hey im just now getting into shooting alot and i just started reloading and my personal goal is to be able to have a decent(like 10inch) pattern at 1000yards from everyone i talk to on the street my answers are all different from that very easy to do to good luck kid, i wanna buy a gun that can do it, i was looking at the sendero in 308 or 300 win mag but i also thought about the 700ss with the r5(m24) barrel i dunno what i need and whats important and what isnt. which caliber should i go with? what gun should i buy? i dont mind spending money since ill have it forever,but anyway., thats why im asking you guys-the pros
i want a gun that can go the distance
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Kevin Cram
Well-Known Member
There are alot of variables in your question. Are you looking at mainly target shooting, varmint, big game and how big and at what distances. Both calibers you mentioned are fine for some shooting disciplines but not for others. Since money is not an issue I would stay away from a factory rifle and go with a complete custom if your really looking for perfomance. What are your primary goals and uses for this rifle and we can go from there to try to giude you in the right direction.
liltank
Well-Known Member
I'm with him. There are many good quality calibers that will provide the performance you are looking for. You can go as small as 6mm up to and not stopping at .375. Application is the name of the game. Paper you want the little ones for cost effectiveness and some really easy to handle calibers.
Shooting big game you run into making sure you have enough poo at the end of the flight. Just to answer your question about the above calibers, the .308 is very versatile. It will however limit you to about 800yrds to kill deer size animals and about 1100 yrds for paper and varmints. I know because I tried hitting ground hogs at 1100yrds dropping them in like artilarey. The 300 WM will get you out to 1500 and kill deer size game to about 1000yrds properly loaded.
Good luck.
MontanaRifleman
Well-Known Member
Your Sendro platform sounds like a good option and maybe the best for a factory. You might get a tack driver out of the box? I agree with the others though, that a custom will most likely be a better LR tool. I also agree with the assessment on calibers. Depending on far you want to shoot and if you want to shoot game, the 308 is a little light for LR hunting and the 300 WM runs out of punch around 1000 yds. Here is a list of good LR hunters that will deliver a good amount of velocity and momentum down range.
7mm RUM
300 RUM
338 Rum
338 EDGE
338 Lapua
There are definitely others, but these are good basic ones. The 7mm STW is good and I would probably pick it or the 7mm Dakota over the 300 WM. They all have their advantages and disadvantages. The 7mm's have a good velocity to bullet BC ratio and are very efficient at delivering bullets down range. When you start shooting the 300 RUM and bigger, you are going to get major recoil and will probably want a brake. Their advantage of course, is that they can deliver a bigger payload and thump down range. In elk country, a 7mm RUM will deliver a 180 gr bullet about 1200-1400 yds down range with a velocity of 1800 fps and momentum of about 46 ft lbs, depending on elevation. This would probably be my limit on an elk. One of the mentioned 338's could reach a little farther, but not a lot without chancing a non opening bullet. But they would have more thump with a 300 gr bullet vs a 180 gr bullet.
That's a little over view for you - there are lot's of options and there is a ton of info and experience on this site. Read as much as you can and then go with what fits your needs.
Good shooting.
Michael Eichele
Well-Known Member
1st off, welcome!
2nd, dont listen to the guys who say "good luck kid". They are just too lazy to get out and do something amazing.
3rd, for a beginner the calibers you listed work great for 1,000 yard paper punching. I personally love the 308 for 1K paper targets. It is an exceptionaly accurate round that isnt finicky or unforgiving at all. I have tons of experiance with the 700 308 5-R model. It is my favorite rifle I have ever owned. I put a McMillan stock (HTG) on it shortly after I bought it. I have never needed to get a custom 308 because I dont believe I could improve what I have. It is by far the most accurate rifle I have owned or shot for that matter. Shooting 10" groups at 1K is not much of a challenge for the 308 provided the wind isnt too bad. Most of the 1K groups I have shot at 1K (not counting horrible wind days) have been well under the 10" mark and many have been around the 5" mark with a few going less.
Welcome again,
Michael
2nd, dont listen to the guys who say "good luck kid". They are just too lazy to get out and do something amazing.
3rd, for a beginner the calibers you listed work great for 1,000 yard paper punching. I personally love the 308 for 1K paper targets. It is an exceptionaly accurate round that isnt finicky or unforgiving at all. I have tons of experiance with the 700 308 5-R model. It is my favorite rifle I have ever owned. I put a McMillan stock (HTG) on it shortly after I bought it. I have never needed to get a custom 308 because I dont believe I could improve what I have. It is by far the most accurate rifle I have owned or shot for that matter. Shooting 10" groups at 1K is not much of a challenge for the 308 provided the wind isnt too bad. Most of the 1K groups I have shot at 1K (not counting horrible wind days) have been well under the 10" mark and many have been around the 5" mark with a few going less.
Welcome again,
Michael
liltank
Well-Known Member
Michael,
You very correct in the .308 caliber. Like I said it is very versatile and loaded properly will get you there. F class shooters have used it with great effect for years. I was just suggesting that there are some other calibers that will provide a flatter trajectory and accomplish the same results. 7mm is a very good bullet when it comes to distance shooting. Some guys really like the 6.5-284. It's all a matter of personal preferance.
