 

[johngibbs222]

30/30 long range?
Depending who you talk with the 30/30 in cartridges with cup and core bullets is at best 150 - 200 yard gun, then hornady came along with the 160 FTX and it suddenly became a 250 yard gun.
I got some advice from a european cull hunter to use Barnes 130 grain TTSX which can stretch it another 50 yards but more importantly at 100 yards and less is extremely effective.
I recently got a few boxes of Hornady 110 grain Cx and my old 94 now sports a weaver side mount and a 1x4 scope and on the range at least I can hit the 400 yard SARTS targets repeatedly. I've not used them on game yet.
here's a link to some fine reading https://leverguns.com/articles/paco/3030varmint.htm obviously penned by a 30 wcf aficianado but valid nevertheless. FWIW I tried the 100 grain speer plinkers but couldn't get on the node.
Yes I think the old girl can qualify as a LRH, not an ultra LRH but enough of a one in a 6.5 pound gun fully loaded.

 

[kpacker]

Stick with me on this. The 308 is better now than before the Creedmoor mind virus took over.

Pre Creedmoor, nobody touted the 308 as an elk cartridge. The 308 was seen, by most, as a minimum, under reasonable ranges.

Even fewer touted the 7mm-08 as an elk cartridge. A bit on the light side.

Now a 6.5 CM, (essentially, a 6.5-308 that is shortened a bit) is the greatest long range Elk killing round ever.

So … the 308 is now way more effective than it ever was since it's simply a "necked up" and lengthened 6.5 Creedmoor.

Yup. Funny bit of perspective but I like it

 

[h_1ag]

7.62x51 is the best long range cartridge, except for all of the others.

 

[PApa Black]

Not sure why you think the military and its snipers of the world stopped using the 7.62, but that is not correct. It is still the primary sniper caliber world wide. I read somewhere that socom was going to convert their semiauto snipers rifles to the needmore, but can't confirm if that is correct. If so, it's stupid. The vacation spots our Marines and spec ops troops visit, don't and will never carry a needmore. So if our boys and girls run out of ammo, good luck funding needmore rounds in Somalia, Qatar, any of the " "stans, etc. If the world went to hell tomorrow, all these guys that think all the prcs, needmores and all the other latest and supposedly greatest rounds are the best thing will either be smart and pick up an ar15 and an ar10 or other 308 and a 300 win mag or they will be fools and quickly go the way of the dodo. I'd bet the 308 has killed everything on the planet too. Unfortunately elephants, tigers, lions and rhinos included albeit illegally. Polars and grizzlies legally by Inuits, no thanks. And most everything else is just small stuff that even a needmore might take at short ranges. I love my 264 Wins and my 300 and 340 Weatherbys, but my first big game rifle was a 308 and I have and always will have several of them. I hunt with one in VA every yr. And for decades it has been a one shot deer slayer and has removed the head of many gobblers. Don't forget Carlos Hathcock hammered many many bad guys all around the 1000yd marker with them and Snipers have killed bad guys at near 1400yds with the 308. So I guess u could say it is certainly qualified to be called a long range round and is very viable if you know your limitations and respect its. As with all rifles, the shooter has to do their part. JOMO

I thought Carlos used a 30-06

 

[PApa Black]

PS: I have both and hunt with the 308. But!!! Looking at the ballistics past 700 yds the 6.5 out preforms the 308. Numbers Don't lie IMO

 

[h_1ag]

I thought Carlos used a 30-06

Hathcock understood that there is no replacement for displacement.

 

[h_1ag]

PS: I have both and hunt with the 308. But!!! Looking at the ballistics past 700 yds the 6.5 out preforms the 308. Numbers Don't lie IMO

Be careful there- lots of NATO obsessed boomers on this forum that refuse to entertain the idea that maybe a failed machine gun/semi-auto cartridge from 70 years ago might not be the most optimal cartridge for long range precision shooting in the 21st century.

 

[keith4kk]

I shoot a variety of cartridges on steel past 1000 yards, and I hunt with everyone of them. Everyone on our Club has at least 1 308 they use on a regular basis. I rate my 308 as an inside 500 yard Harvester. Never lost an animal yet, beyond 500 I go to my 300wsm. It's still alot about the shooter, have friends that won't think of passing 300 yards with any rifle.

