Hunting load development in the heat

[Mikecr]

That's good in theory but totally unacceptable in the field

It isn't theory. Keeping ammo near body temperature would work better with every gun you shoot.
If unacceptable because you think you need a magazine full of ammo to hunt, then I'll concede to that even while opposite of my beliefs.

Back to the cooler idea. This is the very worst idea ever.
The function sought in this is to reduce temperature CHANGE with handling/chambering of ammo. But you don't need to introduce condensation into your chamber, while pulling ammo that is below dewpoint temps. And loads developed from cooled ammo would be a pretty extreme departure from anything working outside of winter.

IMO, the most stable ammo condition would be a rationally heated state, above dewpoint, -to that load developed with.
If you must pull your ammo from storage, make that a storage heated to highest expected hunting temps.
Load develop with this, matching your viable use in the field. This will work in any season, with tweaking only for barrel temp POI shifts.

Now that could be a problem for you to invent your way through.
Hmmm,, heated field ammo storage....
My solution: Front Pants Pocket

Even at the range, keep ammo warm with 5 or 10 in your pocket, to be pulled one at a time for each shot.
Do the same in the field. Put what you'll need in your pocket & go.
It's easy, natural, and supporting a rule of mine that I DO NOT LOAD A SHELL UNTIL FULLY READY TO KILL SOMETHING.
This rule was so deeply integrated into my childhood hunting that all my bolt actions are, or have been, converted to single shot. All safeties removed, so that I would never consider reliance on them.
You probably think I'm overboard, but there are life events that led to theses things.
I was 12 when I learned all that I'm talking about. I'm 56 now. My contention here is that it hasn't hurt anything.

 

[memtb]

I typically go shoot at the range once a week for enjoyment and it usually involves some sort of testing because I'm only a year in to loading and I'm enjoying the learning aspect.

One thing I haven't really paid much attention to is temperature stability curves. This is for a few reasons: I'm usually just shooting at 100yds and typically don't have a set load that I regularly shoot for groups, my current acceptable range for shooting at game is short enough that ES/SD doesn't really matter, and I have been using temp stable powders.

I would like to start thinking about my load development with regard to the temperatur I may hunt in, but I don't want to limit load development to times of the year that the ambient temp is what it would be while hunting. I know many people don't do it when it's warmer than 80F outside, but it's been 90-100 here for at least the last month and it's not letting up very soon.

I have a couple of ideas to mitigate any outside temperature influence and am wondering what other people do.

1. Use a small cooler with ice packs to store my rounds in at the range with my multimeter's temperature probe inside the cooler. (I currently keep them in my office at work until I go to the range and then keep them somewhat insulated in my bag until I'm ready to shoot each cartridge)
2. Use ice water and a towel to keep my barrel and chamber as cool as possible between shots (I currently do this every other shot so I can get 20-25 rounds done in the heat a little faster)
3. Break the trigger within 15-20 seconds of loading the round into the chamber.

In doing these things, I would think that my cartridge temperature may be around 40-45F when I break the trigger. This would be a much better middle ground temperature to develop loads in and not have to worry about extrapolating temperature stability curves.

What are your thoughts on my plan? Can you poke any holes in it? What are some tricks that you use to keep it simple and effective?

I do kinda similar, only I'm blessed with large temperature variations throughout the year. Example: this morning's temperature was 52 degrees.....we will be in the low '90's this afternoon! I develop loads based upon the warmest temperatures that I am likely to experience when hunting.....as I work at near or at maximum loads! I do my load work on days at 90+ degrees. I do not want to have a high pressure situation on a hot day. Then, test velocities and groups at a few temperatures going down through the temperature ranges I would experience on my hunting trip! I then, do my zero at the temperatures expected on the hunt....assuming a small velocity change from my "zero temperature"! However, with my self-imposed limit of 600 yards, the velocity differences are not as critical as longer range shooting!

I use one rifle/one load for all of my hunting. I may use my rifle during the summer for a few shots at Prairie Dogs or the occasional coyote....and use the same combo elk hunting at 0 F. During our deer/elk seasons, we may see morning lows in single digits with daytime highs in the mid to upper 40's! Sometimes you just have to compromise! memtb

 

[ButterBean]

It isn't theory. Keeping ammo near body temperature would work better with every gun you shoot.
If unacceptable because you think you need a magazine full of ammo to hunt, then I'll concede to that even while opposite of my beliefs.