I just built a 300 WSM to flatten out the trajectory to ground hogs. Plus I wanted something a little heavier for poking deer at longer range. Good stuff, and there is nothing wrong with wishing a fellow shooter good luck.
Matt, have fun doing some research. Read as much information as you can you will answer some of your own questions. Lilja has some really good information about long range hunting and shooting on there website.
Here are some of the web addresses
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART I: THE RIFLE & GEAR
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART II: OPTICS
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART III: SHOOTING
I found these to be pretty useful when trying to decide on a caliber. I settled on the 308 win. also, due to its options in bullets for that caliber.
So instead of good luck, Have fun, Be safe, Good shoot'in
You very correct in the .308 caliber. Like I said it is very versatile and loaded properly will get you there. F class shooters have used it with great effect for years. I was just suggesting that there are some other calibers that will provide a flatter trajectory and accomplish the same results. 7mm is a very good bullet when it comes to distance shooting. Some guys really like the 6.5-284. It's all a matter of personal preferance.
I just built a 300 WSM to flatten out the trajectory to ground hogs. Plus I wanted something a little heavier for poking deer at longer range. Good stuff, and there is nothing wrong with wishing a fellow shooter good luck.
Matt, have fun doing some research. Read as much information as you can you will answer some of your own questions. Lilja has some really good information about long range hunting and shooting on there website.
Here are some of the web addresses
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART I: THE RIFLE & GEAR
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART II: OPTICS
PRACTICAL LONG-RANGE RIFLE SHOOTING - PART III: SHOOTING
I found these to be pretty useful when trying to decide on a caliber. I settled on the 308 win. also, due to its options in bullets for that caliber.
So instead of good luck, Have fun, Be safe, Good shoot'in
When it comes to long range shooting I've never seen a guy at the range with a rifle he didn't at least change a little something on here or there. Your first rifle for long range is going to be your learning gun. Learning not just about long range shooting, but also about learning what you like and don't like about the rifles fit & finish.
You menioned a lot of Remingtons and I'd suggest that you also consider Savages. If you look at the 12 series and law enforcement series you will find plenty of options in a variety of calibers. I'd suggest going with the 308 just because there is so much support for it out there.
Once you get a feel for your rifle and you've been shooting for a while, then it may be time to consider a custom gun. It's kind of like turning 16 and your first car is a dodge viper without trying anything else first. When I knew I wanted to get serious about long range I called savage and made a special order for a 110fp in a different caliber, switched out the stock and I'm the only guy with my rifle. My savages factory accuracy is just as good as some of the custom guns I've seem on the range if not better. You shouldn't have to pay thousands to get a rifle shooting less than 1/2" @ 100. It's not necessary, there's nothing wrong with it, but it's just not necessary.
Learn long range shooting first and find out what you like then get into specialized guns and calibers.
You menioned a lot of Remingtons and I'd suggest that you also consider Savages. If you look at the 12 series and law enforcement series you will find plenty of options in a variety of calibers. I'd suggest going with the 308 just because there is so much support for it out there.
Once you get a feel for your rifle and you've been shooting for a while, then it may be time to consider a custom gun. It's kind of like turning 16 and your first car is a dodge viper without trying anything else first. When I knew I wanted to get serious about long range I called savage and made a special order for a 110fp in a different caliber, switched out the stock and I'm the only guy with my rifle. My savages factory accuracy is just as good as some of the custom guns I've seem on the range if not better. You shouldn't have to pay thousands to get a rifle shooting less than 1/2" @ 100. It's not necessary, there's nothing wrong with it, but it's just not necessary.
Learn long range shooting first and find out what you like then get into specialized guns and calibers.
liltank
Well-Known Member
Try the 12FV. Affordable accuracy out of the box. The accu-trigger is sweet for a factory rifle. I own a Mod 12 Low Profile in 300WSM. It started life as a .308. Teddy12 has some good advice about trying a Savage.
Try the 12FV. Affordable accuracy out of the box. The accu-trigger is sweet for a factory rifle. I own a Mod 12 Low Profile in 300WSM. It started life as a .308. Teddy12 has some good advice about trying a Savage.
I had a 12FV in 223, and a 12BVSS 223. I would love to pick up a 12 low profile 300WSM. How does that 300 WSM shoot? I've never talked to anyone that actually had one. What bullet weight works best in it?
liltank
Well-Known Member
It started out as a .308 and was reamed. I have had some problems with a tight chamber due to machining so I really haven't had a good chance to try heavier loads. I did however get it back after some polishing and headspacing adjustment. As of right now 63grns of H4350 is max w/ 210F primer. I also found that 4831SC is a max of 66grn safely. I'm trying to use Hor.l 208 A-Max. I am also trying to acomplish 2900fps out of a 26" barrel. With this new chamber I think I might make it. I know the rifle is capable of .5 or smaller. I did it all the time with the .308. I'll try and keep you up dated.
jk
jk
