Damage Inc.
Well-Known Member
Seen a lot of 1/2" rifles, not be able to hit 2 MOA targets at 400 plus….
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hunting rifle accuracy
- Thread starter 62flint
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While there will be many that will state definitive numbers when it comes to acceptable MOA a lot depends upon the game as well as distance. To begin with the rifle that shoots off the bench at 0.5 MOA is not going to be anywhere that accurate out in the field under real live conditions. I am one of those people who likes to know if the shot misses, it's my fault not the rifle, thus I somewhat agree that more than 1 MOA and the rifle is down the road if I can't get it to shot better than that. Now think about it. A 1.0 MOA rifle shooting at an Antelope at 300 yards has a very good chance of the bullet going into the kill zone all other factors equal. That same rifle shooting at that same Antelope at 800 yards now has a good chance on entirely missing the Antelope, or wounding it with a non lethal hit. Conversely can a rifle that shoots 0.5 MOA actually be that accurate out in the field? Probably not. A good shooter might be able to squeeze a 1.0 MOA or larger group off while laying prone off of their backpack. There is also the size of the animal as well as the kill zone to consider. Is the bullet flight path going to be the same on a 1000 yard range as it will be out in the mountains and fields with changing winds, light and a variety of other factors that affect the flight path of the bullet? Being realistic shooting at extreme ranges out in the real world has a lot of disadvantages over the relatively pristine conditions found on a rifle range. If you want to know how well your rifle is going to shoot under real live hunting conditions take it out into the mountains or wherever else you hunt and place some targets out at the ranges you will be shooting at. Then see how well you do hitting those targets at those ranges out in the wild. Yes, it is a challenge but most likely nobody will actually take the time to go out and try it. LOL, remember we are talking first round cold barrel (and probably hunter too) hits. In regards to the question above, what is acceptable accuracy from a bench bipod or sand bags chances are none of which you will have with you out in the field? Acceptable accuracy is the best you can shoot under the prevailing conditions at the range you will be shooting using existing equipment that allows you to place the bullet in the kill zone of the animal you are shooting at. Good Luck and Good Shooting.
Depends on how windy , how my heart rate is and other variables. We as hunters need to realize what our limitations are. And those limits will vary from day to day.
Good solid rest 10mph cross wind, target pretty much sitting still and I just didn't finish climbing a mountain. Yeah I can make a 800-1000 yard shot. Would I no.
My self imposed hunting limit is 500-600. But I like to practice and do load development way past 500 yards.
Others mileage may vary. That's just my limits
The target is a 625 yard group during seating depth testing.
Barnes 180ttsx , 73.0 g of h4831sc , nosler brass fed mag primer. Seated .200 off the lands. It's off the red dot because I was more concerned with group size than poi
The group closer to the red dot is the same load. Same day. Just .125 off the lands. And I did crank the scope over between the groups.
I do load development off a bench. With front rest , rear bag.
I practice off of bipod, cross sticks , back pack etc.
but I want to to what the rifle is capable of. So when I miss I know it's me. Not my equipment. I also short no more that 3 rounds then let the rifle cool for at least 5 minutes lots of times more.
I asked the original question because o think sometimes I am too picky with rifle accuracy.
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Damage Inc.
Well-Known Member
A rifle that shoots 1 MOA…. will keep all bullets within 4" of POA at 800. That's not enough to miss antelope vitals… let alone "miss the antelope entirely"
If your hunting rifle shoots better from the bench, than it does in the field….. then you need to spend less time at a bench, and more time in the field.
If your hunting rifle shoots better from the bench, than it does in the field….. then you need to spend less time at a bench, and more time in the field.
memtb
Well-Known Member
Well stated Teri Anne! memtb
Idaho Lefty
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Yup,. Well,.. Stated, Teri Anne !
Go Buy yourself some, 10-12 Inch Dia., Steel Plates ( Approx. Size of the TRUE, NON- Wounding, Kill Zone, on Deer / Antelope ) and go shoot, in FIELD Positions,.. Sitting on Sidehills out to, 375- 450 yds, Prone to 7- 800 yards, Off Hand to, 150 yds, etc.
And also, in Mild, WINDS, like they HAVE, in the Western, Mtn and Desert, Hunting Fields ( 5 to 15 MPH ) then, come back, Guys and tell us, just how "Wonderful", You & your Rifle, "System", really,.. IS !