Back to the cooler idea. This is the very worst idea ever.
The function sought in this is to reduce temperature CHANGE with handling/chambering of ammo. But you don't need to introduce condensation into your chamber, while pulling ammo that is below dewpoint temps. And loads developed from cooled ammo would be a pretty extreme departure from anything working outside of winter.

IMO, the most stable ammo condition would be a rationally heated state, above dewpoint, -to that load developed with.
If you must pull your ammo from storage, make that a storage heated to highest expected hunting temps.
Load develop with this, matching your viable use in the field. This will work in any season, with tweaking only for barrel temp POI shifts.

Now that could be a problem for you to invent your way through.
Hmmm,, heated field ammo storage....
My solution: Front Pants Pocket

Even at the range, keep ammo warm with 5 or 10 in your pocket, to be pulled one at a time for each shot.
Do the same in the field. Put what you'll need in your pocket & go.
It's easy, natural, and supporting a rule of mine that I DO NOT LOAD A SHELL UNTIL FULLY READY TO KILL SOMETHING.
This rule was so deeply integrated into my childhood hunting that all my bolt actions are, or have been, converted to single shot. All safeties removed, so that I would never consider reliance on them.
You probably think I'm overboard, but there are life events that led to theses things.
I was 12 when I learned all that I'm talking about. I'm 56 now. My contention here is that it hasn't hurt anything.

It isn't theory. Keeping ammo near body temperature would work better with every gun you shoot.
If unacceptable because you think you need a magazine full of ammo to hunt, then I'll concede to that even while opposite of my beliefs.

Back to the cooler idea. This is the very worst idea ever.
The function sought in this is to reduce temperature CHANGE with handling/chambering of ammo. But you don't need to introduce condensation into your chamber, while pulling ammo that is below dewpoint temps. And loads developed from cooled ammo would be a pretty extreme departure from anything working outside of winter.

IMO, the most stable ammo condition would be a rationally heated state, above dewpoint, -to that load developed with.
If you must pull your ammo from storage, make that a storage heated to highest expected hunting temps.
Load develop with this, matching your viable use in the field. This will work in any season, with tweaking only for barrel temp POI shifts.

Now that could be a problem for you to invent your way through.
Hmmm,, heated field ammo storage....
My solution: Front Pants Pocket

Even at the range, keep ammo warm with 5 or 10 in your pocket, to be pulled one at a time for each shot.
Do the same in the field. Put what you'll need in your pocket & go.
It's easy, natural, and supporting a rule of mine that I DO NOT LOAD A SHELL UNTIL FULLY READY TO KILL SOMETHING.
This rule was so deeply integrated into my childhood hunting that all my bolt actions are, or have been, converted to single shot. All safeties removed, so that I would never consider reliance on them.
You probably think I'm overboard, but there are life events that led to theses things.
I was 12 when I learned all that I'm talking about. I'm 56 now. My contention here is that it hasn't hurt anything.

If it works for you more power to you but carrying an unloaded weapon Of any sort whether you hunting in combat or in self defense Situation is useless, your advice will eventually get someone hurt or killed, I'm not try to undermine you or start a peeing match but that is terrible advice to give to anyone, once again if it works for you that's fine but please don't put someone else's welfeare in jeopardy over your methods

 

[Mikecr]

LONG RANGE HUNTING

 

[Dmagna]

I use my trucks ac and a chamber chiller for the barrel and keep my test rounds in the truck when it's super hot

 

[TRG65]

I tried the cooler thing a few weeks ago. As stressed before it introduces condensation and can turn a warm load into a problem. I worked up a load with my AR10 which was fine and great accuracy. I put the rounds in a cooler because I wanted to go to the range after shooting a match and didn't want them super hot from sitting in the truck. When I shot pulled them out and shot I got crazy pressure signs and popped primers. It was very hot and humid that day. Took the load out a week later and it was back to fine, but a bit warm.

 

[ButterBean]

LONG RANGE HUNTING

I assumed Long Range Hunting is a given here so I apologize, I should have put that first,I still stand by my comments, a unloaded weapon with nothing in the magazines is a club, nothing more, I would hate to stumble upon a Bear while elk hunting with all of my rounds in my pants pocket staying warm

 

[Dirtrax]

I assumed Long Range Hunting is a given here so I apologize, I should have put that first,I still stand by my comments, a unloaded weapon with nothing in the magazines is a club, nothing more, I would hate to stumble upon a Bear while elk hunting with all of my rounds in my pants pocket staying warm

I have several times and you would be surprised how quickly a round makes its way to the chamber. These are black bears not brown in which case I would change tactics to accommodate the real, as opposed to imagined threat. I rarely (never) encounter radicals in the field. If I did my tactics would accommodate that as well. Cheers!