 

[Longshotjames]

OP are we hunting or sniping? very different with a different set of requirements. Not going to pretend to have military experience but I have plenty of scope time for deer, pigs, elk, nilgai and Aoudad beyond 600yards.

It is simple for ANY caliber, look at your impact velocity. Are you above 1800fps impact? Then yes you are still in an effective and repeatable bullet expansion distance.

Nothing wrong with the 308 but its effective expansion range is shorter then a magnum launching a heavier bullet faster. Just facts
In most 308win loads I would limit myself to 500yd and below based on impact velocity. Otherwise you are poking pencil holes, may be effective on people because we are fragile but not effective for quick kills on an wild animal like Elk!

for comparison: my custom 300wm launching 225eldM at 2975fps is effective by the same 1800fps impact limit out to 1120yds in Texas near sea level and even further in Colorado at higher altitude.

So to answer your queston: yes the 308Win is viable as a Longrange hunting caliber if you watch your impact velocity to limit your distance but that is the exact same for every caliber.

There I took your bait but stand firm on my answer
James

 

[Nomad8961]

Not sure why you think the military and its snipers of the world stopped using the 7.62, but that is not correct. It is still the primary sniper caliber world wide. I read somewhere that socom was going to convert their semiauto snipers rifles to the needmore, but can't confirm if that is correct. If so, it's stupid. The vacation spots our Marines and spec ops troops visit, don't and will never carry a needmore. So if our boys and girls run out of ammo, good luck funding needmore rounds in Somalia, Qatar, any of the " "stans, etc. If the world went to hell tomorrow, all these guys that think all the prcs, needmores and all the other latest and supposedly greatest rounds are the best thing will either be smart and pick up an ar15 and an ar10 or other 308 and a 300 win mag or they will be fools and quickly go the way of the dodo. I'd bet the 308 has killed everything on the planet too. Unfortunately elephants, tigers, lions and rhinos included albeit illegally. Polars and grizzlies legally by Inuits, no thanks. And most everything else is just small stuff that even a needmore might take at short ranges. I love my 264 Wins and my 300 and 340 Weatherbys, but my first big game rifle was a 308 and I have and always will have several of them. I hunt with one in VA every yr. And for decades it has been a one shot deer slayer and has removed the head of many gobblers. Don't forget Carlos Hathcock hammered many many bad guys all around the 1000yd marker with them and Snipers have killed bad guys at near 1400yds with the 308. So I guess u could say it is certainly qualified to be called a long range round and is very viable if you know your limitations and respect its. As with all rifles, the shooter has to do their part. JOMO

Generally speaking 308 is only used by NATO countries. The rest of the world usually has 7.62x39. So running out of ammo and using your enemies ammo isn't a viable argument for the military not adopting the 6.5. That being said I'm not saying we should adopt it. I would however like to see the 5.56 go away and be replaced by a larger caliber. And wouldn't say never either, from WW2 we tossed the 30-06 in a m1 Garand ( the weapon that arguably won WW2) to the side for a 5.56 M16 when we went to Vietnam. And that choice did in fact did cost some of our men their lives.

 

[keith4kk]

OP are we hunting or sniping? very different with a different set of requirements. Not going to pretend to have military experience but I have plenty of scope time for deer, pigs, elk, nilgai and Aoudad beyond 600yards.

It is simple for ANY caliber, look at your impact velocity. Are you above 1800fps impact? Then yes you are still in an effective and repeatable bullet expansion distance.

Nothing wrong with the 308 but its effective expansion range is shorter then a magnum launching a heavier bullet faster. Just facts
In most 308win loads I would limit myself to 500yd and below based on impact velocity. Otherwise you are poking pencil holes, may be effective on people because we are fragile but not effective for quick kills on an wild animal like Elk!

for comparison: my custom 300wm launching 225eldM at 2975fps is effective by the same 1800fps impact limit out to 1120yds in Texas near sea level and even further in Colorado at higher altitude.

So to answer your queston: yes the 308Win is viable as a Longrange hunting caliber if you watch your impact velocity to limit your distance but that is the exact same for every caliber.

There I took your bait but stand firm on my answer
James

100% agree. Projectile expansion makes the most difference. Speed killes