We'll,.. Wait,.. This should be "Good" for,.. 30 More, Pages
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With all due respect, the OP is about baseline accuracy off a bench. It is a good idea to get practice in all those positions and conditions, but that is exactly why you need your baseline accuracy. If you know what your gun does with you behind it, then you can make a decision on taking a shot or not with the distance and conditions presented. It may come as a shock to some, but many folks on this site have hunted across the west even in mountains and deserts, and some of those folks harvested game. I have seen some of them, and they and their 'systems' are pretty wonderful. Some days are 200 yard days even with a 1/4 minute gun, and there are days when the wind cooperates. I get it, by your last sentence your just trolling a bit, but dang. It's not like the folks on this site are standing at the Wally World gun counter asking the kid behind the counter for first rifle buying advice. last point, why on earth would you drag steel plates all over the mountains to shoot? There are 10" rocks or spots on rocks literally everywhere. Practice is more fun if your not humpin steel up and down the hill and vale.
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Ballistic Coefficient - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc
A-Tip®, ELD® Match, and ELD-X® Ballistic Coefficient Values Hornady originally published “800 yard”* average Ballistic Coefficient (BC) values for ELD-X and ELD Match bullets. This was done to provide the most usable BC from a trajectory prediction st...
memtb
Well-Known Member
I've got a slightly different take on bench work/shooting for the tightest groups….and accepting/assuming that the rifle is still capable of that degree of performance when off of the bench.
The load that was awesome on the bench may not be possible when shooting from the bipod, a different rear rest setup….. could alter the recoil impulse through the stock or perhaps barrel harmonics. It's not "just " the zero that can be changed, when the shooting platform is changed!
So obviously, that great bench load should be verified in/under field conditions! JMO. memtb
The load that was awesome on the bench may not be possible when shooting from the bipod, a different rear rest setup….. could alter the recoil impulse through the stock or perhaps barrel harmonics. It's not "just " the zero that can be changed, when the shooting platform is changed!
So obviously, that great bench load should be verified in/under field conditions! JMO. memtb
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Honestly I don't think you can be to picky. Personally I love to shoot and hate to reload. It's a necessary aspect for what I want to do but I do it and really don't dive to far into the weds with it.
Obviously we all want our guns / ammo to shoot as well as possible. I do feel that 1/2 MOA is acceptable for me but I won't be satisfied with it. Unless I'm in the .2's Im not satisfied but a 1/2 MOA gun is more that sufficient for what most of us are doing here. Some guys are good with 1.5 MOA and some want that BR accuracy.
To each there own so long as you understand what your systems capabilities and limitations are and don't try to surpass them on a live critter and you'll be GTG.
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Guess I would have to agree with the basic premise, but how you get to 30 is important too. For a hunting rifle most bench work is more about load development. Once you have your loads and seating figured then the bench work will give you your inherent accuracy. 30 is a pretty good number to get your rifle's dispersion number. Should it be 2 shots 15X? Or 3 shot groups 10X? 5 round groups 6X? 3 groups of 10? Maybe 2 groups of 30? Or my favorite, which is 30 rounds at 1 cold bore per day every day?
I would argue that they all have value, some more than others, but all should be measured and recorded. What I find most useful tends to vary by each rifle. To illustrate what I am talking about, all groups letting the rifle come back to ambient temp in between groups; I have one rifle that isn't worth shooting a group of 4 or more, another that the number is 5 or 6. After that their dispersion is way up there.
Using the average distance from center of the group for each group to get the number to compare, it is much lower for the first rifle with 10 groups of 3 than it is with 6 groups of 5. In fact it is more than double shooting groups of 5, growing from .2 to .75 distance to group center for 30 shots. While the second rifle the dispersion number between 10 groups of 3 or 6 groups of 5 is about half as much, it only grows from .3 to .5. If I shoot the second rifle for three groups of 10 it really opens up to .8 inches from group center measured over 30 shots.
You can bet your pay check on those 2 308s. In normal conditions at 100, they are both sub .5 MOA for the cold bore shot from the point of aim.
Ain't that great? Now what good is a hunting rifle from a bench? In the end it's cold bore shots in the field, from field set ups that fill the freezer.
So those are the 30 that matter. Take one shot a day, and only one, for a month. Do it from the same position every day no matter the conditions. increase range by 100 every day to your max range then start over. Next month use a different position, and the next month another. At the end of a year you will know what that rifle can do, and you'll know what you can do with that rifle.
memtb
Well-Known Member
Maol, a great plan, but haven't you heard…..there's a component shortage! And for some of us…..a "liquid cash" shortage! 
memtb
memtb