 

[Dirtrax]

ButterBean...regarding your comment about combat;
If you served I extend my undying gratitude. If not I'll revert to "imagined".
Regardless I respect your opinion. I ask the same in return.

 

[ButterBean]

ButterBean...regarding your comment about combat;
If you served I extend my undying gratitude. If not I'll revert to "imagined".
Regardless I respect your opinion. I ask the same in return.

No gratitude needed, it was my honor that this country let me serve and I do respect your opinion

 

[ButterBean]

I also want to extend my sincerest apologies to the OP I did not mean for my comments to side track your thread , as I said before if you look at the powder temp chart put up earlier and do the math, temp change can be easily compensated for we all want and strive for accuracy but we are hunting, not benchrest shooters counting points, we want to make clean humane kills at distance the difference in my 308 at 800 from 20 degrees to 90 degrees is .4 Mil, as I said it's there and needs to be accounted for but it's not near as drastic as it's made out to be, once again all apologies
Bean

 

[Calvin45]

The cooler idea is terrible. You'll be coating every round with condensation and never practical in the field.
Instead, keep your rounds loose in your front pants pocket, all year round. Load develop like this. Pull them from your pocket one at a time to shoot.
Thats powder problem solved, but the barrel still needs cold bore development for each hunting temp range. Cold mid high

That's what I end up doing half the time but it's never on purpose. Sometimes a fella doesn't realize how accidentally brilliant they are . Especially when he accidentally sends his ammunition through the washing machine along with his wallet...

 

[Calvin45]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What BoomFlop said, Way to many variables other than the ammo, Don't worry yourself to much with this as it's been proven time and again not to be near as critical as you would think, I'm not saying it's to be ignored but in most cases can be accounted with very slight hold adjustments and muscle memory

As far as external and terminal ballistics yes, it doesn't make that huge a difference. Internal ballistics Can be another story. I think it's best for op to keep doing what he's doing. Work up max loads in the hottest conditions you'll work with. No nasty surprises later. Not that a big temp jump would make a round dangerous but I have personally experienced hot loads in my 270 with Rl22 (when I was a rookie at this) that functioned flawlessly with no pressure signs worked up in January (between -20 and -35 celcius, Saskatchewan) make the same rifles bolt very sticky indeed in June (generally between +20 and +30 celcius). I know where I live sees way bigger temperature variations than most places but it applies all around - so to the OP...just keep doing what you're doing. Better to find the limit in the heat than in the cold.

 

[Wolf01]

I typically go shoot at the range once a week for enjoyment and it usually involves some sort of testing because I'm only a year in to loading and I'm enjoying the learning aspect.

One thing I haven't really paid much attention to is temperature stability curves. This is for a few reasons: I'm usually just shooting at 100yds and typically don't have a set load that I regularly shoot for groups, my current acceptable range for shooting at game is short enough that ES/SD doesn't really matter, and I have been using temp stable powders.

I would like to start thinking about my load development with regard to the temperatures I may hunt in, but I don't want to limit load development to times of the year that the ambient temp is what it would be while hunting. I know many people don't do it when it's warmer than 80F outside, but it's been 90-100 here for at least the last month and it's not letting up very soon.

I have a couple of ideas to mitigate any outside temperature influence and am wondering what other people do.

1. Use a small cooler with ice packs to store my rounds in at the range with my multimeter's temperature probe inside the cooler. (I currently keep them in my office at work until I go to the range and then keep them somewhat insulated in my bag until I'm ready to shoot each cartridge)
2. Use ice water and a towel to keep my barrel and chamber as cool as possible between shots (I currently do this every other shot so I can get 20-25 rounds done in the heat a little faster)
3. Break the trigger within 15-20 seconds of loading the round into the chamber.

In doing these things, I would think that my cartridge temperature may be around 40-45F when I break the trigger. This would be a much better middle ground temperature to develop loads in and not have to worry about extrapolating temperature stability curves.

What are your thoughts on my plan? Can you poke any holes in it? What are some tricks that you use to keep it simple and effective?

While I am just starting in reloading my self, I also used to shoot as a job. We must assume cold bore and follow up shots ie different targets, would not allow custom ac for ammo. I'm by no means a pro but ambient is ambient is ambient. If all it is is range shooting 100 percent, then sure. Would be fun to see how it works. Love to see data on a cool set up and follow threw.